Repatriating a UK registered van with no MOT

[Lizbiebrowne]

There's a motorhome I'm interested in buying in Portugal. It's UK registered with an expired MOT and no road tax. How would I get it back to the UK? I understand that once I'm in the UK I can legally drive it untaxed and without a MOT to a testing station for a pre-booked appointment but can it be legally driven to Santander or Bilboa for the ferry home?

 

[Puddleduck]

Getting the insurance would not be an issue given it is already UK registered. However, in the unfortunate event of a claim you would probably find your cover to be invalid as every insurer I have every used has an exception clause which along with "must have a valid license to drive" also has "must have a valid MoT" As others have said you would need to low load it to the UK or ask the seller to get it to the port for you.

I just checked my insurance for both van and car. One is with Direct Line and the other underwritten by Aviva.

MoT not mentioned in either just that the vehicles have to be roadworthy.

 

[Emmit]

I'll post this as an addition rather than 'Edit' my last post.

Imagine if you will that you've tried to pull a fast one and drive it miles to get around the Law.
You get stopped and they, the Authorities, give it a Test where you are stopped and they 'find' a serious fault.
The vehicle cannot be taken away, (that part of MOT Legislation has changed) and you're left, miles from home and quite frankly stuffed <<<(legal term)

 

[Bolti]

There are a fair few insurance company's working out of Gibraltar that insure English plated vehicles to drive in Spain. Abbygate, Ibex give them a ring and see what they say.

 

[mikebeaches]

Lizbiebrowne has contacted me directly about recovering our van three years ago (TODAY, by coincidence), but for anybody else interested:

We paid to get our van repatriated from Alicante during the pandemic - long story.

It cost quite a lot, but from our perspective it worked well and was dealt with professionally. After much research the company we used was S G Haulage from Lincoln https://www.sghaulageltd.co.uk/

Our van is a PVC (6.4m) and the attached pic shows it on the back of the transporter being delivered to our house on the outskirts of Bristol, having been collected from a storage depot in Spain. But the transport company is experienced and can handle any size vehicle.

If I remember correctly, it cost circa £1950 + VAT June 2020 - so quite expensive, but was worth it for us in the circumstances.

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[Emmit]

Re your last, there are several companies in Spain who will insure your UK registered vehicle against an address in Spain and the insurance will show on the UK Motor Insurance Database. You can get a Spanish MOT on a foreign registered vehicle by having it done against the Chassis Number. Some sleight of hand, I agree but it would get you back to the UK!

That's in Spain
What about Portugal where the vehicle is.

 

[L' Hobo]

I'll post this as an addition rather than 'Edit' my last post.

Imagine if you will that you've tried to pull a fast one and drive it miles to get around the Law.
You get stopped and they, the Authorities, give it a Test where you are stopped and they 'find' a serious fault.
The vehicle cannot be taken away, that has changed and you're left, miles from home and quite frankly stuffed <<<(legal term)

Isn't that also a problem, if one MOT's a vehicle a long way away from home. For this reason I would always book a MOT close to home and drive it there. To my knowledge, all my vehicles are roadworthy.

 

[stewartwebr]

I just checked my insurance for both van and car. One is with Direct Line and the other underwritten by Aviva.

MoT not mentioned in either just that the vehicles have to be roadworthy.

So lets' look at worst case scenario, your vehicle is in a complete loss situation and it appears to be blame lies with you. You are potentially being prosecuted and third party is claiming substantial damages. Your insurer asks you to prove your vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your insurance. Your car is in a million bits, a large lawsuit is being persued against you. How do you demonstrate in a court of law that your vehicle is roadworthy and therefore your insurer needs to meet its obligation to cover you as per policy.
It is very easy when you hand over a current MoT...job done! If you have no MoT how do you demonstrate the vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your policy.
With a QC..sorry KC for a Mother she continually advises me that life is so much easier on the rightside of the law, it can become very dark and complex when you stray into those grey areas when things go wrong. Bottom line, have a valid MoT.

 

[Emmit]

Instead of trying to think "out of the box" without wishing to be holier than thou, I think our thoughts should be this.
You, me, the wife, anyone you know and love are driving, or God forbid walking in a road when there is an accident, collision or even worse fatality and the 'other' party is driving this vehicle, untaxed, un MOTed and uninsured, let's say 100miles from it's port of entry to the UK.
Your comments now please on this issue.
This post and that of stewartwebr crossed in the post.

