Payloads?

[Abacist]

The plate is the original Fiat plate. Should there not be a convertor's plate which may well give different weights and maybe a higher maximum weight e.g. Autotrail? Have you looked around the cab door surrounds when the doors are open to see if there are any more weight stickers?

 

[gus-lopez]

The plate is the original Fiat plate. Should there not be a convertor's plate which may well give different weights and maybe a higher maximum weight e.g. Autotrail? Have you looked around the cab door surrounds when the doors are open to see if there are any more weight stickers?

My converters plate is on the short upright bulkhead behind passenger seat when you open the door( mine is lhd) & has exactly the same weights& axle loads as the Fiat plate.

 

[JockandRita]

To go up to 3700kg is a paper exercise (SVTech charge £260+VAT), no changes to the van needed.
I thought about a new van, but like this one so much, going down the uprate route

Enquire with VOSA (or DVSA as they are now known), as they uprated our Hymer from 4500kgs to 5000kgs, for the pricely sum of £13.00.
We had a suspension upgrade done, and presented the EU Type approval paperwork and Engineers Report, and VOSA Swansea did the rest, including the issuing of a Vehicle Design Weight Certificate, (their decision) which is recognised by any traffic enforcement officer throughout the EU.

It's worth a shot, if it saves around £237 plus. Tandem axled MHs are charged nearer £350 by SV Tech, and all for doing "not a lot".

Cheers,

Jock.

 

[Abacist]

My Autotrail plate weights are higher than my Fiat plates and I have had SVTech upgrade them further so I have a third weight sticker from SVTech!

 

[gus-lopez]

You're right,that is the braking pressures from the load sensing valve.

Ah yes .must be the posh version as mine has a diagram of the load sensing valve & tables & how to adjust.

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[gus-lopez]

which is recognised by any traffic enforcement officer throughout the EU.

Jock.

You left out " hopefully " .

 

[Gromett]

"My all in weight which means full water and Diesel plus everything I own in the world was 3090KG. I still have 410KG to play with. Both axles were within 30KG of each other so the weight is nicely balanced. I think the solution is therefore build your own motorhome "

Not trying to be funny Gromett (ok yes I am), but what is you live in, a roller skate?

I think that most (not full timers) would expect to be able to include some of the niceties of life to go on holiday with, to have to leave the wife and kids behind because you want to take your latest toy does suggest that some motorhomes are not fit for purpose.

By the way, how and when do they weigh a vehicle during an MoT, sounds interesting.

I live in a Fiat Ducato LWB panel van conversion. It has all the luxuries of life. Full size shower, kitchen, single bed, little office area etc etc etc. Full blown central heating and large water boiler. The only luxuries that I am missing that others may want is oven/microwave etc. But I do have a twin hob.

I am fully loaded with all the tools needed to build a self build and repair it on the road. Twin Gaslow type LPG cylinders, generator, chairs and table for outside. Along with a full set of winter and summer gear. A full size desktop computer, 3 laptops, tablets, ebook reader, electric heater for when on hookup, wastehog, a decent selection of hoses and power cables... 3 80 Watt solar panels, 50 Amp battery charger, 50 Amp B2B charger, 300 watt inverter..... The list goes on and on and on

The MOT station I use has a roller thingy for testing the brakes. This takes the weight measurement of each axle. The MOT guy then does a calculation for the total mass. I saw the weights come up when it was doing the brake test and asked him. He then gave me the axle weights and total weight. I asked him how accurate and he said it should be spot on.

The manufacturer does give a basic dry weight for the motorhome when it leaves the factory. But people add so much stuff to them and even dealers add extras which can mess up the payload. There is also some small variation due to natural material weight variations of the build material. For instance I know that if you measure two 18mm sheets of ply there will be difference in weight of up to 400g. The same will happen with mdf if the top sheet for example has been exposed to the air longer than a sheet further down the stack. In a full motorhome I wouldn't imagine this difference would be a huge number but it would be enough to mean giving an accurate figure for each and every motorhome would mean weighing each one as it leaves the factory.

My only suggestion would be for dealers to weigh each motorhome and add this information to the price sticker in the windscreen. An idea for a new EU regulation?

