Motorhome parking Ban (1 Viewer)

[buttons]

can someone please explain to me why this activity is considered unacceptable ? surely if we leave no trace we have been there it does no harm !

Motor home ownership is not restricted, anyone can own one. :Sad:
Perhaps I could give you a couple of examples of wild camping that ended in a total ban.
I am a regular visitor to a charming town on the Suffolk coast. At the end of the town is a 1 mile stretch of sea wall that sits proud between the sea on one side and the river on the other. The sea wall and areas around the wall is a public car park that has always been free for all and absolutely idyllic. You can park on the sea wall and step out one side onto the beach or walk for miles around the river through the salt marshes.:Cool:
The town is something special and has a very nice well laid out camp site within the perimeter of the town with more than enough well serviced plots.:thumb:
The sea wall was abused for many years, notices were posted of restrictions to follow if the abuse continued but totally ignored. :moon:
Being a regular visitor it was difficult to get up onto the sea wall. Full Timers and others had set up camp for weeks or months at a time. Wind breaks were used to section off the beach as their own. Beach strollers had to walk into the sea to get past. :Angry:
Ferry road Studland Bay same scenario.
Would you consider this to be unacceptable?

 

[GJH]

How do you think we should lobby?

The first thing is to marshal all your evidence as to why the setting up of an aire would be an advantage to the place you're thinking of. Also, draw up a list of all the possible objections you can think of and put together arguments to counter each point.

If the place you want an aire to be set up is where you live, go to see your local councillor(s) at a ward surgery. If you know any local councillors personally you could also use that as a way in. Use the initial meeting as an opener (because other people are likely to have other surgery business as well) and arrange a follow-up meeting to present your case.

If the place is somewhere other than where you live, identify the leader of the council concerned and those members responsible for tourism and parking. Most council web sites have details of all their members, with their responsibilities. Then send them (plus the chief executive perhaps) an e-mail or letter outlining the proposal and ask if you can arrange to meet them to present your evidence.

There is a skeleton letter Here which you might like to copy and amend as appropriate.

 

[scotjimland]

The sea wall was abused for many years, notices were posted of restrictions to follow if the abuse continued but totally ignored. :moon:
Being a regular visitor it was difficult to get up onto the sea wall. Full Timers and others had set up camp for weeks or months at a time. Wind breaks were used to section off the beach as their own. Beach strollers had to walk into the sea to get past. :Angry:

You forgot to mention dumping toilets, grey water and rubbish on the beach or on the adjoining marshland ... these people take all and give little or nothing back to the local economy ... and before anyone mentions local shops benefiting, if that were so why was there a campaign to have it banned..?
These people come stocked with food and drink purchased at a nearby superstore before arriving ... and if no one else will, I call it freeloading ..

Many years ago we used to visit this location, staying one or two nights.. then one night at 3am we had our habitation window smashed ... as you can imagine, being awakened at that time and with two young children asleep it was a real scare.
I got up to investigate and saw a car speeding away along the sea wall .. we've never returned.. either to camp or visit .. that sort of intimidation is unjustified.. but clearly all these years ago, the locals were fed up with it.

 

[weejocky]

I said it all here last year. A few Tossers will ruin it for all of us. oh:

The responsible motorhomer arrives somewhere beautiful in late afternoon or early evening, stops for the night then moves on after breakfast.

The Tosser stops for days on end, because its his 'right' He's proud because he never pays for a site. He is often a selfish shortsighted idiot that ruins it for us all.

As I recall there are plenty here who freely admit to being tossers

 

[GJH]

I'm not going to be dragged into any argument about emotive labels for particular types of behaviour but would be able to agree with the second paragraph with an amendment.

The responsible motorhomer arrives somewhere beautiful in late afternoon or early evening, stops for the night, having first made sure that he is not breaking any laws nor flouting any ban on overnighting, then moves on after breakfast.

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[buttons]

You forgot to mention dumping toilets, grey water and rubbish on the beach or on the adjoining marshland ... these people take all and give little or nothing back to the local economy ... and before anyone mentions local shops benefiting, if that were so why was there a campaign to have it banned..?
These people come stocked with food and drink purchased at a nearby superstore before arriving ... and if no one else will, I call it freeloading ..

Many years ago we used to visit this location, staying one or two nights.. then one night at 3am we had our habitation window smashed ... as you can imagine, being awakened at that time and with two young children asleep it was a real scare.
I got up to investigate and saw a car speeding away along the sea wall .. we've never returned.. either to camp or visit .. that sort of intimidation is unjustified.. but clearly all these years ago, the locals were fed up with it.

