Leisure Battery - Dropped to 11.3v - shutting down :-(

[PaulC70]

OK, so the iNet Truma messaged me this morning to say the heater had no 12v power. Now the heater wasn't actually on but the control panel was so that there was power to the inet and I could text it and check on status etc.

So, now I go to the van and the control panel has an interrmittent beep and saying leisure battery is low. I do have a solar 100w panel charging this but Im going to hazard a guess here and say that a combination of

a) poor solar charging from low winter sun and some overcast days

versus

b) Leaving the heater control panel on as well as the habitation master panel on (albeit no lights etc on)

plus

c) last month having a Growler fitted and a battery master to keep the starter battery topped up from the leisure battery

are all conspiring against me?

Pictures of my setup below. Im wondering what my best course of action is.

 

[PaulC70]

I should say I've not used the motorhome since 8th December and it's parked in the sun most of the day and I don't have access to EHU at home sadly.

 

[Lenny HB]

100 watt should be able to keep the batteries topped up, could be your leisure battery is at the end of its life.
Don't understand why you had a Batterymaster fitted when you have a dual output solar controller. If you had wired that up as it should be the leisure & starter batteries would have both been topped up from the solar.

Edit:
Where is the Solar controller mounted? It should be close to the leisure battery also the cable to the controller look very undersize to me the ones to the battery need to be a lot larger especially if it is not close to the battery.

 

[funflair]

I think your problems will be a combination of your suggestions,

low winter sun on the solar so generating next to nothing coupled with leaving stuff on as a constant drain, we were in a similar position to you when we had our Flair although that was to do with it being under cover, my solution was to fit an EFOY fuel cell which worked a treat, we now have the Palace and again stored under cover so you could assume the same issue as before but now we have Lithium batteries with very low self discharge so I trip the power to the van from the batteries and use a VB battery master to top up the starter battery, our alarm/tracker system reports starter battery voltage and I know that the Lithium will be OK for a few months like this from the monitoring that I have done.

 

[funflair]

100 watt should be able to keep the batteries topped up, could be your leisure battery is at the end of its life.
Don't understand why you had a Batterymaster fitted when you have a dual output solar controller. If you had wired that up as it should be the leisure & starter batteries would have both been topped up from the solar.

Edit:
Where is the Solar controller mounted? It should be close to the leisure battery also the cable to the controller look very undersize to me the ones to the battery need to be a lot larger especially if it is not close to the battery.

Do you really think that 100w panel would cope Lenny? we might need to know the draw over 24hrs from the van control panel and the heater panel being left on, our van would use at least 25amps in a 24hr period with just the control panel, re battery master and dual output regulator? sometimes I think it is easier to use a Battery Master when the +ve for both batteries are right next to each other.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[PaulC70]

100 watt should be able to keep the batteries topped up, could be your leisure battery is at the end of its life.
Don't understand why you had a Batterymaster fitted when you have a dual output solar controller. If you had wired that up as it should be the leisure & starter batteries would have both been topped up from the solar.

Edit:
Where is the Solar controller mounted? It should be close to the leisure battery also the cable to the controller look very undersize to me the ones to the battery need to be a lot larger especially if it is not close to the battery.

I certainly hope that they battery isn't at the end of the life as the van was registered last February and the leisure battery has been fine up to now.

As for the battery master I wanted this instead of the panel splitting it's charge between the 2 batteries, figured if the panel is charging the leisure battery then the battery master will take care of starting worries.

the controller is in the cupboard a couple of metres away from the LB and is all as was setup by Bailey, I've not messed with any of that.

 

[PaulC70]

I think your problems will be a combination of your suggestions,

low winter sun on the solar so generating next to nothing coupled with leaving stuff on as a constant drain, we were in a similar position to you when we had our Flair although that was to do with it being under cover, my solution was to fit an EFOY fuel cell which worked a treat, we now have the Palace and again stored under cover so you could assume the same issue as before but now we have Lithium batteries with very low self discharge so I trip the power to the van from the batteries and use a VB battery master to top up the starter battery, our alarm/tracker system reports starter battery voltage and I know that the Lithium will be OK for a few months like this from the monitoring that I have done.