 

[Judge Mental]

Dover Harbour board Police are a private force working for the managing director and board of directors, they should have to call a REAL policeman if they suspect you of a crime. They have a very dubious right of arrest and have the level of authority as a special, any prosecution should be by Kent Police. They can start the job and be POLICE officer the next day.The purpose of them was to open and close the barriers originally. Some of them really fancy themselves in Town driving around with their flash vans with blue light on the roof.

Jobsworths eh....dont you just love em

 

[Lenny HB]

Enquire with VOSA (or DVSA as they are now known), as they uprated our Hymer from 4500kgs to 5000kgs, for the pricely sum of £13.00.
We had a suspension upgrade done, and presented the EU Type approval paperwork and Engineers Report, and VOSA Swansea did the rest, including the issuing of a Vehicle Design Weight Certificate, (their decision) which is recognised by any traffic enforcement officer throughout the EU.

It's worth a shot, if it saves around £237 plus. Tandem axled MHs are charged nearer £350 by SV Tech, and all for doing "not a lot".

Cheers,

Jock.

Do you have any links can't find any info on Gov website?

 

[mentaliss]

Dover Harbour board Police are a private force working for the managing director and board of directors, they should have to call a REAL policeman if they suspect you of a crime. They have a very dubious right of arrest and have the level of authority as a special, any prosecution should be by Kent Police. They can start the job and be POLICE officer the next day.The purpose of them was to open and close the barriers originally. Some of them really fancy themselves in Town driving around with their flash vans with blue light on the roof.

______________________________________________
And you know this for certain????? that they have no right of arrest...how about a 'Citizen's right of arrest' ....

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[JockandRita]

Do you have any links can't find any info on Gov website?

Sorry Lenny,

I visited my local VOSA testing station, presented my evidence and spoke to one of their enforcement officers/inspectors. He sorted it out after phoning London, then Swansea for confirmation. It was all done by post after that.

HTH,

Jock.

 

[mentaliss]

"My all in weight which means full water and Diesel plus everything I own in the world was 3090KG. I still have 410KG to play with. Both axles were within 30KG of each other so the weight is nicely balanced. I think the solution is therefore build your own motorhome "

Not trying to be funny Gromett (ok yes I am), but what is you live in, a roller skate?

I think that most (not full timers) would expect to be able to include some of the niceties of life to go on holiday with, to have to leave the wife and kids behind because you want to take your latest toy does suggest that some motorhomes are not fit for purpose.

By the way, how and when do they weigh a vehicle during an MoT, sounds interesting.

Interesting Topic...however if I was to tell you that whilst in spain last Sept' October I took the trouble to ask many Brits on different camp sites if they knew what the weight of their van was whilst touring as we were.....and more importantly what tyre pressures they applied against the weight of their vehicle.....wait for it...only two motorhome'rs out of twenty one knew what the wweight of their van was and adjusted the

Looking at a few used A Class motorhome payloads for up to 3.5 t it appears as though even shorter vehicles around 6m don't have too much capacity, anywhere between say 350 - 450 kgs for those with Alko lightweight chassis.

It's not always clear what the manufacturers net weight figures are based on either. Is there a set nominal/regulated additional weight added to the basic vehicle totally empty, say 200 or 300 kgs with 2 persons with average luggage some water and fuel in the van, or is it a free for all with each manufacturer allowed to include or exclude whatever they wish in which case there would be no comparison between manufacturers and models?

______________________________________________
It may not be relevant within the context of your topic but its the probably the most singularly important issue and quite disturbing when payload topic's are posted.....
for instant, whilst in spain last Sept' October I took the trouble to ask many Brits on different camp sites if they knew what the weight of their van was whilst touring ....and more importantly what tyre pressures they applied against the weight of their vehicle.....wait for it...only two motorhome'rs out of twenty one knew what the weight of their van was and adjusted the tyre pressures accordingly

 

[gibbon]

My Autotrail plate weights are higher than my Fiat plates and I have had SVTech upgrade them further so I have a third weight sticker from SVTech!

