Now we HAVE to downsize...

G-RMPS

G-RMPS

Joined
Oct 27, 2017
Posts
1,650
Likes collected
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Location
Perth
Funster No
51,142
MH
Hymer A Class
Exp
Since 2014
Last week, all set for 3 month's in Spain. Van loaded and almost ready to go. Ferry, campsite, hire car all booked months ago. Just one problem. Driving licence renewal, which I applied for at the beginning of September. It finally arrived, two days before we were due to set off. With the C1 missing :-( Next day, I got a letter saying the C1 had been revoked "have not met the required standard", whatever that means. I had been required to take an exercise stress test weeks ago which, as far as I knew, had gone OK. Certainly I had had no qualms about undertaking it, and it didn't seem particularly "stressful" at the time.

So, the van is in storage and I cannot drive it.

Step one. Cancel the campsite, hire car. Reschedule the ferry to November. Cost £12, but the £600 now re-invested in a club cabin for the future.

Step two. Decide what to do with the van. One option was to try to sell it for cash with a dealer. Dealers forecourts are stuffed with unsold vans. So doesn't sound like a practical proposition. Another option was to try to sell it privately. In min-December? When I cannot even demonstrate the van without a valid driving license. So part-exchange maybe? What replacement could carry a Hymer's load of possessions and remain below 3500kg, and at what incremental cost? Lennie says it's impossible. He may be right.

Episode two to follow!
 
I've already tried to find out, pushed between consultant who supervised the treadmill, my GP, and the DVLA. No answer yet. I could wait more time (months?) for a retest or another kind of test, or.... Who knows whether I would be successful? And it could all happen again in two/three years.

So step three, accept reality and move on. It may be daft buying another van at this stage in life, but that's what I'm looking at. I just hope I get a few years use in return for the inevitable depreciation. Van number three will definitely be the last one. Won't it?
 
G-RMPS said:
Last week, all set for 3 month's in Spain. Van loaded and almost ready to go. Ferry, campsite, hire car all booked months ago. Just one problem. Driving licence renewal, which I applied for at the beginning of September. It finally arrived, two days before we were due to set off. With the C1 missing :-( Next day, I got a letter saying the C1 had been revoked "have not met the required standard", whatever that means. I had been required to take an exercise stress test weeks ago which, as far as I knew, had gone OK. Certainly I had had no qualms about undertaking it, and it didn't seem particularly "stressful" at the time.

So, the van is in storage and I cannot drive it.

Step one. Cancel the campsite, hire car. Reschedule the ferry to November. Cost £12, but the £600 now re-invested in a club cabin for the future.

Step two. Decide what to do with the van. One option was to try to sell it for cash with a dealer. Dealers forecourts are stuffed with unsold vans. So doesn't sound like a practical proposition. Another option was to try to sell it privately. In min-December? When I cannot even demonstrate the van without a valid driving license. So part-exchange maybe? What replacement could carry a Hymer's load of possessions and remain below 3500kg, and at what incremental cost? Lennie says it's impossible. He may be right.

Episode two to follow!
Click to expand...

I have a C licence but decided early on that I wasn't going to run the gauntlet with medicals, so decided to downsize before we got to that point. From a 5.5 t van to 3.5. No real problem. Obviously though I can't carry all the stuff I did before. But being in a 6 metre PVC which is under 3,500 kg is quite liberating in many ways.

So if you decide to accept rather than contest the ruling and stay below 3,500 kg it is workable. There are compromises of course, but it's really not that difficult.

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I am in a similar boat to you but I have not had the knock back. Sent the forms off on 23rd October then nothing for 3 weeks. Two letters arrived, one asking if I had any of a list of things such as MS etc. The other letter was saying they were writing to my GP. My D4 medical was with D4D. A week later a call from the doctors about the form and an appointment on the 2nd December to sort it. They promised to post it to DVLA that day. A letter dated 11th December arrived today to say they had not had the letter back from my GP. I know that the letter was posted as I trust them. Phoned DVLA and eventually got through to be told that they had received my GP's letter and it was scanned onto the system last Friday. It seems to take them about 6 working days to open mail and process. Now waiting for the Dr to review and process. Not really fit for purpose.
 