Im hoping it is the fact that Ive basically been draining more power in "standby" than the panels been able to supply. I've turned everything off properly now and will leave the sun (which has been all day today) to see if any power is recovered by this time tomorrow.
I am thinking the simplest way forward will be to leave everything off in future (reducing drain) and go for a wee drive one a week or fortnight to top up when not using for longer periods.

 

[Kannon Fodda]

Over the last month or two from my 100W solar, despite a MPPT controller, I have been lucky to see 30W in a day, and frequently much less. That is only just able to deal with the parasitic draw from stuff that doesn't quite switch off such as the MPPT controller and smartshunt, and drain to the engine battery via the battery master. If you have other 12V stuff running, including Truma systems, the 100W solar just isn't going to cope at this time of year, especially if the panel might be part shaded.

About once every three weeks at this time of year I connect the van to EHU so as to recharge the hab battery.

Remember that a "wee drive" will possibly not put enough into the batteries. Even if you have a B2B you will need a good hour or so for a meaningful recharge, and most manufacturer systems will be less than that possibly only 15A, so if you had a 100Ah battery 50% used you could need well over 3 hours. At 11.3V on a lead-acid type battery you probably have 20% charge left if that, and lead-acid lifespan can deteriorate rapidly if discharge is over 50% regularly.

 

[Guigsy]

Even on sunny days, my 180w panel is only making about 10w at the moment. And only for an hour or so. It's not enough and my battery goes flat in a couple of weeks.

 

[TCG]

Maybe a silly question but is your solar panel clean. it does make a difference especially in the low winter sun

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[David and Sally]

100 watt should be able to keep the batteries topped up, could be your leisure battery is at the end of its life.
Don't understand why you had a Batterymaster fitted when you have a dual output solar controller. If you had wired that up as it should be the leisure & starter batteries would have both been topped up from the solar.

Edit:
Where is the Solar controller mounted? It should be close to the leisure battery also the cable to the controller look very undersize to me the ones to the battery need to be a lot larger especially if it is not close to the battery.

Battery two is not connected

 

[donkey]

the controller is in the cupboard a couple of metres away from the LB and is all as was setup by Bailey, I've not messed with any of that.

I suggest that was installed by a dealer. I would expect Bailey to make a much neater job of the wiring than that.
Dealers seldom have decent electricians on their staff.
Having said that, those solar cables should be able to cope with the theoretical maximum of about 8amps, in reality a lot less for most of the time.

Geoff

 

[Richard n Ann]

If you can fit hinges on the panel and angle it south it will give a much stronger charge. In Benidorm when the sun gets lower our panel output goes from about 3 amps to virtually full power (9 amps) when tilted.
Just another option

 

[PaulC70]

Maybe a silly question but is your solar panel clean. it does make a difference especially in the low winter sun

It is indeed.

 

[GeoffnDee]

Are you sure that the duel solar controller is set correctly ? I think you will find that model can be set to send a % of charging between two separate batteries and it may be set to send charge through to the terminals that are not being used instead of 100% to the leisure battery.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[PaulC70]

Are you sure that the duel solar controller is set correctly ? I think you will find that model can be set to send a % of charging between two separate batteries and it may be set to send charge through to the terminals that are not being used instead of 100% to the leisure battery.

Pretty sure but something for me to certainly double check when I find the instructions

 

[BillandHelen]

Are you sure that the duel solar controller is set correctly ? I think you will find that model can be set to send a % of charging between two separate batteries and it may be set to send charge through to the terminals that are not being used instead of 100% to the leisure battery.

That’s correct. We had the same unit on our previous van and a percentage split of charge can be chosen between starter and leisure. However from the picture the starter battery is not connected to the solar?

 

[Kups]

I certainly hope that they battery isn't at the end of the life as the van was registered last February and the leisure battery has been fine up to now.

As for the battery master I wanted this instead of the panel splitting it's charge between the 2 batteries, figured if the panel is charging the leisure battery then the battery master will take care of starting worries.

the controller is in the cupboard a couple of metres away from the LB and is all as was setup by Bailey, I've not messed with any of that.