My 2000 vintage Autotrail had no Autotrail weight plate at all!
So the the previous owner had been driving all over Europe with just the fiat plate stating 3200 kg gross weight ! He assumed he was ok to weigh up to 3400 kg.
I went the SvTech route to put it to 3500 kg with no mods, expensive but worth it for peace of mind.
Autotrails response when I asked them to supply a plate was " Your 14 year old vehicle predates this company sir".
Says it all doesn't it.

 

[Judge Mental]

Interesting Topic...however if I was to tell you that whilst in spain last Sept' October I took the trouble to ask many Brits on different camp sites if they knew what the weight of their van was whilst touring as we were.....and more importantly what tyre pressures they applied against the weight of their vehicle.....wait for it...only two motorhome'rs out of twenty one knew what the wweight of their van was and adjusted the

______________________________________________
It may not be relevant within the context of your topic but its the probably the most singularly important issue and quite disturbing when payload topic's are posted.....
for instant, whilst in spain last Sept' October I took the trouble to ask many Brits on different camp sites if they knew what the weight of their van was whilst touring ....and more importantly what tyre pressures they applied against the weight of their vehicle.....wait for it...only two motorhome'rs out of twenty one knew what the weight of their van was and adjusted the tyre pressures accordingly

I am surprised that you were surprised to be honest....their ignorence is bliss springs to mind...

Wouldn't mind so much but this ignorance a dangerous menace on the road, and a threat to the rest of us

Senario: here you are happily driving along, overweight, wrong tyre pressures, take an unfamiliar sharp bend , lose control, mount pavement and take out some pedestrians at a bus stop..

Think this dont happen? Speaking to a cyclist a few days ago in a cafe. And a group he was cycling with were hit by a truck which killed two outright (a married couple), truck carrered on and killed the driver of a car coming the other way, ironically the cause of this carnage survived....But has to live with it IF he has a conscious

Once you have your individual axle weights you can go on manafacturers website and get accurate tyre ptesure for your vehicle. Ride on my latest camper was transformed by doing this

 

[gus-lopez]

[QUOTE="Judgemental, post: 1380555, member: 8272"
Senario: here you are happily driving along, overweight, wrong tyre pressures, take an unfamiliar sharp bend , lose control, mount pavement and take out some pedestrians at a bus stop..

Think this dont happen? Speaking to a cyclist a few days ago in a cafe. And a group he was cycling with were hit by a truck which killed two outright (a married couple), truck carrered on and killed the driver of a car coming the other way, ironically the cause of this carnage survived....But has to live with it IF he has a conscious

[/QUOTE]
But what was the cause of the accident ?

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[Judge Mental]

All I know is vehicle plowed into pair of cyclists, at tail end of group, hit a ditch, carered across the road and hit car coming the other way? Survived and killed 3

As for any other info can't help I'm afraid

Canadian chap that relayed this. Flew out to meet the victims family's soon after as they wanted to know how their parents died. This is serious stuff....you only know when in the thick of it..

 

[GWAYGWAY]

______________________________________________
And you know this for certain????? that they have no right of arrest...how about a 'Citizen's right of arrest' ....

Treated as Special constables but have to go through the Kent Force for legitimacy.

 

[gus-lopez]

Treated as Special constables but have to go through the Kent Force for legitimacy.

I thought that after they shut the Dover arresting suite which caused the problem that they couldn't go Canterbury (?) as over the " 1 mile" radius , that a new law was introduced to allow them to work under the umbrella of the local force , Kent, as long as the force agreed to it ? I'm probably not right or have mixed up something else ! lol

 

[StitchesnFluff]

A need to weigh individual items on packing I think

 

[Judge Mental]

A need to weigh individual items on packing I think

That don't work as we'll as a weighbridge visit as you can't " guess " if axle weights are reached or how loads distributed.

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[StitchesnFluff]

Good deal of commonse involved too.

 

[Judge Mental]

common sense an unknown variable, no comparison with concrete evidence. e.g. a weighbridge..Seem to remember we have been here before

 

[Viennese]

Useful article here
Broken Link Removed

If you have the August 2014 MMM that is very useful about tyres.

