Inverters - How Big? How to Fit? How to Use?

HKF said:
We mostly don't but I did buy a Remoska not long ago, so I can now take that with me. In fairness, due to all sorts of different issues, we haven't been away in the MH much at all. It's just a rather expensive ornament :rolleyes:
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Are you hoping to use that on the inverter too? That will be 400 watt usage and I guess could be on for quite a length of time depending on what you are cooking.
 
VXman said:
Are you hoping to use that on the inverter too? That will be 400 watt usage and I guess could be on for quite a length of time depending on what you are cooking.
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They don't have a thermostat so they are drawing 400 watts continuously, with only a 100ah battery you would use over a third of the total battery power in an hour.

A small 1000 watt air fryer would be a better choice although its a 1000 watt because it's thermostatically controlled they only use about a third of that power and cook food in a very short time compared to a Remoska.
 
Derbyshire wanderer said:
It’s unfortunate that you have a fear of using the gas appliances but leaks are extremely rare if the system has an annual leak test. Using obviously should never be unattended, so again low real risk and a working smoke detector should be fitted anyway. Also a fire blanket is a good idea for extra piece of mind.
Regarding carrying a spare, as you have a quality Webasto unit, I would rely on its quality and have a service every 2 years (or once a year maybe if used a lot) rather than a spare. The Chinese spare idea is more of having an identical model to swap out but as you have a Webasto, it shouldn’t be necessary. Should you decide a spare is the answer then swapping out is undoing 4 nuts, 3 pipe clips and the wiring connection point and then all in reverse. Different brands though will likely have controller wiring differences and complicate things when in a field somewhere.
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Thank you for your advice about the Diesel heater. We won't really be going away when it's freezing cold, so maybe I should just have more faith in the Webasto now that it's been fixed. As my husband says, if it gets too cold, we'll just come home or book into a hotel :)
 
Lenny HB said:
They don't have a thermostat so they are drawing 400 watts continuously, with only a 100ah battery you would use over a third of the total battery power in an hour.

A small 1000 watt air fryer would be a better choice although its a 1000 watt because it's thermostatically controlled they only use about a third of that power and cook food in a very short time compared to a Remoska.
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Thank you. I have SO much to learn!!
 
VXman said:
Are you hoping to use that on the inverter too? That will be 400 watt usage and I guess could be on for quite a length of time depending on what you are cooking.
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I was planning on that, yes. But Lenny HB has now explained why it's not a great idea (thanks LennyHB :) ). MHing is SOOOOOOO complicated!!! :rolleyes: :unsure: :ROFLMAO:
 
If you haven’t already got one get an insulated windscreen cove, more heat is lost through there than the rest of the van, in colder weather just before you turn the engine off put the cab heater on recirculating it will stop cold air entering the van through the cab heater. Only a little but it all helps, why not get a fan heater than will let you select 500 watts, although less heat less strain on the battery.
 
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Re the gas safety, as our van is kept in our garage the solar does not keep the batteries topped up so we can remotely turn the charger on when needed. In the colder months we leave the gas heating on to keep the van from getting damp as it is always packed and ready to go as we use it all year round have done the last 4 years, no different than sleeping in the van with the heating on. We have a wifi gas alarm and can switch the gas off remotely so no worries on that score. When you take into account how many vans are on the road and with respect some older ones may well not have their systems checked regularly the standard layout for gas systems is pretty robust. We are fitted with 2 underslung gas tanks and all pipe work is copper I still check the whole system with a gas sniffer at least 4 times a year. But you must do what is best for you that gives you the most reassurance.
 
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Bessy765 said:
If you haven’t already got one get an insulated windscreen cove, more heat is lost through there than the rest of the van, in colder weather just before you turn the engine off put the cab heater on recirculating it will stop cold air entering the van through the cab heater. Only a little but it all helps, why not get a fan heater than will let you select 500 watts, although less heat less strain on the battery.
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We actually bought a windscreen cover at the NEC last year but haven't had chance to use it yet. Thanks for your advice re the cab heater! Yes, a lower wattage heater might be an option for emergencies.....thanks :)

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Bessy765 said:
Re the gas safety, as our van is kept in our garage the solar does not keep the batteries topped up so we can remotely turn the charger on when needed. In the colder months we leave the gas heating on to keep the van from getting damp as it is always packed and ready to go as we use it all year round have done the last 4 years, no different than sleeping in the van with the heating on. We have a wifi gas alarm and can switch the gas off remotely so no worries on that score. When you take into account how many vans are on the road and with respect some older ones may well not have their systems checked regularly the standard layout for gas systems is pretty robust. We are fitted with 2 underslung gas tanks and all pipe work is copper I still check the whole system with a gas sniffer at least 4 times a year. But you must do what is best for you that gives you the most reassurance.
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I'm just wondering what issues people think they will face with gas in their MH ?

