Gas, Refillable or Exchange Bottles??

[Dave Scadding]

Hi, having just got our first motorhome can any one please advise whether to install a gasflow system or buy a refillable type gas bottle or continue with the calor exchange system? Assuming we are "average" gas users travelling mostly in the UK (or at least most of the time)

 

[denisejoe]

After the initial outlay it is much cheaper to use refillable bottles. Also it saves lifting heavy bottles in and out of the van.

Denise

 

[MichaelT]

Refillable bottles or tanks every time your choice which one. We have Gaslow and are happy with it, we have a calor light as a backup in case we run out. Filled up the other day 10l of gas for £5.70. You may use more in a MH due to fridge cutting in when parked up and you may use more off grid stops like CL's, pubs etc.

 

[MillieMoocher]

Refillable is cheaper for the gas but the initial outlay is pretty hefty.

We have Gaslow fitted, can’t really justify it on cost but it is SO much more convenient, especially with 2 bottles. One is empty, swap over and fill the other when you can. No heaving bottles in and out of a gas locker that always seems awkward.

Plus if you do decide to go abroad, with the right adaptor you can fill abroad too as opposed to having to buy local bottles with appropriate regulator.

But even my best man maths couldn’t justify the initial investment from a financial angle..however still one of the better add-ons we put on the van.

 

[mike mcglynn]

We were delighted to find a gaslow system fitted when we bought this van its so much easier and a lot cheaper ,and no heavy bottles to lug to the shop and back .I know they are an expensive option but well worth it.

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[scotjimland]

There is no doubt if you are a heavy gas user re-fillable is the way to go and if you also plan long trips abroad, it's the best way... short trips abroad it's not required, we toured Europe for many many years in both camper vans and caravans without re-fillables.

So, much depends on your use.. if you primarily use sites in the UK with EHU and you use electric heating , gas consumption is quite low .. if you are an off site camper then gas use will be higher .. especially in winter

Another factor is availability of Autogas.. Calor can be found in just about every UK town and village.. Autogas is widely available, but there are places, especially in the Highlands and Island of Scotland where it is less so.

I fitted 2 x11kg Gaslow in my motorhome and it was excellent.. particularly abroad, but I won't be fitting in my caravan as we now mainly using sites and EHU, we have 240v space and water heating, and cooking, so gas use is low, refillable would't be cost effective ..

I appreciate it's not just cost, there is also the convenience of not lifting heavy bottles, but laying out £500 for Gaslow buys a lot of Calor.. it would take years for me to break even.. and exchanging a 6 kg propane bottle is not heavy lifting.


As for a single refillable bottle.. I would forget it.. many garages won't allow filling them..

Bottom line.. There is no "one size fits all' or 'best' system for for everyone.. tell us how you plan to tour, using sites or not and if using all year or not .

 

[The Dotties]

I couldn't justify the cost of new, I would never get the investment back, but second hands systems come up on FUN fairly regularly, and are well worth considering.
I've just bought a two bottle gaslow system complete off here at a good price.
Should I change the van it will come with me, or eventually sell at little loss, but for convenience, no contest.

 

[Dave Scadding]

Thanks all for your responses, I guess its a case of see how we get on with exchange. We haven't spent our first night in it yet so maybe my question was a little premature however I know some of the pros and cons now.

 

[WynandJean]

Exchange Calor = £27ish. Refilling at pump = £5ish.

Wyn

 

[scotjimland]

Exchange Calor = £27ish. Refilling at pump = £5ish.

Wyn

To fill an 11kg re-fillable bottle, (22L) with Autogas at 70p/L = £15.40

a 13kg Calor Propane is £34.50 .. = £1.32 per liter

so Calor is roughly twice the price of Autogas ...

so buying Autogas you are saving of 62p per litre..

doing the maths..

You would need to buy 806 Litres of Autogas to break even on the refillable install

that's a lot of Autogas.. about 36 refills.. of an 11kg bottle ! ..

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[Zigisla]

With Calor approx £22 more expensive than a refillable set up, it will be approx 20 + exchanges before you get your money back - If that's an issue for you. So if you are a really low usage user, it wont be financially viable for an age. If, like many and I include myself in this bracket, it is for convenience and ease of filling abroad, you will reap the benefits very soon. As we already had calor bottles, we opted for a single re-fallible Gaslow bottle and use the calor for back up. In the 2 years we have had the set up, we have never even started on the calor bottle - auto change over, as we fill up when low - just keep an eye on it.