 

[Nanniemate]

Instead of trying to think "out of the box" without wishing to be holier than thou, I think our thoughts should be this.
You, me, the wife, anyone you know and love are driving, or God forbid walking in a road when there is an accident, collision or even worse fatality and the 'other' party is driving this vehicle, untaxed, un MOTed and uninsured, let's say 100miles from it's port of entry to the UK.
Your comments now please on this issue.
This post and that of stewartwebr crossed in the post.

#52

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[andyman]

So lets' look at worst case scenario, your vehicle is in a complete loss situation and it appears to be blame lies with you. You are potentially being prosecuted and third party is claiming substantial damages. Your insurer asks you to prove your vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your insurance. Your car is in a million bits, a large lawsuit is being persued against you. How do you demonstrate in a court of law that your vehicle is roadworthy and therefore your insurer needs to meet its obligation to cover you as per policy.
It is very easy when you hand over a current MoT...job done! If you have no MoT how do you demonstrate the vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your policy.
With a QC..sorry KC for a Mother she continually advises me that life is so much easier on the rightside of the law, it can become very dark and complex when you stray into those grey areas when things go wrong. Bottom line, have a valid MoT.

Unfortunately an MOT does not prove your vehicle is roadworthy.
It may have been at the time of the test , but not necessary some months later.

 

[Puddleduck]

So lets' look at worst case scenario, your vehicle is in a complete loss situation and it appears to be blame lies with you. You are potentially being prosecuted and third party is claiming substantial damages. Your insurer asks you to prove your vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your insurance. Your car is in a million bits, a large lawsuit is being persued against you. How do you demonstrate in a court of law that your vehicle is roadworthy and therefore your insurer needs to meet its obligation to cover you as per policy.
It is very easy when you hand over a current MoT...job done! If you have no MoT how do you demonstrate the vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your policy.
With a QC..sorry KC for a Mother she continually advises me that life is so much easier on the rightside of the law, it can become very dark and complex when you stray into those grey areas when things go wrong. Bottom line, have a valid MoT.

I didn't say it was right to drive without a valid MOT (and personally I wouldn't) but not having an MOT doesn't automatically invalidate insurance as many appear to think. Driving without insurance is a red-line.

In the situation of the OP perhaps a local garage would give a written opinion regarding roadworthiness pointing out any major / dangerous defects? I would want to have that done before agreeing to a purchase in any case. Getting the van back to the UK I think transport is the only safe option, well it would be for me.

And I agree with your Mum that it is far better to stay well into the white / right side of the law.

 

[stewartwebr]

Unfortunately an MOT does not prove your vehicle is roadworthy.
It may have been at the time of the test , but not necessary some months later.

So how would you suggest you would prove roadworthiness of your vehicle in the event of a total loss and vehicle was unfit for examination? My interpretation would be a forensic examination of the vehicle to inspect anything which could be inspected along with my MoT to show that it had been inspected using predefined methods of testing which are prescribed to review elements which are dangerous or could degrodate to a condition over the next 12 months deeming said vehicle to become dangerous. There is however no gaurantee at MoT that futher degrodation due to lack of care and attention could bring. But a current MoT puts you in a far stronger footing than not having one.

 

[Emmit]

Unfortunately an MOT does not prove your vehicle is roadworthy.
It may have been at the time of the test , but not necessary some months later.

AGREED, BUT, Big but, it sure as hell beats whatever is in second place IE NO MOT.

 

[Linda farley]

There's a motorhome I'm interested in buying in Portugal. It's UK registered with an expired MOT and no road tax. How would I get it back to the UK? I understand that once I'm in the UK I can legally drive it untaxed and without a MOT to a testing station for a pre-booked appointment but can it be legally driven to Santander or Bilboa for the ferry home?

Has the current owner got it Insured? Maybe they could add you to their policy. One of 3,sort of solved. Or they could drive it to Santander. Tax won’t be picked up until you land or mot tbh. Insurance is your biggy and if you had an accident they won’t pay out. Do you like a gamble? I know writing this I’m unleashing the dogs of law! It needs to be an excellent van and an excellent price to bother tbh.

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[Lizbiebrowne]

So lets' look at worst case scenario, your vehicle is in a complete loss situation and it appears to be blame lies with you. You are potentially being prosecuted and third party is claiming substantial damages. Your insurer asks you to prove your vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your insurance. Your car is in a million bits, a large lawsuit is being persued against you. How do you demonstrate in a court of law that your vehicle is roadworthy and therefore your insurer needs to meet its obligation to cover you as per policy.
It is very easy when you hand over a current MoT...job done! If you have no MoT how do you demonstrate the vehicle is roadworthy as per the conditions of your policy.
With a QC..sorry KC for a Mother she continually advises me that life is so much easier on the rightside of the law, it can become very dark and complex when you stray into those grey areas when things go wrong. Bottom line, have a valid MoT.

