Is it necessary to do a drain down?

[Harrietliberty]

I've read through the forum on how to do a drain down and also about people using their motorhome extensively during the winter but can't find anything about at what temperature it really needs to be done. We live in Devon and the winters tend to be quite mild and we are hoping to use it occasionally before Christmas for odd days and also (lockdown restrictions permitting) to go and see our son in Leeds at Christmas. Is there a temperature at which it is definitely advisable to do a drain down because if so, we could keep an eye on the weather and do it if the forecast showed we were likely to be close to that temperature. (We're retired so can easily do it at short notice)

 

[jollyrodger]

Also being a Devon resident and lucky enough to have the van plugged in to ehu at home I'm of the no drain down fraternity butt the van is in use most days of the year. I do use sterilising tabs or a little Milton, even flushed with diluted calgon tabs.
I don't drink from the tank (habit from way way back)
The tank has a lagging jacket on and and safety valve never activated
A small o/f radiator is on a timer and often sleep in it at home (Im told I snore!! ) and I don't have to watch repeats of call the midwife

 

[Cass18]

I never drain down - just leave the heating set at 5 degrees. When I was a tugger I used to leave a greehouse heater on frost setting in the van. TBH it's a long time since we had enough frost here to do any damage.

I’m a newbie and bit challenged with this kind of stuff !! To leave the heating on at 5 degrees etc means leaving gas on ( ours is in storage outdoors and sign says make sure gas turned off. Ours is 2007 Rapido itineo. Grateful for any info regarding this please ?

 

[M-J]

Takes 5 minutes so why not just do it, doesn’t really increase the time to get sorted if you decide to use the MH. I also pop the waste tank inspection cap off and back on as it holds a small amount of water in the cap even when empty.

 

[Smudger27]

As soon as I hear that there is a hint of frost I dump the water. I don't want any water in my pipes. Sometimes I fill up the day before going away in winter & for that night I put my little portable radiators on.

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[Ian Bosman]

Ours is a 2003 Ace Capri (Fiat Ducato base) 2.00 L Diesel

The Truma Combi's have a drain down feature which can mean all your water drains away if too cold but above freezing. Hence a reference to a clothes peg to hold the valve in the up position

 

[Harrietliberty]

Thank you for all our input - we will probably drain down and then refill if we go away for a night or so

 

[tonyidle]

I’m a newbie and bit challenged with this kind of stuff !! To leave the heating on at 5 degrees etc means leaving gas on ( ours is in storage outdoors and sign says make sure gas turned off. Ours is 2007 Rapido itineo. Grateful for any info regarding this please ?

I have Alde heating left on EHU. In the past I used a greenhouse heater on frost setting.

 

[two]

I think dump valves operate at 4°C, so I'd set the heating a little higher than 5°C to cover a margin of error.
If it dumps and the pump is on, it may be left running until it expires.

 

[Minxy]

I’m a newbie and bit challenged with this kind of stuff !! To leave the heating on at 5 degrees etc means leaving gas on ( ours is in storage outdoors and sign says make sure gas turned off. Ours is 2007 Rapido itineo. Grateful for any info regarding this please ?

Just drain it down and ensure that it's all out of the pipes and leave the taps in the central open position and you shouldn't have a problem, no need to put heating on.

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[Northern Boy]

I am very new to all this MH stuff and I live in Estonia where from sometime around November to March we may well see temperatures as low as -30 degrees C but an average of -5 to -15 C.
I plan to keep an electric connection (EHU) as the MH is in my garden with a fan heater set at frost setting as well as draining down everything. I guess my tanks are internal as I cant see any under the MH, its a 2007 Fiat Hobby 600.
I plan to use the MH through the winter (as long as we can get out as sometime we get snowed in!) and will just fill up with say 10 litres of water for a days outing so we can flush the WC, we wash up at home later and drink from bottled water.
Will the WC cassette be ok with blue in it? or should I drain that too if used?
Any further advise would be most welcome as I am like a sponge soaking up information these early days of ownership.

 

[62272]

Drain down after everytrip. It takes minutes to do, and saves pipes with mould in. Empty out and drain boiler too. Before winter i flush through with steriliser (Chlorine) and open taps up (with electrics off) to drain out pipework. Leave fresh water tank top open until all dry inside (a couple of days with dehuimidifier running). We always use a separate 5lt container for drinking/kettle Purposes, and never from the tanks.

 

[Vanman]

You guys make me laugh, because it's an easy quick job in your van / circumstances you assume it's the same for everyone.

All this mouldy pipe stuff I find amusing too, where is mould more likely, in an empty pipe or one full of treated water? How often do you guys drain down your domestic house water pipes ... ?

