Payload - yet again I'm afraid! Where's it gone?!

[Joie de vivre]

Hi folks.
Planning our sea kayaking trip to Norway in our Globestar 640 DK 6.3m van. Should have 550kg payload. We've loaded our gear, except for daily clothing, food, toiletries, computer, sat nav, cover for bikes. We deliberately filled up water tank (supposedly 100 l but gauge says 75%), filled up gas and diesel - for worst case scenario. On weighbridge we are 3680kg with 2 people.
I am surprised by this.

Question: Is an automatic Comfortmatic gearbox heavier than a manual? it's a 2.3 150bhp.
Have attached photos of brochure and plate on drivers door. Any comments or clarification about the plate welcome.

Question: how on earth do folks manage with electric bikes? ours are standard MTB at 30kg for the pair

Snag, my husband just turned 70, so can't drive if we up rate the van to 4000kg?

Thanks

 

[Joie de vivre]

Agree. Some years ago my GP surgery wanted almost that much. And then it took a long time for my licence to come back because they said more than strictly needed to be said and the DVLA had to wait for the qualified people to read/sign off on what had been said.

Next time D4D at a fraction of the cost, and plain sailing.

What do you mean by D4D please? Can we get round using a GP surgery?

 

[Phill D]

If we up-plate to 3850kg or whatever that cut off is, would my husband still need a C1?

yes, to drive anything over 3500 a C1 is required

 

[pappajohn]

And yes, a autobox is heavier than a manual.

A comfortmatic is a standard manual gearbox.....it's the servos and actuators which add the weight outside the box.
Nitpicking!

 

[PaulW2]

If we up-plate to 3850kg or whatever that cut off is, would my husband still need a C1?

Yes

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[pappajohn]

What do you mean by D4D please? Can we get round using a GP surgery?

D4D is a medical group specialising in driving licence medicals and far cheaper than your GP

 

[davidroxburgh]

What do you mean by D4D please? Can we get round using a GP surgery?

D4Drivers - but abbreviated. They also had a code that reduced the cost to £40 rather than £50 and way below £140! Do a web search! Good luck

 

[Minxy]

If we up-plate to 3850kg or whatever that cut off is, would my husband still need a C1?

Yes, he can't drive a vehicle registered over 3500kg I'm afraid. You should be able to go to 4250kg, possibly 4500kg without any mods so might as well get as much as you can as it doesn't make any difference.

 

[Minxy]

What do you mean by D4D please? Can we get round using a GP surgery?

HGV medicals - what you need to know - D4Drivers

You probably have questions about what’s required to complete a D4Drivers medical and we have some answers which we hope you'll find useful.

d4drivers.uk

Do a search for possible voucher codes, I just did that and came up with this, no idea if they work or if there are others, but there might be.

Broken Link Removed

 

[the1andonly]

A comfortmatic is a standard manual gearbox.....it's the servos and actuators which add the weight outside the box.
Nitpicking!

Not a standard Manual Gearbox as fitted to the 130 but an uprated (heavier ) box fitted to 130 comformatics and std 150,180. Nitpicking, pedantic, accurate?

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[Joie de vivre]

A comfortmatic is a standard manual gearbox.....it's the servos and actuators which add the weight outside the box.
Nitpicking!

Ah yes, thanks

 

[Joie de vivre]

HGV medicals - what you need to know - D4Drivers

You probably have questions about what’s required to complete a D4Drivers medical and we have some answers which we hope you'll find useful.

d4drivers.uk

Do a search for possible voucher codes, I just did that and came up with this, no idea if they work or if there are others, but there might be.

Broken Link Removed

Thank you, will have a look.

 

[tonyidle]

Thank you, will have a look.

If you have no serious health issues a D4D medical takes no more than 15 minutes. Asking questions, eyesight test, blood pressure. That's it.

 

[Joie de vivre]

If you have no serious health issues a D4D medical takes no more than 15 minutes. Asking questions, eyesight test, blood pressure. That's it.

Sounds great. Have discovered there are possibilities to use them up our way! Will try that route and speak to our insurers. Thank you.

 

[Themselves]

Do check as £140 sounds much more than D4Drivers?

My local quack wanted £150 plus extra for the sight test. D4D did both for £55.

