LifePO4 not made in China (PRC)?

[Guigsy]

Yeah. The US pretty much ignored LFP and only worked on NMC. And now there's little expertise in LFP outside China.

A similar story is playing out with iron oxide flow batteries.

 

[Rob Hammond]

I think you will be very lucky to get a LiFePO4 made outside of China the moment as their patents have only just expired from what I understand.

Do the Chinese care about patents

 

[Nigel Crompton]

Eleksol, Made in Spain ...

 

[Guigsy]

Do the Chinese care about patents

Patents aren't global. So basically, no.

 

[Raul]

Eleksol, Made in Spain ...

Only the sticker, there is no LFP cells production anywhere in Europe. All we do in the west at best is a box and assembly. And of course the sticker.
But is even cheaper to subcontract t the lot in China, and majority of battery re sellers that's what they do.

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[Nigel Crompton]

Does NorthVolt in Sweden not count as European ?

 

[Gromett]

Only the sticker, there is no LFP cells production anywhere in Europe.

I believe there are factories producing LiFePO4 cells in Europe?

Freyr in Norway I believe have a production line running now?
I think NorthVolt in Sweden have are starting up LiFePO4 Cells?

Verkor and ACC in France are in process but not sure if they are in production yet.

Early days yet though. I think the patents only ran out fully in 2022 and it takes a while to build factories.
Apparently the licensing fees for the patents were too expensive for investors to take it seriously and demand is cranking up now.

 

[Rob Hammond]

I believe there are factories producing LiFePO4 cells in Europe?

Freyr in Norway I believe have a production line running now?
I think NorthVolt in Sweden have are starting up LiFePO4 Cells?

Verkor and ACC in France are in process but not sure if they are in production yet.

Early days yet though. I think the patents only ran out fully in 2022 and it takes a while to build factories.
Apparently the licensing fees for the patents were too expensive for investors to take it seriously and demand is cranking up now.

So cheaper batteries?

 

[Raul]

I admit I was not up to speed with the new Factories in Europe. The closest to mass production I thought was the Gigafactory in Germany. It looks like several enterprises started to gear up after 2022. But, there is allot of catch up since China has already mastered the mass production, and by the time west gets there, China will kill the competition by sheer volume and low price.
Let's hope for some superior product in power and energy density, then we will have a choice.

 

[Gromett]

So cheaper batteries?

I doubt Europe will be cheaper. But It will give a supply for car manufacturers.
For motorhome, home storage etc I doubt we will beat the chinese any time soon.

The price of Lithium cells has dropped by HUGE!!!! amounts in the last 3 years.

£70 for 305AH cell is incredible and I suspect there is further to fall.

Envision LiFePO4 305Ah Prismatic Cell (Grade B)

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[Platelet]

Similar with BMW scooters, Kymco (Taiwan) make the engines but have bmw stamped on them. Funnily enough Kymco make a very similar scooter!

 

[Peregrinator]

Majority of the cells are made in China, most battery manufactures and sellers in Europe and the US use Chinese cells in their batteries, Jenny Wu in China does good deals on cells if you want to put one or together, but you must ask for grade 1 cells, for instance this deal was in August, Dollar = £1

Jenny Wu Docan Technology Grade A EV LF280K 6000 cycles lifepo4 3.2V 280Ah battery 4 Piece(s) US $ 100​