Carbon monoxide poisoning is the one that springs to mind, but that would be when there were people in the MH and most people will have a carbon monoxide detector anyway. So while the MH is left unattended it ain't really a problem ?

A gas leak into the MH from a loosened fitting ? Well yes that is a faint possibility, which would only be a problem if the propane gas reached a level at which it is an explosive mixture, I'm thinking that on our vehicle the gas would drop out (it's heavier than air) through the low level vents at the doorstep. Mind, if the gas did reach an explosive mixture and you then had a spark, say from something you activated remotely, or came on via a timer, then there might be a loud bang and only bits left of your MH !

A gas powered appliance, say a heating system, becoming overheated and bursting into flames ? Quite unlikely, as it is designed to operate with flames inside it and it should have over temperature protection anyway. As long as it is operated within manufacturers instructions, like don't cover it with anything.

The bolded bit above, what do you use as a gas sniffer ?
 
I think your worries about gas are unfounded.

I also think you should not bother with the inverter. You have a nice diesel heater and if goes wrong then I would go for a campsite EHU and if needed in the immediate short term go for a drive with the cab heater on.

Back to the gas issue, if you are not happy with it left on, then turn it off when you have finished cooking. The cooker probably has its own gas stop tap under the rings, so turn that off.

You could also fit a Truma Mono Contol CS as well for extra peace of mind.

We had an inverter in our last van. But, we have not bothered fitting it this time. We are enjoying life with lithium batteries that now seen to last half of forever.

We do have a small 300 watt pure sine wave inverter to charge the technology which won't charge off 12 volt or USB.
 
I think you need to look at how you use (or how you want to use) your motorhome.
  • How many nights off-grid at a time?
  • Will you drive every day? (and what spec battery charger have you got, a split relay or a B2B charger?)
  • Spring to Autumn, or Winter as well?
  • Will the battery be fully charged at home before you set off?
REMOSKA
Hopefully you are now well practised with the Remoska so you will know what you are likely to cook in the MH; Mrs CAB reckons between 30-60 minutes per use depending on what delights she is cooking for our dinner.

Taking the max as 1 hour, and assuming 20% inefficiency (so the 400 watt Remoska takes 480w from the battery):

480 Watts @ 12v = 40 Amps current from the battery (Power / Voltage = Current).

So 1 hour usage = 40 Ah (Amp-hours).

KETTLE
Your 1 kW kettle is (I'm assuming) 1 litre, looking online it looks to be about 6 minutes to boil. Again, using 20% for inefficiencies.

1.2 kW (1200 watts) @ 12v = 100Amps. So for 6 minutes, that is 10 Ah per full 1 litre kettle. Obviously cut in half if only a 500ml kettle or only 1/2 full.

The diesel heater (assuming working!) will be anything from 5-10 Ah from what I read, depending on how long you have it on for, other uses will be pretty low (charging phones, hopefully you have all LED lighting?) assuming your fridge is 3-way and on gas.

So by my calculations, you will easily get one full night off grid in winter, even with a slap-up Remoska meal and lashings of tea!

Two would be possible with simpler meals (precooked stew, chilli etc).

SO:
In spring/summer/autumn you will get some or all of that back from the sun; there are probably calculators, there is plenty of expertise on here as to how much your panels are likely to give you.

In any case, if 1 or 2 nights when there is no sun is enough for you, even better if you are driving in between, you have enough power, by my calculations.

If I were you, I would get the inverter installed, charge up the battery at home, and then spend the weekend off-gridding on your driveway. Tea, coffee, porridge, lights, charging tablets, diesel heater blowing, HKF's Remoska specialties, the works.