The leisure battery might be a problem too. We bought a new Adria in August 2020 but had to wait until October 2020 for the DVLA to register it. This time last year the leisure battery voltage dropped alarmingly as did the starter battery despite ther being a 140 W solar panel plus split charger installed. I went to the storage site (when allowed in lockdown) and removed both batteries, gave them the extended benefit of my CTEK charger. Both took some time to recover but the hab battery was the slowest to respond. I suspect that this took a battering (excuse the pun) between manuacture and my use. Probably went flat at one stage in storage but no way of telling.

I've since done a belt and braces upgrade and installed a new hab battery plus having a Van Bitz battery master installed. Hey presto no more problems.

 

[Arnside037]

Are you sure that the duel solar controller is set correctly ? I think you will find that model can be set to send a % of charging between two separate batteries and it may be set to send charge through to the terminals that are not being used instead of 100% to the leisure battery.

And in addition, shouldn't both the green lights be on, if its set up correctly, iecharging both batteries. Am i right in thinking that if the light is steady, then no charge is being generated, (as one might expect in low light winter weather), and if they are blinking furiously, then current is geing generated. So shouldnt both lights be displaying the same characteristics? So why is only one of yours on?

 

[David and Sally]

And in addition, shouldn't both the green lights be on, if its set up correctly, iecharging both batteries. Am i right in thinking that if the light is steady, then no charge is being generated, (as one might expect in low light winter weather), and if they are blinking furiously, then current is geing generated. So shouldnt both lights be displaying the same characteristics? So why is only one of yours on?

Isthat because only one battery is connected so no charge going to #2?

Manual says if no second battery then all charge goes to #1 regardless of split setting.

Charging Current Distribution; Pwm Charging Frequency - Truma SDC 10 Operating Instructions & Installation Instructions [Page 21]

Truma SDC 10 Manual Online: charging current distribution, Pwm Charging Frequency. The Charging Current Distribution Between Battery 1 And Bat- Tery 2 Can Be Set. The Following Distributions Can Be Selected. Query – Press (T) Until Led H4 Illuminates; The Saved Value Is Shown In...

www.manualslib.com

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[donkey]

Not saying that is your problem, but that Truma controller looks identical to a 'cheap' chinese PWM unit I once had. OK but a few miles away from the best.

Geoff

 

[Richard n Ann]

The votronic duo power usage is only 6ma if I recall correctly

 

[Richard n Ann]

Wow I've either not recalled correctly or they've improved it

 

[Arnside037]

I must correct my earlier post in respect if the led flashing.

LED flashes...Battery is fully charged.
LED shines.... The battery is being charged.
LED flashes in short intervals ... The battery is not being charged.
If necessary, replace faulty battery.
LED does not shine... Battery not connected or over-voltage

Always something new to learn on MHF !

 

[Lenny HB]

Battery two is not connected

Isn't that what I was pointing out.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[David and Sally]

Isn't that what I was pointing out.

Reread. Yes Just checking.

 

[two]

Battery capacity reduces with age, and significantly if maltreated (heavy or deep discharge or left discharged for long periods).
Before using battery monitors, I used to read the (Lead Acid) habitation battery Voltage and try to keep it above 12.5V, never letting it go below 12.2V. 12.5V - 12.7V is a "healthy" value. 12.2V - 12.5V should be considered as a "reserve". Anything below 12.2V is damaging.
As batteries age, you will need to top up more frequently. There's no point in continuing once they're back to capacity. So, rather than going for a long run every three or four days, say, you will need to go for a (shorter) run more often. Where you originally had 80Ah at your disposal, say, this might reduce to only 40Ah. That's still useable but it would not last as long, nor take as long to replace. Once your capacity is insufficient to comfortably last a day, it's time to replace them.

 

[PaulC70]

Mini update, after turning everything off and the sun on the panel the LB is currently up to 12v

 

[donkey]

Mini update, after turning everything off and the sun on the panel the LB is currently up to 12v

Up to 12v?? And you are pleased?

Geoff

 

[funflair]

Well up anything is better than still going down BUT PaulC70 if you are taking the reading when there is sun on the panel it may/will not be a true reflection of the battery voltage as you need to read after it has rested without any charge for half an hour, unless your 11.3v was under the same conditions then it is a useful comparison but again not a true battery state.

And as suggested above "it's still flat"

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}