 

[StitchesnFluff]

thats a good article

 

[gus-lopez]

I went to a certified weigh bridge yesterday after emptying the van.
Only things on it different to manufacture are an awning , 2 small solar panels & a biked rack.
water tank less than half full & diesel the same .
So it weighs 2220kgs. Good you might think until you realise that the Pma is 2350kgs .lol
I even double-checked by going in to my local builders & weighing it there ; exactly the same.
So we have 130 kgs & that is with me standing looking at it.
So there's another 85kgs gone + 55 for the missus when she is in it , so we are overloaded without food, clothes, tools,etc.
@Jaws My 'tools'& 'spares' came to 185kgs.
Additionally here in Spain the amount of people that can legally travel in it is on the log book.
Mine says 4 ??????? Even the boss of the testing station raised his eyebrows at that. I realised in the UK that there was a problem with weight. I.E. you couldn't have any. So I'd already discussed it with the itv man & basically there isn't much that can be done about it.
My Fiat plate shows
2350kgs
3750kgs
1300kgs......axle 1
1360kgs..... axle 2

converters plate shows
2350kgs
3300kgs
1300kgs.......axle 1
1360kgs.......axle 2
Can't believe that the 450kgs reduction in train weight was meant to account for the conversion.
No where does it state unladen weight except on the reg. document @ 1780kgs. I assume Fiat must supply them that but what I cannot believe is if that is the unladen weight of the chassis cab before conversion there is no way that the conversion only weighs in at around 450kgs ?
No idea where to go from here ? lol

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[Paddywack]

No idea where to go from here ? lol

Jail?

 

[Lenny HB]

The gross weight & axle weights are incredibly low, are you a member or know of an owners club that has similar vans so you could find out if any are plated to higher weights. Axle limit could be just down to tyre size and fitting wider tyres with a higher load index could help there but won't help with the gross.
Could be worth contacting Link Removedthey may be able to advise what can be done.

 

[Forestboy]

All motorhones should be supplied with a dated weighbridge ticket in my opinion plus a inventory of what was on board when weighed.
Why anyone would buy a motorhome and not know the exact payload us beyond me.
For the sake of a tenner you get it weighed before you part with thousands of pounds.
If the seller wont let you weigh it go elsewhere its not as if theres a shortage of motorhomes for sale.
Sorry but I just dont get it.

 

[gus-lopez]

The gross weight & axle weights are incredibly low, are you a member or know of an owners club that has similar vans so you could find out if any are plated to higher weights. Axle limit could be just down to tyre size and fitting wider tyres with a higher load index could help there but won't help with the gross.
Could be worth contacting Link Removedthey may be able to advise what can be done.

I'm in Spain. The chances of replating at higher weight like you do in the UK as a paper exercise was met with incredulity , when I mentioned it.
With regards to the weights there were 4 models in Fiat/Citroen/Peugeot guise. A 1 tonne; 1,3T ,1,4t & a 1,8T
The 1,8 combined with UL equals the 3,5T max model.
It would appear mine is the 1T & is why the axle weighs are at that level.
The vehicle is not over on either axle even when overloaded at 2600kgs .
All axles are the same but the models with greatest payload use 16" wheels/tyres. Not a problem changing to them as they are a homologated option already listed on my vehicle details. By all accounts & inquiring /physically looking & checking numbers etc; all axles are the same.
Next time I am in town I will be seeing the Gestoria as to whether there IS a way to uprate it but I don't think it will be able to be done or it will be financially prohibitive.

Jail?

lol It isn't a problem here.

Actually after I emptied it upon returning from the UK the van was/is exceedingly light. Like driving a go -kart.
Emptying it completely yesterday turned it into a
" not very enjoyable to drive at all" experience.
It also sits remarkably nose down; like someone has over rated the rear springs ?

 

[gus-lopez]

All motorhones should be supplied with a dated weighbridge ticket in my opinion plus a inventory of what was on board when weighed.
Why anyone would buy a motorhome and not know the exact payload us beyond me.
For the sake of a tenner you get it weighed before you part with thousands of pounds.
If the seller wont let you weigh it go elsewhere its not as if theres a shortage of motorhomes for sale.
Sorry but I just dont get it.

If they did that no one would buy as most have no real payload .
If I fill mine full of diesel & get in it's overloaded.
I'll have to sell it to one of the people who keep knocking & asking if I want to sell !

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