You won't damage the battery, that's what the BMS is for. If it cuts out midway through the Chicken-a-la-phooey on the second night, at least you can take it indoors to finish off!

You have the power, use it!!
 
My two pence worth is; Use the tools you have, as in the gas cooker, heater, hot water etc. Gas systems are fitted to a high standard, probably more so than normal housing standard. All cooking, hot water in ours is gas. I cook more or less the same as I do at home, roast to stir frys, If unsure when you next go on a campsite get a neighbour to walk you through it, it's a simple system really. Good luck.

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I mean we'll when I say have you thought about speaking to someone regards your fear / dislike of the gas situation. It may sound trivial to us but if you are really concrened then you won't be sleeping.

Get over that and things will get much easier.

I second the vote for an air fryer though in the meantime, even small 700w microwave.
 
CAB96 said:
I think you need to look at how you use (or how you want to use) your motorhome.
  • How many nights off-grid at a time?
  • Will you drive every day? (and what spec battery charger have you got, a split relay or a B2B charger?)
  • Spring to Autumn, or Winter as well?
  • Will the battery be fully charged at home before you set off?
REMOSKA
Hopefully you are now well practised with the Remoska so you will know what you are likely to cook in the MH; Mrs CAB reckons between 30-60 minutes per use depending on what delights she is cooking for our dinner.

Taking the max as 1 hour, and assuming 20% inefficiency (so the 400 watt Remoska takes 480w from the battery):

480 Watts @ 12v = 40 Amps current from the battery (Power / Voltage = Current).

So 1 hour usage = 40 Ah (Amp-hours).

KETTLE
Your 1 kW kettle is (I'm assuming) 1 litre, looking online it looks to be about 6 minutes to boil. Again, using 20% for inefficiencies.

1.2 kW (1200 watts) @ 12v = 100Amps. So for 6 minutes, that is 10 Ah per full 1 litre kettle. Obviously cut in half if only a 500ml kettle or only 1/2 full.

The diesel heater (assuming working!) will be anything from 5-10 Ah from what I read, depending on how long you have it on for, other uses will be pretty low (charging phones, hopefully you have all LED lighting?) assuming your fridge is 3-way and on gas.

So by my calculations, you will easily get one full night off grid in winter, even with a slap-up Remoska meal and lashings of tea!

Two would be possible with simpler meals (precooked stew, chilli etc).

SO:
In spring/summer/autumn you will get some or all of that back from the sun; there are probably calculators, there is plenty of expertise on here as to how much your panels are likely to give you.

In any case, if 1 or 2 nights when there is no sun is enough for you, even better if you are driving in between, you have enough power, by my calculations.

If I were you, I would get the inverter installed, charge up the battery at home, and then spend the weekend off-gridding on your driveway. Tea, coffee, porridge, lights, charging tablets, diesel heater blowing, HKF's Remoska specialties, the works.

You won't damage the battery, that's what the BMS is for. If it cuts out midway through the Chicken-a-la-phooey on the second night, at least you can take it indoors to finish off!

You have the power, use it!!
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Thank you SO much!!!! That's really informative and explains a lot for me :) We definitely need to think more about how we might use the MH. I can't see us 'staying' away in mid-winter but there is the possibility that we may be 'going' away to warmer climes. So, we may have the odd night en route to somewhere and might need to be off-grid. Based on what you say, we should be ok. However, rather than 'should be', I'd rather it were 'will be' so I'm with you about getting an inverter fitted anyway, so I'll feel a little more confident in being able to do what we choose to do rather than having to change plans because we're not set up properly Lots to think about!! We're hoping to get the heating on tomorrow and just spend some time in the MH, to try to get a feeling of wanting to go away in him again. Oh, btw, most of our lights are LEDs :) We also do have a 3-way fridge/freezer but I've never had it running on gas yet. If I feel brave enough, I might try that tomorrow. Thank you again for your wonderful reply!! :) xx
 