An exercise stress test is often used to investigate heart issues and such issues do not require that you feel “stressed”. It may very well be that what has alarmed the DVLA is a condition that can be treated allowing for a reconsideration of the application.

I’d certainly explore your options for re-applying before a premature downsizing. Fingers crossed.
 
Sounds like an admin cock up to me, I would keep trying to get a resolution before selling van or even downsizing.
I still remember enjoying your aerial shots you took whilst flying, I hope you still have your flying licence and your aeroplane, I realise there's much harder health checks to pass, plus flying hours of course, that would really be a sad loss to anyone in your position to surrender it also.
Best wishes to you.
Les
 
I had stents put in about 3 years ago but I’m not aware of any subsequent negative consequences. It seems odd to me that the DVLA pay private rates for a consultant to oversee a test, and then employee a doctor themselves to second-guess the consultant who probably knows a patient’s relevant history.

As someone once said: “Time’s short. Keep moving”.

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PaulW2 said:
So if you decide to accept rather than contest the ruling and stay below 3,500 kg it is workable. There are compromises of course, but it's really not that difficult.
Click to expand...
Agreed. We gave up on C1 licences and bought a new Hymer 3500Kg Exsis -i.

We are very pleased with it. It all works really well.
 
I'd be tempted to down-plate the A Class if possible?

The Augusta is in that territory, it's not got a weight on the V5 has always been taxed as 3500kg van, but the Alko plate says 4500kg.

I still have the C1 and do an ECG for my race license......ATM
 
Thanks for all the sympathy/empathy votes.

The fun starts now. How to minimise the inevitable compromises, starting with 3500kg max.

Island bed seems to be the first thing to go. We don’t fancy climbing up to over-cab beds, or transverse doubles, or French beds (for the same reason) or caravan-style on two benches, so it’s looking like two proper singles or somesuch. It’s beginning to look like we may join the woosh-bang brigade.

There are dozens to choose from and, as snowbirds, we want to be away PDQ. We’re restricting our choices to reasonable build quality which will probably eliminate most - obviously bias rather than researched facts! Our Hymer never had quality issues once we had replaced the stupid plastic kitchen drawer hinges with steel ones.
 
TinaLes said:
Sounds like an admin cock up to me, I would keep trying to get a resolution before selling van or even downsizing.
I still remember enjoying your aerial shots you took whilst flying, I hope you still have your flying licence and your aeroplane, I realise there's much harder health checks to pass, plus flying hours of course, that would really be a sad loss to anyone in your position to surrender it also.
Best wishes to you.
Les
Click to expand...
Pilots PPL medical is a single sheet questionnaire type, just signed by your GP. Far simpler then an HGV/class C medical.

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I'd just downplate, a large heavy van is no fun to drive or park. We've got a lightweight motorcycle on the back and still got 310kg spare...
(The back axle is 340kg under but that's with the water tank empty)
 
How about trade in to swap for a 3500 unit?

Why have you hired a car?
 
G-RMPS said:
Thanks for all the sympathy/empathy votes.

The fun starts now. How to minimise the inevitable compromises, starting with 3500kg max.

Island bed seems to be the first thing to go. We don’t fancy climbing up to over-cab beds, or transverse doubles, or French beds (for the same reason) or caravan-style on two benches, so it’s looking like two proper singles or somesuch. It’s beginning to look like we may join the woosh-bang brigade.