 

[scotjimland]

Thanks all for your responses, I guess its a case of see how we get on with exchange. We haven't spent our first night in it yet so maybe my question was a little premature however I know some of the pros and cons now.

That is a good plan..

Having used both systems, I've tried to give a reasoned argument for both .. I hope it was helpful..

I only went down the re-fillable path as we were touring abroad a lot and it was easier having refillable.. I had Gaslow for three years but it never ever payed back the capital cost ..

Before that I had an LPG tank and it was very good, but useless when we toured Morocco as they don't have Autogas yet.. so I had to go back to buying bottles and feeding the gas in via a BBQ point..

Another point to ponder.. An LPG tank or refillable bottles are not so handy if staying on a Spanish site for the winter, when you run out it means dismantling the awning, packing up to go and refill, .. Repsol gas is sold on every site and very cheap.. a BBQ point is useful for using the local bottles.

 

[The Dudess]

Another point to ponder.. An LPG tank or refillable bottles are not so handy if staying on a Spanish site for the winter, when you run out it means dismantling the awning, packing up to go and refill, .. Repsol gas is sold on every site and very cheap..

This is a very valid point, which is why we have 1 x refillable cylinder and 1 x Spanish gas bottle, which we bought 2nd hand on ebay.

 

[Go Humberto!]

I made a short video on (1) Filling a GAS IT LPG system and (2) The economics of permanent LPG tanks versus my old Calor set up.

The economics are based on 2 years with a GAS-IT system, 9 refills, and 142 nights use.

>> LPG Video Here <<

I'm willing to be corrected on the maths but I'd never go back to calor, however you do the maths it's too bloody expensive and inconvenient. My break even point is 191 nights use which means my GAS-IT system will have paid for itself this summer.

Everyone's break even point is different. We use a lot of Aires, without 240V, so our heating is 100% Gas. In Summer, abroad, we tend to run the fridge on gas as it is more effective at cooling.

Over the course of 2 years we have paid, on average, £1.07 per Kg of LPG (54p a Litre, although it is now 60p near us)

 

[scotjimland]

we tend to run the fridge on gas as it is more effective at cooling.

In my experience, 240v mains is as good as LPG, and on mains there is virtually no maintenance required, other than cleaning the condenser. No sooty chimney to brush or burner to clean.. ignition or flame failure devices to go wrong.. win win

Having upgraded to a caravan.. we mainly use sites with EHU our LPG consumption is very low, mainly used for the Weber Q BBQ , In fact , this past year we didn't even use a 6kg bottle of propane.. so no point in refillable.

When we had the motorhome I fitted twin 11kg Gaslow bottles, which was great for touring abroad.

as I said earlier..

There is no "one size fits all' or 'best' system for for everyone..

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[Blue Knight]

We've just added a Gaslow system and we now just pull up and fill - it's fantatsic.

No more humping and dumping of bottles for us albeit the points by the guys above are certainly very pertinent.

 

[two]

I'd wait a bit. You will not have the information you need to make a decision yet. I assume that the reason you have asked is financial and you cannot calculate that until you know your usage. The reason I have chosen refillables has been convenience, particularly travelling abroad (which does not yet apply to your circumstances). I now use SafeFill bottles for the weight saving (something else you may not have considered?).

 

[Badknee]

If you have space for two bottles of whatever you choose put an auto change over in there but always have one bottle turned off.
The reasoning behind this is when one bottle runs out you will know about it as nothing will work. If you have them both turned on you could in theory totally run out of gas when the empty one has switched over.
We’re on gasit with a 45ltr underslung tank so have to keep an eye on the gauge after a month or six weeks as we’re fulltimers.

 

[Go Humberto!]

I'd wait a bit. You will not have the information you need to make a decision yet. I assume that the reason you have asked is financial and you cannot calculate that until you know your usage. The reason I have chosen refillables has been convenience, particularly travelling abroad (which does not yet apply to your circumstances). I now use SafeFill bottles for the weight saving (something else you may not have considered?).

Agreed, it's all about usage, and the value you put on convenience. In our case having permanent LPG tanks justifies itself on both counts but I wouldn't have bothered if we used just 6Kg a year.
If your usage means that it would pay for itself in a reasonable amount of time then clearly it makes sense.

Our plans in 2019 mean lots more time abroad, potentially full-time, and plenty of off-grid stopovers. Permanent LPG tanks suit that lifestyle and are cost-effective very quickly.

>> VIDEO <<

 

[PeteH]

There is no doubt if you are a heavy gas user re-fillable is the way to go and if you also plan long trips abroad, it's the best way... short trips abroad it's not required, we toured Europe for many many years in both camper vans and caravans without re-fillables.