Thanks everyone for your comments and suggestions, I understand the position a lot better now.

Yes, I think that's where I am stewartwebr and others. Driving a van without a MOT and road tax effectively means also driving without insurance. In the event of an accident, God forbid involving a fatality, the consequences are unthinkable. I'm looking at the option of having it brought back on a truck now.

 

[L' Hobo]

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[L' Hobo]

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[fat haggis]

Hire or borrow van/ trailer.

 

[Platelet]

IF, and a big IF you could borrow a set of spanish trade plates it could be done. Otherwise, I believe mikebeaches had his van repatriated just after lockdown. Not cheap as I recall

Unfortunately trade plates do not cover MOT or insurance, only road tax. Also driving a vehicle with no MOT unless pre booked for MOT would invalidate your insurance so could theoretically be impounded.

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[Widge]

I dont know what the MOT équivalent is in Portugal, but if i was going to do the same from france, i would take it for a french CT before buying, two reasons, one to discover if it has any major problems, also to show that even without an mot, that the vehicle was roadworthy for insurance purposes, as far as getting the real MOT, i would be tempted to try and get it home, if it wasn't too far.

 

[Nanniemate]

Unfortunately trade plates do not cover MOT or insurance, only road tax. Also driving a vehicle with no MOT unless pre booked for MOT would invalidate your insurance so could theoretically be impounded.

Don't forget crushed great game if you loose

 

[stevewagner]

I have a classic car "Historic Vehicle" - no tax or MOT required - it's insured

I read an article where a classic car had an accident and the insurance company wouldn’t pay out as it never had an MOT even though it didn’t need one. Their argument was that the owner couldn’t demonstrate roadworthiness of the car pre-accident.

 

[Lizbiebrowne]

Hire or borrow van/ trailer.

What sort of driving licence would I need to do that?

 

[Nanniemate]

What sort of driving licence would I need to do that?

Look on the back of your licence the categories you hold are on there. Are you competent to tow a large heavy vehicle and is the vehicle you intend to use suitable
Its not a case of hitching up.and going

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[MisterB]

Thank goodness you haven't thought of cloning the number plate to avoid being stopped as that still wouldn't help with the insurance, even if you transferred everything you own into your wife's name before you drove it so you couldn't be sure for what you don't own... That would be immoral and illegal !

 

[Nanniemate]

Thank goodness you haven't thought of cloning the number plate to avoid being stopped as that still wouldn't help with the insurance, even if you transferred everything you own into your wife's name before you drove it so you couldn't be sure for what you don't own... That would be immoral and illegal !

Had not thought of that one but its probably the best dodgy suggestion so far now the OP needs a donor plate

 

[SM0129]

Thanks everyone for your comments and suggestions, I understand the position a lot better now.

Yes, I think that's where I am stewartwebr and others. Driving a van without a MOT and road tax effectively means also driving without insurance. In the event of an accident, God forbid involving a fatality, the consequences are unthinkable. I'm looking at the option of having it brought back on a truck now.

I would investigate the cost of transporting on a truck/ trailer and make sure the purchase price reflects this- at the end of the day the seller has an asset that should be impaired by the fact it is stuck in another country.

 

[TheBig1]

To tow or transport a big van would need an HGV and the weight will likely involve the need for a tachograph and drivers hours etc. Far safer paying a professional to do the transporting if it can't be delivered

 

[Riverbankannie]

I read an article where a classic car had an accident and the insurance company wouldn’t pay out as it never had an MOT even though it didn’t need one. Their argument was that the owner couldn’t demonstrate roadworthiness of the car pre-accident.

I have been doing google searches to look for that but cannot find it, of course it just may not have been published in a magazine that has not been picked up for online reading.
We have 2 cars in that category and I do not see how one could prove road worthiness at the time of an accident. Even if it had an MOT it could be up to 12 months old.
Take a photo every time we leave home? Doesn’t really mean much.
I think it would be difficult for the insurance company to get away with not paying out, especially the specialist ones who know what they are taking on.

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[chaser]

All in all it looks to be more trouble and cost than it's worth, but it's going to be the same problem for anyone buying it , unless it's very special or very cheap it's going to end up scrap price.
Why is it there with no tax or mot.?