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[dalspa]

I’ve got my D4D appointment on Sunday at my nearest location, only booked a week ago. Their appointment system is very straightforward and you can fill in the boxes and it will tell you soonest date available. Also fee is £55 but if you put DRIVER10 in the voucher box the fee payable becomes £45! Used a GP last time (3 years ago) and was charged £90 and £20 with Specsavers. Once you have paid you get a confirmation email which lists everything that you need to take along.

 

[Harrogate motorhomer]

To do what you want will need a up plate. We have basically same van & have to travel with minimum water & don’t carry anything excessively heavy such as e-bikes to stay close to the limit. Not much of a problem as we always use sites. Been thinking about up plating but it does have it’s downsides. The Comformatic adds 150kg afaik.

 

[Soycd]

Manufacturers weights are with one occupant (driver @ 75kg), empty water and 75% (I think)fuel. So with a pax and full tanks you must be adding about 200-250kg straight away.

Not all manufactures are the same. MIRO for an Adria 640 SLB is driver (75kg) 90% fuel, 20% water, 16kg gas cylinder, tool kit and a mains cable.

 

[FrankNicklin]

Every van should be properly weighed either at the end of production or at the point of sale. Buyers then know what they are dealing with. It’s easy to say to buyers it’s not the dealers problem because they aren’t driving the motorhome the buyer is and then for some it’s too late you have paid your money. The brochure payload values are next to useless as don’t include added extras and you might as well take 5% off straightaway. It’s conceivable that buying a 3500kg rated MH you go and collect with family, mum, dad and 2 kids that you go and fill with diesel and you are over your limit before you have even got it home.

 

[Joie de vivre]

Every van should be properly weighed either at the end of production or at the point of sale. Buyers then know what they are dealing with. It’s easy to say to buyers it’s not the dealers problem because they aren’t driving the motorhome the buyer is and then for some it’s too late you have paid your money. The brochure payload values are next to useless as don’t include added extras and you might as well take 5% off straightaway. It’s conceivable that buying a 3500kg rated MH you go and collect with family, mum, dad and 2 kids that you go and fill with diesel and you are over your limit before you have even got it home.

That is terrible! Especially if you're new to the game. You just wouldn't know!

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[Joie de vivre]

To do what you want will need a up plate. We have basically same van & have to travel with minimum water & don’t carry anything excessively heavy such as e-bikes to stay close to the limit. Not much of a problem as we always use sites. Been thinking about up plating but it does have it’s downsides. The Comformatic adds 150kg afaik.

150kg!! Wow! no wonder we are over! might have managed almost on a manual!

 

[Joie de vivre]

I’ve got my D4D appointment on Sunday at my nearest location, only booked a week ago. Their appointment system is very straightforward and you can fill in the boxes and it will tell you soonest date available. Also fee is £55 but if you put DRIVER10 in the voucher box the fee payable becomes £45! Used a GP last time (3 years ago) and was charged £90 and £20 with Specsavers. Once you have paid you get a confirmation email which lists everything that you need to take along.

Thanks. I'm in the process! Insurers aren't charging any extra either, so that's good. Just wondering - does anyone have an update on SV-tech costs? I can't ring them over weekend and I've just had a reply from VW-engineering quoting me £276 all in for a simple upplating, which this ought to be.

 

[Nanniemate]

D4Drivers - but abbreviated. They also had a code that reduced the cost to £40 rather than £50 and way below £140! Do a web search! Good luck

There are up to 50% discount voucher available in January offers

 

[Pausim]

150kg!! Wow! no wonder we are over! might have managed almost on a manual!

I think that figure is far too high. Looking at older brochures for other makes the Comfortmatic seems to add only 17 to 25kg. The current 9 speed torque converter auto is 55kg.

 

[Arnside037]

The recurring question when this question comes up is: who has been weighed by the authorities and fined? I haven't been weighed.

Last year on our way to Luxembourg i was parked on a motorway aire having lunch and watched an unmarked police car with two officers stop a red Berlingo sized (commercial, not moho) van and get out two weight plates to weigh each axle of his vehicle. Not sure what the outcome was, nor the initial reason for stopping him. So it does happen.

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[Headrush]

I'm not sure if the hgv medical is equivalent to the medical that you must take to continue driving after age 70. Never heard of people going that route for cars...

Edit.
After googling, it appears you don't need a medical, just have to make a declaration.
I don't know why I thought otherwise.
As a truck driver I have to have a medical every 5 years up to 65, then every year after that. I don't see how that's different to driving over 3.5 tonnes on a c1 license.

