Masonary bits

[2657]

I would think most houses with cavity walls actually have concrete block inner courses (either dense or aerated), both of which are usually much easier to drill than any brick. However, an SDS drill will make light work of any masonry at all (assuming you're not trying to drill steel reinforcement). Standard non-SDS masonry bits struggle with butter when it drops below 21C.

That would depend on the age of the property, every house that I have lived in was built well before the introduction of concrete or thermalite blocks.
Don't know what an SDS drill bit is but I have had serious problems drilling into walls with the bits that I have used and not always cheap ones.

 

[TheBig1]

The right tool for the job makes all the difference. I have used Hilti and DeWalt SDS drill bits in a big drill for years and it makes light work of anything cheap sold in the likes of B&Q, other DiY warehouses are available. You do tend to pay double or more for a decent bit, but well worth it.

Recently I have done some work on my parent's old house. The labourer took one look at the hard fired red bricks and said "you won't get a drill in that". He soon ate humble pie when the drill sailed into the bricks and they accepted masonry bolts without any problem

 

[GMLS]

Agree you need a decent drill and this is easily the best overall value for money power tool I've bought

Titan TTB278SDS 6.3kg Electric SDS Plus Drill & 9 Piece Accessory Kit 230-240V - Screwfix

Order online at Screwfix.com. Supplied with a 9-piece accessory kit, this Titan TTB278SDS SDS Plus drill comes complete with everything you need to put its impressive power straight to work. The accessory kit contains five drill bits, ranging from 6mm-14mm, and two chisels in flat and point...

www.screwfix.com

 

[TheBig1]

Agree you need a decent drill and this is easily the best overall value for money power tool I've bought

Titan TTB278SDS 6.3kg Electric SDS Plus Drill & 9 Piece Accessory Kit 230-240V - Screwfix

Order online at Screwfix.com. Supplied with a 9-piece accessory kit, this Titan TTB278SDS SDS Plus drill comes complete with everything you need to put its impressive power straight to work. The accessory kit contains five drill bits, ranging from 6mm-14mm, and two chisels in flat and point...

www.screwfix.com

I have an identical drill by a different name. Well 2 actually as it happens, as after a few years hard use one became slightly temperamental and as I suspected a motor fault bought a replacement. The old one then decided to work again when next tried. So must be a wire or switch issue

 

[mitzimad]

my sds will go through a steel cat lintel without blinking only rsj's stop it

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[pappajohn]

The inner course of most houses are made from common bricks, seconds, which are quite often from the outside of the kiln and over cooked, and contain bits that are like glass virtually impenetrable.

Yep ...the good old 'black' brick.
Break one in half and the center is black as coal and seriously hard

 

[pappajohn]

Pointing out the obvious but it is sometimes overlooked; many drills start working well enough but are ruined by overheating.

Yep, I've had quite a few actually melt the carbide tip.

 

[TheBig1]

Yep ...the good old 'black' brick.
Break one in half and the center is black as coal and seriously hard

basically vitrified sand....aka glass

 

[cmcardle75]

That would depend on the age of the property, every house that I have lived in was built well before the introduction of concrete or thermalite blocks.
Don't know what an SDS drill bit is but I have had serious problems drilling into walls with the bits that I have used and not always cheap ones.

Ah yes, but there was only a brief period between the introduction of cavity walls and concrete inner leafs. I guess you have a penchant for 1930s properties?

I would reckon that the cheapest £1 SDS drill bit will drill into hard brick masonry about 50 times faster than the most expensive standard masonry bit ever made. Quite frankly, an SDS bit made out of cheese would drill faster than a standard masonry bit. It's about the joules per hammer.

 

[TheBig1]

Yep ...the good old 'black' brick.
Break one in half and the center is black as coal and seriously hard

It used to be a builder's joke if a young labourer wanted to learn to be a brickie. The old boy shows him how to crack a brick off using a trowel, them give them a few black bricks to try with. Quite amusing really and a typical Pee take

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[pappajohn]

My most detested job .....drilling 6" fan duct holes especially through black bricks.
Professional heavy duty SDS drill and a 6" carbide tipped core bit.
Longest time through both skins of the wall....3.5hours Inc a few breaks to allow drill to cool and me get blood back in my arms .
After that we started using diamond core bits.

