Is it OK to park overnight in car parks?

[Avery]

Hi folks,
I appreciate that this might be a bit of a touchy subject... but please bare with me as I am new to both the forum, and to motorhomes. In fact I haven't even bought one just yet.

I am thinking about living in a motorhome to save money for a year or two.

--> Is it OK to park in random public car parks overnight?

I would be doing this in south west Devon, like the west side of Dartmoor etc.
I would leave the spot first thing each morning, to get to work.

I would be very grateful if you could share your thoughts about this... especially if you have done this sort of thing before!

Thanks for reading, and Merry Christmas to all of you.

 

[monzer]

@Avery

The question you have asked is a bit of a touchy subject on here so I hope it doesn't put you off.

If you want to abide by every law and legislation there is then you are probably screwed for doing a bit of full timing in your van.

If you don't mind cutting a few corners here and there then you should be fine. Keep a low profile, find a nice quiet spot somewhere and get your head down for the night. I doubt very much if you will have any problems doing what it is you want to do.

 

[sonny]

More seriously still, reading of the Byelaws (link was provided) rather than just the indicative statement would have shown it to be perfectly clear that camping is not allowed anywhere in the national park except where expressly committed - and that it is a breach of the byelaws even to take a vehicle where there is no right of way.

Camping in the park might not be allowed but parking is

 

[Bailey 15]

Seriously thou, and not sure where you work, is it worth the hassle?
Like others have said find a CL or something, ask some sweet farmer, you might want to save but you have to live as well or you won’t be fit enough to enjoy what you’ve saved for.

 

[GJH]

Camping in the park might not be allowed but parking is

Parking may well be allowed. However, the OP asked for advice about camping overnight not simply parking the van in the evening, leaving it, returning the next morning and driving away.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[sonny]

The difference between parking and camping is what.?

 

[funflair]

The difference between parking and camping is what.?

I think my post at #18 explains it correctly, but the regulations are linked and you can read it for yourself if you like and see if you agree.

If you are living in the van it's camping

Martin

 

[Barclaybasher]

There can't be many carparks that motorhomes could be safely left unattended overnight.

Stolen or damage or theft from might not be covered by insurance

I think it would be sensible to remain with the vehicle overnight......................not camping of course

 

[sonny]

There are great swathes of Dart moor where you can wild camp . You are not allowed to sleep in a vehicle overnight in laybyes or car parks but does not mention on the grass ,so park your van and pitch your tent.For ref check parking on Dartmoor

 

[SpeedyDux]

Using car parks for accommodation purposes isn't practical for a number of reasons. It's "OK" if you don't get caught and fined. That might dent your savings.

Whether it is "OK" from a legal perspective depends on the local bye-laws applicable to the Council's or other Authority's car parks; in the case of private car parks it depends on the owner's rules or terms and conditions. In 99% of these situations overnight parking and sleeping in the MH is in breach of some regulation or condition so you would risk a fine or other hefty charge.

Whether you can keep a low profile or be tolerated by locals and officials or even fit into a standard parking space could depend on the kind of motorhome you are looking to buy. Most coachbuilts are too big and will attract attention. A very small panel van can fit but the decals, windows and external accessories prevent most of them from being "stealthy". Locals are more aware of the Traveller community taking over car parks and causing trouble, so that knock on the door by officials is quite likely.

Alternatively:

On the industrial estate near where I live there is a handful of small older motorhomes and self-built van conversions, and the odd caravan too, that are parked on the street from Monday to Friday but are gone at the weekend. These are probably workers who need the jobs but their home is too far to commute so their motorhome or caravan is cheaper than a B&B or rent-a-room. They seem to be tolerated. There is a new Police "custody suite" on the same industrial estate so it is reasonably secure.

Maybe you could do something similar then go to a CS or CL for the weekend.

At the other end of the spectrum are the permanent van dwellers that have become notorious in parts of Bristol. They are at risk of the Council forcing them to move or even seizing their old vans and caravans. Recently the local news has reported several instances where caravans and vehicles have been burnt to a crisp. It isn't clear if this was arson by fed-up locals, or they just caught fire. Either way it looks like their "van life" choice is under threat.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[SpeedyDux]

There are great swathes of Dart moor where you can wild camp . You are not allowed to sleep in a vehicle overnight in laybyes or car parks but does not mention on the grass ,so park your van and pitch your tent.For ref check parking on Dartmoor

If only it was so simple. Driving more than 15 yards off a highway is an offence. If you drive along or across a footway or bridleway that is also an offence. If you camp or light a fire on common land that is an offence. And so on.

In the UK almost every piece of land has an owner so any parking or camping without permission is a trespass, for which the owner has civil remedies although clamping has been banned on private land.

I know that many MHers do wild camp regularly and there are places where this is common practice and tolerated. I don't wish to provoke a debate on that, but from a legal perspective I am pretty certain that no right as such to wild camp exists in England. Which includes Devon and Cornwall.

 

[GJH]

The difference between parking and camping is what.?

If you read the article I posted a link to in post #13 there is a full explanation. You could also try searching on here for the dozens of times it has been explained before.