Starting to sound like a couple of Sycophants Jim. The town in question is still a popular destination throughout the year hotels and accommodation is at a premium so the lack of abuse by free loaders has only made the town a better place to visit Parking for motor homes is still tolerated on the lower levels but overnight stops are banned. However, some won’t be happy until a height barrier is installed as they are still using the lower parking area to save themselves a few bob. As I said before, motor home ownership is not restricted, anyone can own one..

 

[scotjimland]

Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003.

All too often I read on forums that it is different in Scotland as there is a Right To Roam .. and you can camp anywhere .. this is utter nonsense..

The laws for parking and stopping overnight are the same as England and Wales. You are just as likely to find height barriers, NO Camping or Sleeping Overnight signs in popular locations.

The Right To Roam Act does NOT apply to motorised vehicles.. nor give anyone the legal right to 'off site' camping with a motorhome.

Your access rights

Everyone can enjoy Scotland's outdoor access rights. In summary, some of the main features of the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 are:

* Everyone has the statutory right of access
* Access rights apply to all land and inland waters, unless excluded (as below)
* Access rights are for outdoor recreation, for crossing land and water, and for some educational and commercial purposes
* Exercising access rights, and managing access land, must be done responsibly.

Where access rights do not apply

* Houses and gardens, and non-residential buildings and associated land
* Land in which crops have been sown or are growing (although please note that the headrigs, endrigs and other margins of fields where crops are growing are not defined as crops, whether sown or unsown, and are therefore within access rights).
* Land next to a school and used by the school
* Sports or playing fields when these are in use and where the exercise of access rights would interfere with such use
* Land developed and in use for recreation and where the exercise of access rights would interfere with such use
* Golf courses (but you can cross a golf course provided you don't interfere with any games of golf)
* Places like airfields, railways, telecommunication sites, military bases and installations, working quarries and construction sites, and
* Visitor attractions or other places which charge for entry.

Which activities are excluded from access rights?

Access rights don't extend to:

* Being on or crossing land for the purpose of doing anything which is an offence, such as theft, breach of the peace, nuisance, poaching, allowing a dog to worry livestock, dropping litter, polluting water or disturbing certain wild birds, animals and plants
* Hunting, shooting, fishing
* Any form of motorised recreation or passage (except by people with a disability using a vehicle or vessel adapted for their use)
* Anyone responsible for a dog which is not under proper control, or
* Anyone taking away anything from the land for a commercial purpose.

Other related legislation supporting access to the countryside:

* Public rights of way continue to exist and are unaffected by the Act
* Public rights on the foreshore and in tidal waters will continue to exist
* Liability - the Act makes clear that the extent of the duty of care owed by a land manager is unaffected
* Access rights do not extend to criminal activity which is defined by various statutory offences.

 

[scotjimland]

New height barrier in Scotland

This map shows recently erected 'goal posts' at a popular overnight parking spot on the North Ayrshire coast, close to where I use to live.


http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=ardrossan&sll=52.024664,1.413001&sspn=0.050595,0.108662&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Ardrossan,+North+Ayrshire,+United+Kingdom&ll=55.668993,-4.843919&spn=0.005797,0.013583&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=55.669001,-4.843946&panoid=KhGhwnvxdALruq6UjN7Z1g&cbp=12,167.99,,0,5

 

[alcorn54]

emotive issue

Its an emotive issue which I suppose has been created by some staying far to long on one site . Overnighting on occasions I still believe is acceptable if the area is just designated as a car-park or unused land and no harm is done , no rubbish is left and its not used as a camp site,like installing windbreaks to cordon of the area as per the previous example,I can fully understand the resentment felt by locals to this.

However I still cant get my head round the fact that Bamburgh Castle have installed height restrictions stopping any motorhome parking altogether during the summer and autumn months & the council have allowed it by giving planning permission . Instead of getting planning permission for barriers ,why didn't they get permission to ban overnight parking and the local police would then have the authority to move people on,or if the were unhappy with the amount of motorhomes parking there, simply restrict the amount allowed? instead of discriminating against us all. I honestly think there is more behind this decision than what has been disclosed ,as I have used this place for years with and without my Motorhome and have never heard any complains or disgruntled comments from locals also by removing these barriers during the winter months are they saying we can use the car parks during this period?? When most of the local designated camp sites are closed,so no lost revenue,also maybe allowing us to park there during the winter months might bring in a little revenue during the slack period ,who knows? .

Alan

 

[scotjimland]

nstead of getting planning permission for barriers ,why didn't they get permission to ban overnight parking and the local police could them move people on,or if the were unhappy with the amount of motorhomes parking there, simply restrict the amount allowed? instead of discriminating against us all.