HKF said:
Thank you SO much!!!! That's really informative and explains a lot for me :) We definitely need to think more about how we might use the MH. I can't see us 'staying' away in mid-winter but there is the possibility that we may be 'going' away to warmer climes. So, we may have the odd night en route to somewhere and might need to be off-grid. Based on what you say, we should be ok. However, rather than 'should be', I'd rather it were 'will be' so I'm with you about getting an inverter fitted anyway, so I'll feel a little more confident in being able to do what we choose to do rather than having to change plans because we're not set up properly Lots to think about!! We're hoping to get the heating on tomorrow and just spend some time in the MH, to try to get a feeling of wanting to go away in him again. Oh, btw, most of our lights are LEDs :) We also do have a 3-way fridge/freezer but I've never had it running on gas yet. If I feel brave enough, I might try that tomorrow. Thank you again for your wonderful reply!! :) xx
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Definitely use it on the driveway as if you were in the middle of nowhere, just don't lock yourself out of the house :ROFLMAO:
 
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Tombola said:
I mean we'll when I say have you thought about speaking to someone regards your fear / dislike of the gas situation. It may sound trivial to us but if you are really concrened then you won't be sleeping.

Get over that and things will get much easier.

I second the vote for an air fryer though in the meantime, even small 700w microwave.
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I'm absolutely terrified of fire, and the thought of being trapped in the rear transverse bed and not being able to get out is petrifying. I've no idea how I can get over that :(
 
HKF said:
I'm absolutely terrified of fire, and the thought of being trapped in the rear transverse bed and not being able to get out is petrifying. I've no idea how I can get over that :(
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I can understand that, my wife hated being in the overcab bed and couldn't sleep.

But, keep in mind if there is something /out there to help.
Meanwhile, good luck with the inverter and batteries, you'll be fine.

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HKF said:
We also do have a 3-way fridge/freezer but I've never had it running on gas yet. If I feel brave enough, I might try that tomorrow. Thank you again for your wonderful reply!!
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3 way fridges are very inefficient running on electric be it 12v or 240v, much more efficient on gas and they get colder on gas.
 
A small crock pot is ideal for low power use cooking and a potential addition to your armoury ....
 
Lenny HB said:
3 way fridges are very inefficient running on electric be it 12v or 240v, much more efficient on gas and they get colder on gas.
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Having chucked ours out and gone to compressor was in hindsight a very good decision. Much better IMO.
And now having chucked the Truma LPG combi and put diesel combi in even better.
And now thinking of replacing the gas hob with induction 😎
 
RogerIvy said:
Having chucked ours out and gone to compressor was in hindsight a very good decision. Much better IMO.
And now having chucked the Truma LPG combi and put diesel combi in even better.
And now thinking of replacing the gas hob with induction 😎
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I agree the compressor fridges and freezer on our boats were better in my view and quite frugal (helped by the keel coolers I guess) just a lot of money to swap out the 3 way we have on the van or I would do it - I also liked the "hydronic" diesel heating and water system with a decent sized twin coil (engine and eberspacher) calorifier and 240v element, like an Alde system on steroids. I wish electric cooking could displace the need for any gas at all, but full sized ovens etc do use a lot of energy, so another round of new battery technology is needed to be gas free I think....

Have you tried Venus 3.2 yet?
 
HKF said:
I'm absolutely terrified of fire, and the thought of being trapped in the rear transverse bed and not being able to get out is petrifying. I've no idea how I can get over that :(
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Very difficult to overcome these fears, my fear is heights. I would drop out of the bedroom window if I got trapped, do you have a window? I also keep a water mist fire extinguisher by the bed that should clear a path out if needed.

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Cant remember the last time I cooked on gas.
the only thing stopping me having the gas hob and oven removed is the resale of the van, would it put others off ?
 
I've had a gas leak, external pipe.
Happily cooking on gas, keeping warm & hot water on gas, fridge running on gas - all with a gas leak :eek: before I really noticed.
No fire, no explosion, just a replacement pipe.
 
Tombola said:
Cant remember the last time I cooked on gas.
the only thing stopping me having the gas hob and oven removed is the resale of the van, would it put others off ?
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Next time we buy a new cooker for the home it will be all gas. :giggle:
 
Pausim said:
Very difficult to overcome these fears, my fear is heights. I would drop out of the bedroom window if I got trapped, do you have a window? I also keep a water mist fire extinguisher by the bed that should clear a path out if needed.
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There's a window either side. I guess I could just about squeeze through it but I also sleep with our little dog and I'd have to drop her out of the window, which would no doubt cause her injury. So many worries go through my mind :(



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