Then you've got air locks when refilling and I've even heard of people damaging their boiler accidentally running it with no water in.

 

[Deep Owl]

I drain down after every trip, so no stale water in the tanks. And blow all pipes through with the Floe , particularly before closing down, so no chance of freezing. Floe is very quick, the adapter permanently before the pump, pressurise with 12v tyre pump, open a tap and FFFFFFFFFsh! And repeat till all taps dry including hot water tank with drain cock open ; very easy.

 

[two]

I keep my vehicle in a workshop. If the dump valve operates I get the contents of the boiler all over the floor (it happened once) and that's a lot of water...
I'd like to remind those who drain down to remove the filter cover by the pump. They can crack if the water in them freezes. The slightest crack may be impossible to see but you'll know if you keep getting air in the system when you start up again. Best to empty it and put it back straight away, to avoid forgetting to do so later (or losing it in the meantime).

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[autorouter]

I’m a newbie and bit challenged with this kind of stuff !! To leave the heating on at 5 degrees etc means leaving gas on ( ours is in storage outdoors and sign says make sure gas turned off. Ours is 2007 Rapido itineo. Grateful for any info regarding this please ?

The swimming pool professionals drain down the pool and pipes, and blow out all the pipes with compressed air, to prepare for winter frosts. You're trying to do that with the motorhome, if it's left in storage during a freezing period.

There should be drain taps on the hot and cold water pipes, and a drain valve (probably with automatic frost protection) near the water heater. Run the pump to pump out water from the pipes and taps, and the toilet flush valve. Leave taps open, set mixer taps to the centre position so that both hot and cold are open. Turn off the pump switch, or turn the 12V off if there's no pump switch.

If you like tinkering, you could add a tee into the pipe from the pump, and add a shutoff tap and a tyre valve (Schrader valve). Then you can attach a tyre compressor, preferably the digital type that cuts off, set to about 20psi, so it doesn't overstress the water heater. Then blow out the water from the pipes using that. It's a bit over the top, though - most people don't do that. You can pay for a professional system by Floe, to do this, if you really want.

 

[NoName]

I've read through the forum on how to do a drain down and also about people using their motorhome extensively during the winter but can't find anything about at what temperature it really needs to be done. We live in Devon and the winters tend to be quite mild and we are hoping to use it occasionally before Christmas for odd days and also (lockdown restrictions permitting) to go and see our son in Leeds at Christmas. Is there a temperature at which it is definitely advisable to do a drain down because if so, we could keep an eye on the weather and do it if the forecast showed we were likely to be close to that temperature. (We're retired so can easily do it at short notice)

My Goddaughter is in her final year at Leeds Uni and she advised me that they were in lockdown. Combined with Lytham St Annes also in lockdown, another destination, I aborted my trip to the North at Shrewsbury.
I'm hoping to head to Canterbury in mid November, so no drain down.

 

[Vipar]

I drain down after every trip, so no stale water in the tanks. And blow all pipes through with the Floe , particularly before closing down, so no chance of freezing. Floe is very quick, the adapter permanently before the pump, pressurise with 12v tyre pump, open a tap and FFFFFFFFFsh! And repeat till all taps dry including hot water tank with drain cock open ; very easy.

Excuse my ignorance what is a Floe?

 

[two]

I don't think there's a risk of freezing just yet. Probably greatest Jan/Feb.

Draining down is to protect the expensive bits from damage (boiler, pump, taps, showerhead). The boiler will be protected by the dump valve unless it's been overridden with a clip or something. Pipework is less likely to suffer if there's only a bit of water in it and not too expensive to replace (probably awkward though). Give everything a good flushing in the Spring (Chlorinate first if you must). We all do what we're comfortable with.
If damage from freezing was a common problem, we'd be hearing much more about it.
At the moment, I'm more concerned about keeping away from Covid rather than Jack Frost.

 

[Minxy]

Excuse my ignorance what is a Floe?

Linked to previously:

In colder areas is simply draining the system enough or is one of these required?

floe-motorhome-draindown-kit-for-inboard-water-tanks

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[two]

Excuse my ignorance what is a Floe?

A rather large person with a good set of lungs.

I think...

 

[Deep Owl]

Excuse my ignorance what is a Floe?

Something a polar bear sits on!

See #45 for a good explanation of the principle, and #49 for the link.

