Gas Tank Replacement Rule & Certificate Denial

[Kemerton527]

Have been told today by service engineer that my gas tank is just over ten years old so he will not give me a gas safe certificate , new regulations are if your tank is ten years old you have to have it replaced, can’t find any up to date news on this, as anybody heard the same

 

[funflair]

I think that you have missed my point or I did not make it very clear.
There are already requirements set out in UK Law (Acts/Regulations etc) for the design and maintenance of pressure vessels, gas tanks and cylinders, this is enforced by the Health and Safety Executive (HSE). The HSE do not provide in their Acts/Regulations, every detail of the requirements, instead they use Industry codes, guidance and standards to prescribe the requirements and they then enforce those requirements using the Acts/Regulations.
So while it is not unlawful for an individual to continue to use a LPG cylinder that does not meet the requirements of the industry codes of practice, is certainly is unlawful for a service provider to, for example, provide a van owner with a gas safe certificate for a cylinder that does not meet the requirements or a LPG supplier to knowingly refill such a cylinder.

So is all this tank replacement malarkey going to have the opposite affect re gas safety by putting people off having a gas safety check as they know it will cost them a new tank even when it looks as good as new, I would guess that when a 10 year old system is checked more have leaking pipework and controls than have well protected tanks that are actually likely to leak or fail in any other way.

I wonder what are the statistics for gas tank failures other than external rust?

 

[Mikeco]

Absolutely nothing to do with Autogas 2000 .
We have always advised customers that Underslung LPG tanks and all refillable LPG cylinders / bottles had a 10 year lifespan.
Unfortunately many people didn’t read the paperwork.
The biggest change was probably when Liquid Gas wrote to everyone confirming that user owned refillable tanks and cylinders were subject to the same rules as any other commercially owned ones.
This was around the time I took over Autogas 2000 and along with others contributed to hopefully making the industry safer.
Every year especially as the weather warms up we will see both cylinders and tanks leaking, tanks especially are prone to corrosion when not maintained and go porous eventually fizzing and bubbling on the surface as liquid state gas seeps out .
We would be pretty negligent if we chose to ignore the industry advice especially as it would almost certainly be the Same professional experts that would give evidence to any hearing in the event of an incident.

In 2012 the advice that I received from Autogas 2000 was to inspect the tank in 2022, before your time though.

 

[PeterCarole29]

When my underslung lpg tank arrived, the first thing I did was to lightly scuff up the red coating and then give the tank several spray coats of a rubberised anti-stone chip coating.
View attachment 1014164
View attachment 1014166

I made mounting brackets out of 6mm steel bar that the tank is fixed too and these brackets have sixteen 8mm bolt bolting them to the vans chassis cross members. If for any reason the the tank straps fail (which are also coated in anti-stone chip), then the tank can not fall from it’s mounting frame.
View attachment 1014163

It looks like you have done a real good job very neat and thought out .
I was on the understanding Normal compression and olive joints were not advisable with the vibration of a moving vechicle or is that just inside a van in consealed areas

 

[wireman]

Calling Basildog. Are you Autogas 2000? We had you (probably the previous owner) to fit our Alugas 11kg system some 9 years ago so will see you next year. One question; how reliable is the fitted contents gauge and can it be moved via anything to make it easier to see? Mine needs a contortionist to see or the mobile phone picture at arm's length?

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[Speve]

@ in front of name wireman if you do Basildog when you message it will tell him you are trying to call him

 

[Basildog]

Calling Basildog. Are you Autogas 2000? We had you (probably the previous owner) to fit our Alugas 11kg system some 9 years ago so will see you next year. One question; how reliable is the fitted contents gauge and can it be moved via anything to make it easier to see? Mine needs a contortionist to see or the mobile phone picture at arm's length?

I am guessing that you have the older style 4 hole Alugas cylinder ? Square gauge on the top of the cylinder ?
The newer Multivalve version is easier to see if installed facing the front

 

[pappajohn]

S

I've just check the Gas-It technical pages and this is their up to date information.

"Under UK law, privately owned end-user owned refillable gas bottles or gas tanks now need to be legally tested every 10 years as normal exchange type gas bottles are and we can't stress how important this is."

Hopefully this confirmation message from Gas-It (Autogas 2000 ~ Basildog) will put the lid on this subject.

Still doesn't explain WHO will be testing them though.

 

[SVMC15]

S

Still doesn't explain WHO will be testing them though.

I think that it is a lot cheaper to replace than get it dismantled, tested and new gear fitted, hence why you may not be able to find a company to carry it out.

 

[wireman]

I am guessing that you have the older style 4 hole Alugas cylinder ? Square gauge on the top of the cylinder ?
The newer Multivalve version is easier to see if installed facing the front

Nope, it is the later (I think) one with three outlets and the gauge has two ways of seeing the display. One facing straight up and the other normally facing outwards. I take photos of the gauge one which faces up as the outward-facing one is badly set to see. Basically it's right in the back of the place where it is. It means I have to stretch the full length of my arm which is nearly 900mm with a little help from turning sideways whilst trying to get a photo. I have just celebrated my 70th and have multiple issues with stretching due to damage in a motorbike accident 18 years ago. I also have to bend a fair way as I am 6 feet 4 inches tall and that is getting really difficult. I suppose I could wait till next year now as I just got my C1 licence back....

Thanks for looking.

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[Pausim]

Still doesn't explain WHO will be testing them though.

I think the answer was no one, not cost effective. At 10 years they have to be replaced.

Last year I bought a new Safefill which only had 9 years left, the dealer knocked a big chunk off the price because it would need replacing sooner.

 

[Basildog]

In 2012 the advice that I received from Autogas 2000 was to inspect the tank in 2022, before your time though.

Having made enquiries on your behalf my understanding is that your paperwork should still have the requirements to inspect / retest @ 10 this would always have required the removal of the tank and replacement of pressure relief valve etc , years as has always been the case.
I have today contacted people in the industry and can confirm that there is absolutely no company in the UK that will undertake the testing and refurbishment of either refillable tanks or cylinders and it is unlikely there ever will be in the future.

 

[Mikeco]

Having made enquiries on your behalf my understanding is that your paperwork should still have the requirements to inspect / retest @ 10 this would always have required the removal of the tank and replacement of pressure relief valve etc , years as has always been the case.
I have today contacted people in the industry and can confirm that there is absolutely no company in the UK that will undertake the testing and refurbishment of either refillable tanks or cylinders and it is unlikely there ever will be in the future.

Thank you for your reply, now wondering when testing was last available, if it ever was for this product.

 

[Basildog]

I've just check the Gas-It technical pages and this is their up to date information.

"Under UK law, privately owned end-user owned refillable gas bottles or gas tanks now need to be legally tested every 10 years as normal exchange type gas bottles are and we can't stress how important this is."

Hopefully this confirmation message from Gas-It (Autogas 2000 ~ Basildog) will put the lid on this subject.

I have managed to remove that information from the Gas It knowledge base today.
That information was inherited by us , we will get it changed.
It is not currently possible to have any refillable tank or cylinder tested in the UK ( That we are aware of)

 

[Basildog]

S

Still doesn't explain WHO will be testing them though.

I have removed that information from the Gas It knowledge base and we will shortly revise it .
As far as we are aware there is not any recertification / testing, valve replacement available in the UK .

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[Mikeco]

I have removed that information from the Gas It knowledge base and we will shortly revise it .
As far as we are aware there is not any recertification / testing, valve replacement available in the UK .

Do Autogas 2000 offer any discounts when purchasing a new tank due to no testing being available.

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