 

[TheBig1]

Don't know what an SDS drill bit is

It is a special design and unlike a basic masonry bit with straight sides along it's length. At the drill end of an SDS bit, the drill is thicker and has slots ground in that locate in a special chuck. This increases the available torque at the drill tip. A big rotary hammer SDS drill uses this to best effect and has at least double the hammer effect of an ordinary hammer drill

 

[TheBig1]

My most detested job .....drilling 6" fan duct holes especially through black bricks.
Professional heavy duty SDS drill and a 6" carbide tipped core bit.
Longest time through both skins of the wall....3.5hours Inc a few breaks to allow drill to cool and me get blood back in my arms .
After that we started using diamond core bits.

back before diamond core bits came down in price, we hired them in for jobs like that. It was brutal work and the drills had a very hard life

 

[pappajohn]

back before diamond core bits came down in price, we hired them in for jobs like that. It was brutal work and the drills had a very hard life

A lot easier on the ears too!

 

[MattR]

I'm tempted to 'stick' the piece of wood onto the wall and then add the curtain rail...

How heavy are your curtains?

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[cmcardle75]

It is a special design and unlike a basic masonry bit with straight sides along it's length. At the drill end of an SDS bit, the drill is thicker and has slots ground in that locate in a special chuck. This increases the available torque at the drill tip. A big rotary hammer SDS drill uses this to best effect and has at least double the hammer effect of an ordinary hammer drill

It's a bit more than double. The SDS slots allow the drill to give it a proper whack. A "hammer" drill, OTOH, just gives it a bit of a wobble. Probably 1/100th the energy.

 

[cmcardle75]

I have an identical drill by a different name. Well 2 actually as it happens, as after a few years hard use one became slightly temperamental and as I suspected a motor fault bought a replacement. The old one then decided to work again when next tried. So must be a wire or switch issue

Yes, I had one of those. The cheap motor eventually burnt out after 5 or 10 years, so I bought the next model up, which was lighter in weight, more ergonomic layout, with more Joules per hit and had a touch sensitive trigger. Still cheap as chips and 100 times faster than the most expensive conventional "hammer" drill. I still have a decent "hammer" drill, but the hammer is always off and it is used as a high quality twist drill. I wouldn't buy an expensive SDS drill, as I abuse them.

 

[2657]

Ah yes, but there was only a brief period between the introduction of cavity walls and concrete inner leafs. I guess you have a penchant for 1930s properties?

I would reckon that the cheapest £1 SDS drill bit will drill into hard brick masonry about 50 times faster than the most expensive standard masonry bit ever made. Quite frankly, an SDS bit made out of cheese would drill faster than a standard masonry bit. It's about the joules per hammer.

Don't know about a brief period, both houses were pre 1900 and both had cavity walls.
The second had the inner skin turned on edge to save bricks and the outer skin was 9" solid, built about 1880.

 

[cmcardle75]

Don't know about a brief period, both houses were pre 1900 and both had cavity walls.
The second had the inner skin turned on edge to save bricks and the outer skin was 9" solid, built about 1880.

Most pre 1st World War properties with cavity walls were when walls were buried in the ground for damp protection. Perhaps you live in a part of the country where is was common even earlier. My parent's house (around 1890) did have cavity walls, but only on the lower ground floor, which is underground at the front, but very much above ground at the rear. Above that level, it reduces to 3 brick solid, then 2 brick solid for the further two floors above that.

Cavity walls in most of the country weren't particularly common generally (i.e. above ground) until around the 1920s. And breeze (produced by the new coal power stations), and later, Portland concrete, became common soon after.

 

[2657]

Most pre 1st World War properties with cavity walls were when walls were buried in the ground for damp protection. Perhaps you live in a part of the country where is was common even earlier. My parent's house (around 1890) did have cavity walls, but only on the lower ground floor, which is underground at the front, but very much above ground at the rear. Above that level, it reduces to 3 brick solid, then 2 brick solid for the further two floors above that.

Cavity walls in most of the country weren't particularly common generally (i.e. above ground) until around the 1920s. And breeze (produced by the new coal power stations), and later, Portland concrete, became common soon after.

Both our houses were pre 1900 and both had full cavity walls at both levels above ground, in Rochdale.

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[mitzimad]

earliest i expect there to be cavity walls is 30s around london