NCC Underslung LPG tank training.

[funflair]

Funny enough if you cut one open ie for a burner or bbq the inside looks brand new, must say I never looked at the date stamp

I can well believe that Steve, I was going to say that the NCC must have some data on old tanks they have inspected and how many were corroding from the inside, if it was a sizeable number at say 10,15 or even 20 years then maybe we as consumers might be more convinced to stump up for a replacement, as it is it seems that they had to come up with a code of practise for fixed tanks as there was already periodic inspection for portable bottles, the easiest route seems to be just scrap and renew as then nobody has to take on the responsibility of certifying the old tank.

 

[Steve and Denise]

I can well believe that Steve, I was going to say that the NCC must have some data on old tanks they have inspected and how many were corroding from the inside, if it was a sizeable number at say 10,15 or even 20 years then maybe we as consumers might be more convinced to stump up for a replacement, as it is it seems that they had to come up with a code of practise for fixed tanks as there was already periodic inspection for portable bottles, the easiest route seems to be just scrap and renew as then nobody has to take on the responsibility of certifying the old tank.

True Martin, it would be so easy to put a enderscope in through the valve hole with modern cameras being so small, but would that be shooting the golden goose

 

[Pausim]

Who are the ‘We’ that you’re referring to? Do you have a business affiliation that we/I’m unaware of or are you speaking on behalf of users/consumers?

The “We” I refer to is us consumer members of this site, see #15.

Again, who are the ‘We’ that you refer to? Do you mean us as consumers?

Yes, us consumer members of this forum, my Alugas cylinder is date marked and my cylinder came with a certificate saying when it would need testing.

 

[Nirvanauk]

Mine was condemned last month during its hab check. Last week Autogas 2000 replaced it and the regulator. Great job from them as always.

 

[bigtwin]

Funny enough if you cut one open ie for a burner or bbq the inside looks brand new, must say I never looked at the date stamp

Indeed. As I said earlier in the thread in response to that suggestion:

It could be, but that must be unlikely. What would cause the deterioration (the contents are very ‘clean’ and wouldn’t induce corrosion)? In any event, any such deterioration would likely reveal itself by choking up filters/blocking jets etc long before it became a structural integrity issue.

Ian

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[bigtwin]

Mine was condemned last month during its hab check.

Condemned; on what basis? Age? Or very obvious degradation in condition?

Ian

 

[peterc10]

I can understand testing tanks fitted under the motorhome and cylinders which have stood out in the elements. But our cylinders have spent their life in a weather tight gas locker and look as clean and unmarked as they were when we bought them. I too would be interested to understand how they would fail in that environment.

 

[Lenny HB]

I can understand testing tanks fitted under the motorhome and cylinders which have stood out in the elements. But our cylinders have spent their life in a weather tight gas locker and look as clean and unmarked as they were when we bought them. I too would be interested to understand how they would fail in that environment.

Not just the cylinders the valves only have a 10 year life.
I changed my 10 year old Alugas cylinders in Germany last October.

 

[peterc10]

Not just the cylinders the valves only have a 10 year life.
I changed my 10 year old Alugas cylinders in Germany last October.

I can see logic in that, given that the valves are a mechanism. So why not just change the valves?

 

[peterc10]

Not just the cylinders the valves only have a 10 year life.
I changed my 10 year old Alugas cylinders in Germany last October.

Lenny HB Out of curiosity was it a p/x with money off new ones? How much did it cost?

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[trophychap]

Can anyone offer me any evidence of brass valves failing after ten years I doubt it very much after all most of our homes have brass taps "mainly water taps I will concur" that are working much more frequently than any motorhome. No known failure rates as far as I know!

Gas cookers must be another example of brass taps in use.

Very little chance of internal tank corrosion due to the oils that are in LPG products I would think, we are hearing of regulators gumming up quite frequently on these pages.

I am sure when I bought my first set of Gaslow Cylinders they had a fifteen year retest date stamped on them.

 

[Lenny HB]

Lenny HB Out of curiosity was it a p/x with money off new ones? How much did it cost?

They no longer offer a refurb, only exchange for a new bottle and you now have to go to a small company just down the road from Alugas, free Setllaplatz 50m from them.

€220 per bottle same price for both 11kg & 14kg ours were 14kg. Charge €21.50 to change them I thought sod it, let them do it. Worked out well as he found one fitting with a hairline crack where it had been overtightened (not me, dealer changed them over from last van) and needed another fitting as the valves are slightly higher on the new bottles, didn't charge me for the two fittings so worked out well. £395 for two new bottles fitted.
If your inlet hoses are 10 years old they will need changing, they do LPG fitting so they could do that at the same time if needed.

 

[bigtwin]

Can anyone offer me any evidence of brass valves failing after ten years I doubt it very much after all most of our homes have brass taps "mainly water taps I will concur" that are working much more frequently than any motorhome. No known failure rates as far as I know!