 

[TheBig1]

The whole freezing issue is worse for underslung water tanks, as in below the van. With a cold windy day, there can be sufficient wind chill beneath the van to freeze any water in the tanks. Water expands a great deal as it freezes, the least damage it will do is push apart pipe fittings. At worst it can split the water jacket on the water heater.
One thing not mentioned so far is the fact that modern systems have non return valves so the water does not flow back to the tank to drain. This leaves the plastic mixer taps prone to splitting too along with the shower head. After draining down, I leave the kitchen tap open and the shower mixer valve too. Then I remove the shower head and blow down the shower pipe. This ejects any water in the pipes out of the sink tap. When dry, I open all the taps and mixers set to half way to allow for some expansion if I missed any water

 

[thebriars]

You guys make me laugh, because it's an easy quick job in your van / circumstances you assume it's the same for everyone.

All this mouldy pipe stuff I find amusing too, where is mould more likely, in an empty pipe or one full of treated water? How often do you guys drain down your domestic house water pipes ... ?

Then you've got air locks when refilling and I've even heard of people damaging their boiler accidentally running it with no water in.

Domestic house water pipes generally don't need draining down unless you the house is unoccupied for a period of time as there is a constant flow of water through daily. If away for a period of time, then it is sensible to run the taps for some time to flush the pipes out. Most house insurances do insist you do drain down water systems if away for any length of time, or leave the heating on.

Air locks should not be a problem if the plumbing is installed correctly, and my Truma boiler is quite happy with it being run with no water in it.

 

[Puddleduck]

We drain down after every trip as I don't want bugs growing in any stagnant water. It does mean we have to fill with water before every trip but that can be done as I am making up beds and stocking fridge.

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[TheBig1]

Back when I was working, we got an emergency call to a house that had been empty for a few weeks with no heating on during a very cold snap. On entering the door, there was ice and water all down the stair carpet. Upstairs a section of ceiling had fallen. The tank in the loft froze and split allowing all the unfrozen water and insulated mains feed to pour out for who knows how long. A couple of days work to repair, but was weeks before it was dry enough to be lived in again

 

[Hammie]

I drain down, as a matter of practice, after every trip; why wouldn’t you and particularly through the winter months?

Ian

me too because I don’t want to be using dodgy water If it has stood for a couple of weeks. I only use the aquasol to disinfect when I refill the tank after it being empty and open. Am I being too cautious?

 

[Keypresser]

I drain down and use an 80W tube heater in the living area on ehu.
Only costs a few pence per day.
If you have an external shower point don't forget to drain that too.

 

[Minxy]

I am very new to all this MH stuff and I live in Estonia where from sometime around November to March we may well see temperatures as low as -30 degrees C but an average of -5 to -15 C.
I plan to keep an electric connection (EHU) as the MH is in my garden with a fan heater set at frost setting as well as draining down everything. I guess my tanks are internal as I cant see any under the MH, its a 2007 Fiat Hobby 600.

Unless you have a double floor MH it is extremely unlikely that your waste tank will be inside so best to find it if you can. There is quite a debate about whether it is sensible to have heating on in a MH as warm air actually holds more moisture so can actually encourage dampness, however with the temperatures you experience not having some heating may not be the best course of action therefore others who live in a similar situation with the possibility of such low temperatures can hopefully advise more appropriately.

I plan to use the MH through the winter (as long as we can get out as sometime we get snowed in!) and will just fill up with say 10 litres of water for a days outing so we can flush the WC, we wash up at home later and drink from bottled water.
Will the WC cassette be ok with blue in it? or should I drain that too if used?

If you use a squirty bottle/sprayer with water in to rinse the loo bowl and wet-wipes to clean your hands you won't need to put any water in at all. As for the cassette, I can't see any problem leaving some blue in it as it won't expand much, so long as you empty it when you return it shouldn't really be necessary to put any blue in anyway, but if you feel you need to why not jut pop a little sufficient for the volume of wee you are likely to 'put' into it.

 

[Hammie]

Unless you have a double floor MH it is extremely unlikely that your waste tank will be inside so best to find it if you can. There is quite a debate about whether it is sensible to have heating on in a MH as warm air actually holds more moisture so can actually encourage dampness, however with the temperatures you experience not having some heating may not be the best course of action therefore others who live in a similar situation with the possibility of such low temperatures can hopefully advise more appropriately.


If you use a squirty bottle/sprayer with water in to rinse the loo bowl and wet-wipes to clean your hands you won't need to put any water in at all. As for the cassette, I can't see any problem leaving some blue in it as it won't expand much, so long as you empty it when you return it shouldn't really be necessary to put any blue in anyway, but if you feel you need to why not jut pop a little sufficient for the volume of wee you are likely to 'put' into it.

I remember reading that people were using either a dishwasher tablet or Ariel bio in the cassette in order to flush it down a domestic loo. Which was it please?

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[Andacami]

I remember reading that people were using either a dishwasher tablet or Ariel bio in the cassette in order to flush it down a domestic loo. Which was it please?

Ah, a whole other topic of strenuous debate...