So, much depends on your use.. if you primarily use sites in the UK with EHU and you use electric heating , gas consumption is quite low .. if you are an off site camper then gas use will be higher .. especially in winter

Another factor is availability of Autogas.. Calor can be found in just about every UK town and village.. Autogas is widely available, but there are places, especially in the Highlands and Island of Scotland where it is less so.

I fitted 2 x11kg Gaslow in my motorhome and it was excellent.. particularly abroad, but I won't be fitting in my caravan as we now mainly using sites and EHU, we have 240v space and water heating, and cooking, so gas use is low, refillable would't be cost effective ..

I appreciate it's not just cost, there is also the convenience of not lifting heavy bottles, but laying out £500 for Gaslow buys a lot of Calor.. it would take years for me to break even.. and exchanging a 6 kg propane bottle is not heavy lifting.


As for a single refillable bottle.. I would forget it.. many garages won't allow filling them..

Bottom line.. There is no "one size fits all' or 'best' system for for everyone.. tell us how you plan to tour, using sites or not and if using all year or not .

Pretty much what I think too, in that the choice is around just how much gas consumption the individual uses. I am on full EHU on the drive at present and we are using virtually no gas except for cooking. But, during a particularly wet/cold period back in the Spring "off grid" we used 2 full 6Kg in a week!. My first R-V had 2 120litre LPG tanks, used to fill about once a year!.

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[Cheshirecat57]

Yes, depends on gas quantity you use,BUT...most of the justification-calculations above assume the refil system or the refillable bottle is worthless the second you buy it
This is not the case
Try buying a second hand safefill bottle for example.

Also, those using exchange bottles, how many of you have weighed them at point-of-sale?? I think you might be shocked at the number which are not full

 

[Chipster]

Certainly couldn't justify refillable on cost alone. I guess, as is always the case, you pay for convenience. We have twin 11 Alugas and it's so convenient just to top up as and when, not gambling if a 3/4 empty bottle might just get us through a last minute weekend dash away.

 

[scotjimland]

Also, those using exchange bottles, how many of you have weighed them at point-of-sale?? I think you might be shocked at the number which are not full

Must confess, I have never done that. Was this Calor Gas ?

I worked at a Calor Gas bottle filling plant, maintaining and calibrating the bottling plant.

After filling, bottles are check-weighed and any out of spec, ( either under or over ) removed.

So a bit surprised that anyone would actually weigh at point of sale , and that you found them underweight..

This is the type of Calor Gas Bottling Carousel I worked on..

 

[Cheshirecat57]

Yes
Two occassions
Two locations

Both sold caravans
Both did handovers to customers
Wonder if that is where the 1/2 kilo gas had gone ?

 

[Mr Colpot]

We have used both and added the 2 x 11kg Gaslow system when we purchased the current van from a dealer. I am not worried about it paying for itself. I just topped up yesterday after 5 months - 20 litres (so probably nearly a full 11kg bottle) cost 13 pounds. Although most people use break even figures based on gas usage I consider a big plus is the convenience of not having to disconnect and take out the bottle for exchange, rather just pull onto the garage forecourt fill up and pay and I am on my way. I cant put a cost on this convenience though, but am happy with it and will transfer it should change vans in the future,

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[Lenny HB]

Not just about cost but also convenance, so much easier than lugging bottles about and the biggest bonus you can get gas in any country.
Very cost effective for us we have 2 x 14 kg Alugas, transferred from our last so they have done over 4½ years paid for themselves in under 3 years
Yesterday filled up with 40 Lt that makes 260 Lt this year or looking it another way if we were using exchange bottles that would be 20 times I would have put my back out this year.

 

[pandas]

Gaslow 2 x 11 bottles. Convenience for us particularly when travelling abroad.

 

[two]

Must confess, I have never done that. Was this Calor Gas ?

I worked at a Calor Gas bottle filling plant, maintaining and calibrating the bottling plant.

After filling, bottles are check-weighed and any out of spec, ( either under or over ) removed.

So a bit surprised that anyone would actually weigh at point of sale , and that you found them underweight..

This is the type of Calor Gas Bottling Carousel I worked on..


View attachment 274305

and this is the type I worked on

 

[scotjimland]

and this is the type I worked on

likewise.. I worked at the Coke bottling plant in Jo'burg for two years..

which plant was that ?

 

[Cheshirecat57]

Just to be clear...I think the bottling plants are infallable and accurate

The retailer however.....?

They were gobsmacked that i weghed the bottles and caught them selling short

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