I agree with your underlying sentiment (in terms of evidence) but the use case (low pressure) is somewhat different from LPG (medium pressure (10 - 20 bar)).

Ian

 

[bigtwin]

Worked out well as he found one fitting with a hairline crack where it had been overtightened (not me, dealer changed them over from last van)

Did you say that they were Aluminium cylinders?
If so they are more susceptible to fracture/brittle fracture than steel. Perhaps not the best material for this purpose?

Ian

 

[Lenny HB]

Did you say that they were Aluminium cylinders?
If so they are more susceptible to fracture/brittle fracture than steel. Perhaps not the best material for this purpose?

Ian

Wasn't the cylinder it was a steel R/A fitting used to connect the filler pipe to the cylinder,

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[Bessy765]

As I don‘t want to knock out any of Musk’s satellites I replace mine every ten years regardless, I would expect the inside of the tank to be in good nick given there is always a film of oil from the LPG.
the only addition I am going to make is to hang a piece of rubber matting down the underfloor in front of the tanks to deflect anything that may be picked up when driving to reduce the possibility of stone chip etc striking the tank.

 

[cyberyacht]

To put it in prospective we order approximately 300 tanks at a time , our tank manufacturer supplies one of their Automotive (car manufacturers) with 1400 a week

Which begs the question if there are 1400 automotive LPG tanks being used a week by one manufacturer, why are all the garage LPG outlets being withdrawn?

 

[bigtwin]

I am going to make is to hang a piece of rubber matting down the underfloor in front of the tanks to deflect anything that may be picked up when driving to reduce the possibility of stone chip etc striking the tank.

I’m not convinced about that as a mitigation measure as you will induce a low pressure area behind the mat which will create turbulence and lift up any crap in the vicinity. I guess if it was immediately in front of /adjacent to the tank it might be effective.

Ian

 

[Mikeco]

I’m not convinced about that as a mitigation measure as you will induce a low pressure area behind the mat which will create turbulence and lift up any crap in the vicinity. I guess if it was immediately in front of /adjacent to the tank it might be effective.

Ian

You can buy the heat shield for the tank which fits between the tank and the exhaust, it dose not however go down to the same level as the underside of the tank, it’s around 20mm short.

 

[Stoosal]

I’m happy to have mine checked/tested at ten years. I’m happy to pay a reasonable fee for that service.

There are a number of companies that test cylinders. A few weeks ago I thought I had found a company to test and replace cylinder/valves. No problem they said. It was only when I asked for a date to bring them they suddenly stated they no longer offered the service to individuals. So…..the question I have is if these companies retest cylinders why will they not provide the service to customers like the leisure market. I think the reason is simply that these companies will be pressurised by the cylinder manufacturers to not provide a retest service, so that they can sell a new one. My Gaslow cylinders have been stored inside since new. They look new. I don’t have any reason to suppose that internally there will be any issues. It’s a simple retest procedure that companies will undertake as a course of business.….but won’t for me.

I have two calor cylinders in the garage, both well over ten years old (emergency heater for power cuts etc). Calor rented them to me under their agreement. They have never contacted me to say they need to retest the cylinders. There’s nothing in the rental agreement I have that says I need to take them back within ten years. Are they safe, how does a customer know. Calor obviously aren’t concerned or they would have suitable procedures in place to ensure an adequate test and recertification process under the terms of their industry guidance….wouldnt they?

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[Phill D]

I struggle to see how the so called 10 year test is or can be in-forced.

I fully understand the potential safety concerns and I know where I stand on our safety.
I get how it’s relatively easy to check and condemn an underslung tank.

but on the basis that a habitation check is likely to be the only observation of gas bottles and a habitation check is just that . It does not carry any weight or authority to prevent the use of equipment, simply provide advice.

Add to that there is no official means of testing bottles for the end user I can’t see the 10 year guidance going anywhere more than guidance in the foreseeable future.

 

[Steve and Denise]

I struggle to see how the so called 10 year test is or can be in-forced.

I fully understand the potential safety concerns and I know where I stand on our safety.
I get how it’s relatively easy to check and condemn an underslung tank.

but on the basis that a habitation check is likely to be the only observation of gas bottles and a habitation check is just that . It does not carry any weight or authority to prevent the use of equipment, simply provide advice.

Add to that there is no official means of testing bottles for the end user I can’t see the 10 year guidance going anywhere more than guidance in the foreseeable future.

I must admit changing my Alugas at ten due to the possibility of insurance complications had my windscreen been smashed
As they say we pay out on any day but Thatday

 

[Bessy765]

I’m not convinced about that as a mitigation measure as you will induce a low pressure area behind the mat which will create turbulence and lift up any crap in the vicinity. I guess if it was immediately in front of /adjacent to the tank it might be effective.

Ian

That should have read hanging down from the underfloor to 50mm below the tank but stayed so it doesn’t rub against it (bloody spell check)