Alan

Simple really, it's private land, the police are not interested in patrolling or have any duty to do so.
A height barrier is a 'one off' cost .. job done, on going private policing would need to be paid for.

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[Chris]

I haven't camped anywhere except on a site as I don't fancy it with young kids. I don't see anything wrong with wild camping though as long as people act reasonably and responsibly.

Unfortunately you have morons everywhere and they just give people a bad name.

I was in the South of France last year and the number of motorhomes parked up against the sea wall was a shock. They had their washing out to dry and it looked more like a ghetto than a holiday destination to be honest.

 

[scotjimland]

I haven't camped anywhere except on a site as I don't fancy it with young kids. I don't see anything wrong with wild camping though as long as people act reasonably and responsibly.

Unfortunately you have morons everywhere and they just give people a bad name.

I was in the South of France last year and the number of motorhomes parked up against the sea wall was a shock. They had their washing out to dry and it looked more like a ghetto than a holiday destination to be honest.

Since our experience at Aldeburgh we gave up on free camping in the UK .. Jan was really shook up and would never again camp anywhere unless it was secure. The cost of a new Seitz window would have paid for two weeks on club site.

We are lucky in the UK , we have an extensive network of great CL/CS sites.. many are as cheap some Aires in France.. and a lot more secure.. plus you get proper green ground to sit on to enjoy the outdoors. I can never see the attraction of staying on a car park waiting for the knock on the door or some chavs racing around at 2 am

 

[GJH]

Its an emotive issue which I suppose has been created by some staying far to long on one site . Overnighting on occasions I still believe is acceptable if the area is just designated as a car-park or unused land and no harm is done , no rubbish is left and its not used as a camp site,like installing windbreaks to cordon of the area as per the previous example,I can fully understand the resentment felt by locals to this.

It may be acceptable to those who wish it but not to anyone else. If the landowner (be he public or private sector) has placed a ban on overnighting then it is, by definition, unacceptable. After all, we don't know, if we just turn up somewhere without doing any prior research, why overnighting has been defined as unacceptable so we have no gorunds to mount a challenge.

However I still cant get my head round the fact that Bamburgh Castle have installed height restrictions stopping any motorhome parking altogether during the summer and autumn months & the council have allowed it by giving planning permission . Instead of getting planning permission for barriers ,why didn't they get permission to ban overnight parking and the local police would then have the authority to move people on,or if the were unhappy with the amount of motorhomes parking there, simply restrict the amount allowed? instead of discriminating against us all. I honestly think there is more behind this decision than what has been disclosed ,as I have used this place for years with and without my Motorhome and have never heard any complains or disgruntled comments from locals also by removing these barriers during the winter months are they saying we can use the car parks during this period?? When most of the local designated camp sites are closed,so no lost revenue,also maybe allowing us to park there during the winter months might bring in a little revenue during the slack period ,who knows?

As I pointed out yesterday, motorhome parking has not been stopped altogether at Bamburgh Castle:

Chris gave an explanation for the decision in the thread last year. As he pointed out, parking for motorhomes hasn't been stopped completely, it is still possible to park during the day.

To quote Chris from last year:

There are incidently two camper vans up at the castle today and I have taken the time to speak to the oocupants of both. They are very happy that they can park up at the castle for the day.

As Jim has already said, it is not a police matter. The costs of enforcing overnight bans would fall upon the castle owners. Again as Chris explained last year, prior to the height barriers being installed at Bamburgh, signs had been erected explaining the ban on overnighting. Those signs were removed by people who wished to ignore them.

 

[rangi]

alcorn54 in post #1 on this thread notified us of the problem, sedge in post #24 gave us the solution!

The rest , or should I say 85% of the rest of the 10 pages devoted to alcornn54's problem has been mere waffle, and point scoring while circling on lofty steeds.

Nuff said!

 

[GJH]

alcorn54 in post #1 on this thread notified us of the problem, sedge in post #24 gave us the solution!

To be strictly accurate, Sedge said (my emphasis):

However if we can't park there at all there is no point in our going there in the first place

Motorhomes can park at Bamburgh Castle, it is overnighting which is banned.

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[John & Joan]

It may be acceptable to those who wish it but not to anyone else. If the landowner (be he public or private sector) has placed a ban on overnighting then it is, by definition, unacceptable. After all, we don't know, if we just turn up somewhere without doing any prior research, why overnighting has been defined as unacceptable so we have no gorunds to mount a challenge.

You may not be breaking a law yourself by overnight parking (for the purpose of human habitation) but you could be causing the landowner to be in breach of the law.