There are great swathes of Dart moor where you can wild camp . You are not allowed to sleep in a vehicle overnight in laybyes or car parks but does not mention on the grass ,so park your van and pitch your tent.For ref check parking on Dartmoor

There are various provisions in the byelaws mentioned previously which would make long term camping (in tents as well as in vehicles), of the type for which advice was sought, difficult at the very least.
The two posts above from @SpeedyDux provide sensible advice.

 

[Barclaybasher]

Parking may well be allowed. However, the OP asked for advice about camping overnight not simply parking the van in the evening, leaving it, returning the next morning and driving away.

As far as I know there is no requirement to actually leave your vehicle whilst parked.

.

 

[TerryL]

After all the discussion, views put forward etc. it would be interesting to see how the OP now feels about it?

So @Avery what do YOU think?

 

[Drexxer]

So @Avery what do YOU think?

Confused .com!

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[jollyrodger]

Perhaps Baskerville hounds have got him

 

[monzer]

You've scared him off with all your negativity.

Article 2(1) Paragraph 357 of the caravan act this.....

and you'll need to get proper full timer insurance that......

 

[SpeedyDux]

You've scared him off with all your negativity.

Article 2(1) Paragraph 357 of the caravan act this.....

and you'll need to get proper full timer insurance that......

Surely not! He's probably busy buying a new Autotrail. Big price reductions at the dealers, so I've heard.

 

[GJH]

As far as I know there is no requirement to actually leave your vehicle whilst parked.

.

Perhaps you ought to read some parking orders. Many do include such a requirement.
In any case, as we are all aware (or should be) it is a moot point in this instance.

 

[Barclaybasher]

Perhaps you ought to read some parking orders

Could you publish one?

Shouldn't such a condition (leaving your vehicle unattended) be included clearly in signage?

I have read the T&Cs of a private carpark operator and no such condition was included.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[GJH]

Could you publish one?

Shouldn't such a condition (leaving your vehicle unattended) be included clearly in signage?

I have read the T&Cs of a private carpark operator and no such condition was included.

Yes I could publish one but why should I bother when people are quite capable of doing it for themselves?
As pointed out time after time, it is simply impossible for signage to carry all the conditions in a parking order.
So what that the T&Cs of one operator do not have that requirement? As pointed out in the part of my post that you chose not to quote it is many operators which include such a requirement, not all.

 

[tacr2man]

If vehicle "parked" in a bay , and someone knocked on door and you were not visible and did not respond , how would they decide "camping" as AFAIK there is no provision in any order etc for power of entry ? Further more if there was a cat in a box and you did not look etc

 

[Barclaybasher]

Yes I could publish one but why should I bother when people are quite capable of doing it for themselves?
As pointed out time after time, it is simply impossible for signage to carry all the conditions in a parking order.
So what that the T&Cs of one operator do not have that requirement? As pointed out in the part of my post that you chose not to quote it is many operators which include such a requirement, not all.

So many carpark operators ban drivers and passengers from remaining in their vehicles having observed the rules set out on the signs at the carpark and having paid the parking fee?

Really?

 

[GJH]

So many carpark operators ban drivers and passengers from remaining in their vehicles having observed the rules set out on the signs at the carpark and having paid the parking fee?

Really?

I think the problem is that you keep mistaking me for somebody who actually still sets any store by your posts.

 

[GJH]

If vehicle "parked" in a bay , and someone knocked on door and you were not visible and did not respond , how would they decide "camping" as AFAIK there is no provision in any order etc for power of entry ? Further more if there was a cat in a box and you did not look etc

There is, undoubtedly, a problem as some LAs have discovered. It was that very problem (and the attendant abuse of the regulations) that led to a total ban on motorhomes during certain hours in Whitby and other places.
Of course, there may well be some motorhome owners who don't give a damn that their abuse adversely affects others.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Barclaybasher]

I think the problem is that you keep mistaking me for somebody who actually still sets any store by your posts.

But you reply............................but have no answers

 

[EssexBoy]

But you reply............................but have no answers

You have seen Grahams avatar, haven't you Vic?

I think the key thing is that there is no one repository for parking regulations/rules/by-laws etc, so unless an individual makes a specific enquiry about a specific place, at a speciifs time with the specific LA then everything else is just generalisation/guidance...

Then, just heap more confusion, add in the ability of our law enforcement services to do their job, then the laws become "optional", the only worry being "law break events"/"caught" ratio...

 

[Barclaybasher]

You have seen Grahams avatar, haven't you Vic?
I think the key thing is that there is no one repository for parking regulations/rules/by-laws etc, so unless an individual makes a specific enquiry about a specific place, at a speciifs time with the specific LA then everything else is just generalisation/guidance...Then, just heap more confusion, add in the ability of our law enforcement services to do their job, then the laws become "optional", the only worry being "law break events"/"caught" ratio...

.........................And then there was commonsense ......................

 

[Eggs]

Back to the original post, how do you plan on charging batteries and emptying and filling water/toilet unless you can do those things at your place of work. In the summer solar would do the batteries but you aren't going to get much power for 5-6 months of the year.

 

[EssexBoy]

.........................And then there was commonsense ......................

That was banned years ago... Far too dangerous

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Barclaybasher]

That was banned years ago... Far too dangerous

............................commonsense................ some of us till try and use it.............