There are dozens to choose from and, as snowbirds, we want to be away PDQ. We’re restricting our choices to reasonable build quality which will probably eliminate most - obviously bias rather than researched facts! Our Hymer never had quality issues once we had replaced the stupid plastic kitchen drawer hinges with steel ones.
Click to expand...
Wildax Elara - French bed or 2x singles on a Merc base
https://www.wiltshiremotorhomes.co.uk/wildax-elara.php
 
Peter and Julie said:
Pilots PPL medical is a single sheet questionnaire type, just signed by your GP. Far simpler then an HGV/class C medical.
Click to expand...
I “downsized” my pilots license to a LAPL (light aircraft pilots license) some time ago. Limited to flying in Europe, then further limited to UK and France following the “B” word - Grrrrr. Now just a medical self-declaration every three years that I meet car driving health standards.

Several years ago the CAA researched accidents over a 20-year period and concluded that third-parties were no more likely to be killed by someone else’s plane than by someone-else’s car. A rare bit of common sense legislation that the rest of Europe elected to ignore.
 
MichaelT said:
How about trade in to swap for a 3500 unit?

Why have you hired a car?
Click to expand...
Re:car. We like to tour (campsites, CLs, aires, “wild camping”) for 9 months of the year. In the winter months we like to have a base in a warmer place with a car for mobility. We view this as not a holiday, but temporarily living somewhere else.

Just before Covid we downsized from a 4-bed house to a flat to facilitate this style of living. It suits us, and saves the anguish of a forced downsize in future. Maybe we should have done the same with the van :)

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G-RMPS said:
I've already tried to find out, pushed between consultant who supervised the treadmill, my GP, and the DVLA. No answer yet. I could wait more time (months?) for a retest or another kind of test, or.... Who knows whether I would be successful? And it could all happen again in two/three years.

So step three, accept reality and move on. It may be daft buying another van at this stage in life, but that's what I'm looking at. I just hope I get a few years use in return for the inevitable depreciation. Van number three will definitely be the last one. Won't it?
Click to expand...
See if you can find out the consultant’s secretary’s name (usually a google of the consultant name will find it under his/her private work) and write to them personally explaining why you would like to know. I don’t think DVLA will help.

Hopefully you will find it a positive thing to have a smaller lighter van and take less stuff.
I imagine that a further step has been considered and not acceptable, but does your wife have her C1 still? If so send her on a course.
 
We downsized from a Carthago A Class to a Malibu Van 640 earlier this year and we are absolutely delighted with it. We have weighed it and are comfortable with the payload margin we have but did have to be a bit ruthless with leaving some stuff behind.

As PaulW2 said earlier it is quite liberating. Although the van is not that much smaller I am very happy to drive around in it and not have to tow a car.
 
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Of course we all have different ideas about what suits us best for our intended use of a motorhome. We previously have owned two PVCs.

The first had a double bed across the back, over a reasonably large storage area accessed from the rear doors. We soon got rid of this, mainly because of the disturbed nights climbing over one another for nocturnal loo trips (an increasing problem as you get older!), but at 6m it was very easy to find somewhere to park in urban areas etc.

Our second PVC, at 6.3m, did permit twin fore-aft beds over the rear ‘garage’. However, the “pinch point” in the centre of the van made it very difficult to pass one another when cooking etc. Also, the loo/shower arrangement (which seemed ingenious when we bought it) became really irritating when (for example) the shower was in use there was no way to move from the front to the rear and you could not even open the fridge. We thought all of this a compromise too far, especially since most of our trips are 6 weeks+ and mostly off-grid.

We had tried to avoid going over 3,500 kg because we had both lost our C1 being over 70. We solved this by choosing a 7m Adria Coral. For us the extra width means moving fore and aft has no “pinch point”, and whilst 7m does not give enough space to have separate loo and shower cubicles, the arrangement is a good enough compromise to meet our needs. When we bought this new it was plated at 3,500 kg. With two up, full water/gas/diesel and the ‘extras’ we considered essential (wind-out awning, 2 x Gaslow, 2 x lithium, inverter, TV) we found we had around a further 300 kg (at a weigh-bridge) for food, clothes, wine, outside chairs etc. This was manageable with care about what we carried and (for example) when returning from abroad with our full booze allowance, we could save at least 80 kg by only carrying 20 litres of fresh water.