Under the 1960 Act he is only allowed to have 1 caravan at a time, for the purpose of human habitation, on his land for a maximum of 28 days in a year without a site licence. If he permits the land to be used outside of this exemption he is liable to prosecution.

John

 

[rangi]

To be strictly accurate, Sedge said (my emphasis):

Motorhomes can park at Bamburgh Castle, it is overnighting which is banned.

Waffle and point scoring, like 85% of this thread!

 

[scotjimland]

alcorn54 in post #1 on this thread notified us of the problem, sedge in post #24 gave us the solution!

The rest , or should I say 85% of the rest of the 10 pages devoted to alcornn54's problem has been mere waffle, and point scoring while circling on lofty steeds.

Nuff said!

Not quite accurate ..

alcorn54 in post No. 1. ALSO asked a question..

So can somebody please explain to me why in an area of scientific interest why my motorhome or owners causes more damage than other people or vehicles and therfor should be banned from parking at anytime and refused entry?

This led to the discussion, that is why it's called a FORUM ..

 

[Chris]

Waffle and point scoring, like 85% of this thread!

And do your posts fall into the "waffle" category or the "point scoring" category?

 

[rangi]

And do your posts fall into the "waffle" category or the "point scoring" category?

A bit of both sometimes I suppose, but, a lot of my posts are just taking the mick out of inflated egos, guess that comes from living most of my life in a "lawnmower socity" every blade of grass is the same size, 'spect I'll need to explain that too!

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[wivvy's dad]

I think the whine should be corked




Move along - nothing to see here

 

[jhorsf]

alcorn54 in post #1 on this thread notified us of the problem, sedge in post #24 gave us the solution!

The rest , or should I say 85% of the rest of the 10 pages devoted to alcornn54's problem has been mere waffle, and point scoring while circling on lofty steeds.

Nuff said!

May I suggest a little light reading rangitira



Link Removed

 

[scotjimland]

I think the whine should be corked




Move along - nothing to see here

WOT.. before the real fight starts.... ?

watch this space... , the tossers haven't had their say yet

 

[GJH]

Waffle and point scoring, like 85% of this thread!

Yeh, but factual waffle

 

[wivvy's dad]

Yeh, but factual waffle

Where can I get a waffle iRon.....?

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[GJH]

Where can I get a waffle iRon.....?

Dunno about a waffle iRon but there should be an Apple iRon along soon 'cos they've done just about everything else. As Knobbly Knees might say, O I

 

[barryd]

What gets me reading through these posts and the appalling behavior of some wild campers is why do we ruin it for ourselves?

The story about the windbreaks and everyone camping out for weeks on end along the sea wall says it all. Why do people do it? I like to wild camp but the reason I do it is to find some fabulous place with a view in the middle of nowhere on our own. The golden rule of wilding should be that if you see a van or several vans parked up, go somewhere else! And only stay a night or two.

I agree with Jim, though, the network of CL's is simply superb. and you can stay on some for as little as £3.50 a night and no doubt do a weekly or monthly deal for peanuts. Wildiing in this country is great if you know where to go but its not as safe and relaxing as it is in France or Germany for example.

Perhaps however if we did have an aires network then problems like the one mentioned wouldnt happen. I suspect they would just manifest themselves in a different way as the British dont seem to have much respect for others or the places they visit.

BD

 

[rangi]

May I suggest a little light reading rangitira



View attachment 7645

???????

 

[Mixter]

I have a supplementary question (and i havent asked permission!) about these height barriers - supposedly to prevent motorhomes at night, and, overnighting in general. What about the plethora of campervans that can access the place at anytime, AND overnight? What do the castle owners say about this? Do they actually realise that all 'motorhomes' arent ten foot high and brilliant white in colour? (yes i know some are other colours - but for the sake of argument!).
Are they happy some are getting through? Do the know? Do they care?

 

[alcorn54]

Do they actually realise that all 'motorhomes' arent ten foot high and brilliant white in colour? (yes i know some are other colours - but for the sake of argument!).
Are they happy some are getting through? Do the know? Do they care?

The two sites that have resricted entry are the car parks to the side of the castle in the Dunes,beautiful location ,out of the way and idilic,trouble is they can be seen from castle windows . By the sound of it they are fed up with lots of Vans turning up together so I dont think itll bother them the odd much smaller ones getting through.Theres a hell of a lot kite surfer's with pick ups and Landrovers etc use these paticular car parks,so I suppose itll now mean more room for them. It really is a shame its had to come to this ! Take a look for yourselves how nice it was. Alan

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en...5.611105,-1.717376&spn=0.004817,0.016512&z=17

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