 

[Pausim]

I'm not sure if the hgv medical is equivalent to the medical that you must take to continue driving after age 70. Never heard of people going that route for cars...

Edit.
After googling, it appears you don't need a medical, just have to make a declaration.
I don't know why I thought otherwise.
As a truck driver I have to have a medical every 5 years up to 65, then every year after that. I don't see how that's different to driving over 3.5 tonnes on a c1 license.

After age 70 the C1 license is subject to the same medical requirements as HGV i.e. Group 2 rather than Group 1. The declaration only applies to Group 1 applications not C1.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/65a51345867cd800135ae844/assessing-fitness-to-drive-january-2024.pdf

This an extract from the Government advice.

 

[jerryz]

Could you check when your husband passed his test. If before 1/1/97 he would be entitled until 70 then provided he passes the addition requirements involving a medical and eyesight test. D4 drivers among others do the medical and eyesight test at a very fair price.You will find lots of threads on that subject to help in research.

Except that DVLA is being sneaky and deleting C1 off people with pre 1997 grandfathered rights , Im 65 and the C1 went missing from my license when i moved home 2 years ago , and they wont re-instate it , im having a big fight with DVLA about it as I actually passed a proper 7.5ton C1 test in 1983

so I had to but a 3500kg van which has been a big compromise as I dont have a garage for motorcycle and have to tow a trailer

 

[PaulW2]

PVCs are always heavier than their coachbuilt sized equivalents as PVC haven't got lighter weight bodies etc so why they say they've got over 500kg of payload is always suspect, it's usually a max of 400kg if you're lucky and that's without any extras! We've had 3 PVCs the last 2 being XLWB as you have and we knew from the start that uprating was going to be needed in order to make it usable.

The tow bar you've added won't have helped as they can add quite a lot of weight depending on the manufacturer so if you're not going to use it get it removed however it won't solve your overall issue though so other things are going to have to be jettisoned if you want to stay at a max of 3500kg, only you can decide what those will be (husband? ). One thing you could consider is actually keep the tow bar and getting a small trailer for your extra stuff to keep the PVC's weight at 3500kg, you've got plenty of town allowance so that's not an issue.

If you do go down the uprating route then VWE come highly recommended and are about half the cost of the SVTech who also do it, as you've got the heavy chassis already there won't be any need for mods at all, so although it' just a paper exercise you can't do it yourself as you need an engineer's report which is where VWT/SVTech come into it. One benefit is that you'll pay much cheaper road tax ... no I'm NOT kidding, it's only £165 a year and has been that rate for yonks, no idea what the real reason is for it but I can't see it changing for a long time, if ever and the saving will soon offset the cost of uprating and your hubby's medical if he applies to get his C1 back.

The trailer thing is interesting as a thought experiment.

If they were to add a trailer, there is the noseweight. For round numbers let's say 70 kg. So they're on 3,750kg. So now, all things being equal, they would be ok if they can shift 250 kg to the trailer. But obviously not passengers, or water, or diesel, or gas...

I for instance have enough payload in my PVC. I think about 100kg headroom in full travelling trim. But if I added a towbar I would have say 50kg less. If I then added a trailer less still, so that I would probably have to move things into the trailer.

So I would move from underweight to overweight by the simple addition of a trailer. But we'll all obviously have our own permutations given our circumstances.

 

[PaulW2]

Except that DVLA is being sneaky and deleting C1 off people with pre 1997 grandfathered rights , Im 65 and the C1 went missing from my license when i moved home 2 years ago , and they wont re-instate it , im having a big fight with DVLA about it as I actually passed a proper 7.5ton C1 test in 1983

so I had to but a 3500kg van which has been a big compromise as I dont have a garage for motorcycle and have to tow a trailer

I wouldn't want to have my ability to drive my van at the mercy of the bureaucrats. I still have a C licence but have, in part, chosen to future-proof by having a 3.5t van. (There are obviously other pros and cons that also feed into such a decision.)

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[Lenny HB]

150kg!! Wow! no wonder we are over! might have managed almost on a manual!

He has added a zero Comformatic is only 15kg extra.

If your van is on top tolerance that will lose 148kg they are allowed +/- 5% and they are never under.

Looking at your axle weights you have the Maxi chassis if the spec is for a standard van that's another 40kg lost.
Also they allow for 1 x 11kg aluminium gas bottle so if you have 2 steel bottles that's lost probably another 25kg.

Any options that have been fitted and any extras you have added all come off the payload.