However, we also wanted to carry a couple of folding eBikes in the garage and not feel too constrained in what we could take e.g. sometimes we wished to take our Quest Screen House (especially when at Rallies/travelling in the UK). So, we succeeded in regaining our C1 licences and then had our motorhome up-plated to 3960 kg (without modification - just the combined axle weight limits specified by Fiat) and this has met all our load carrying needs, though we still have to be mindful that this has not increased the rear axle limit, which is most affected by the main stowage being in the rear garage.

Unavoidably, for most folk, getting older brings more health issues and our C1 renewals are only a little over 18 months away. Hopefully we will both pass the required medical/optical testing and get at least another 3 years at C1. But, if we don’t, we know we can easily get our motorhome down-plated to 3500 kg and continue to use it, obviously adjusting what we are able to carry.
Perhaps continuing to be plated at 3,960 kg will become possible with the uplifting of the weight restrictions which are probably being implemented in the EU and the UK may follow…..but we are not banking on it!

Hope my contribution to this thread may be helpful in considering what is your best way forward G-RMPS. Good luck whatever you decide to do.
 
If you reach the point of thinking of trading it in I'd try and advert on here first. Dealers seem to have planty of stock I think you would get a discount on the replacement which might mean if you get anywhere near the trade in value selling privately your still better off
 
With effort, it is workable to run an A Class at inder 3500kg.
We bought our Hymer B588DL with this in mind and up plated to 3850 with the possibility of down plating again, should the need arise.
We have removed the mattress from the drop-down bed and the heavy Hymer table.
We are average weight people with a 22kg dog, and carry 2 e-bikes and a spare wheel in the garage.
When we returned home from our summer trip to France, we went to the weighbridge before emptying the van, had half a tank of fuel and 50% water, 2 completly full refillable gas bottles, and a decent stash of red wine.
We fully expected to be overweight.
However, our total weight was 3620 - rear axle 1900kg of a possible 2000kg.
It would obviously be tight, but we feel we could lose the extra 120kg by getting rid of some of the clutter that we carry - the just-in-case tins of beans and soup, extra shoes and clothes, never-to-be-read books etc., swapping from 2 gel batteries to lithium, and possibility removing one gas bottle.
As we also lug the e-bikes half-way around Europe with us, but rarely use them because we have the dog, we wouldn't really be missing out by leaving them at home.
We do enjoy the spaciousnes of living in an A Class van, particularly when travelling in Europe for 90 days.
Whatever you decide, I'm sorry to hear that your current plans have been set-back, and I wish you luck. I'm sure that once you've had a chance to assess everything, you'll find a good solution. 👍

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G-RMPS said:
Thanks for all the sympathy/empathy votes.

The fun starts now. How to minimise the inevitable compromises, starting with 3500kg max.

Island bed seems to be the first thing to go. We don’t fancy climbing up to over-cab beds, or transverse doubles, or French beds (for the same reason) or caravan-style on two benches, so it’s looking like two proper singles or somesuch. It’s beginning to look like we may join the woosh-bang brigade.

There are dozens to choose from and, as snowbirds, we want to be away PDQ. We’re restricting our choices to reasonable build quality which will probably eliminate most - obviously bias rather than researched facts! Our Hymer never had quality issues once we had replaced the stupid plastic kitchen drawer hinges with steel ones.
Click to expand...
Have a look at the Adria compactline, single beds and garage and better insulation than a pvc
 
We chose to downsize a few years ago, 2 C1 s due for renewal at the same time. We do have an over garage, climb over the other bed as the compromise, the van we have was released as also being with a single drop down, couldn't find one in UK.
Friends made the same choice, their's is a 6.5M Hymer van with twin beds, they are very pleased with it. Ours is 6M had we seen that van. At the time, we might have gone the same way.
Good luck in your search.

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