Fridge not working on 12v Fiat Ducato Swift Sundance 2001

[lamach76]

Hi Everyone. Our Electrolux fridge has suddenly stopped working on 12v when the engine is running. The button light is usually illuminated. Fridge works on gas and electric. Wondering where the fuse might be. Please help!! Thanks.

 

[lamach76]

So I think I’ve found the red/yellow wire at the back of the fridge (top grill from outside) but it disappears up through a wooden panel which I can’t (yet) move. Blimey these things are well built!

 

[GeoffnDee]

When you find where the red/yellow wire is attached to the fridge terminal block check to see if it has 12v there with the engine running.

 

[lamach76]

Ok so here’s a development. I took the left relay from next to the starter battery and stuck it in the wardrobe and the water pump didn’t work. I swapped it back and it worked. So at this point I’m thinking it could be the relay. But when I stuck the water pump relay into the left slot next to the starter battery and started the engine, no light on the fridge. I did the same with the right hand relay. Again, same problem. So it’s possible both relays next to the starter battery have gone at the same time? If the left hand side (with the red/yellow wire) does the fridge, what does the right hand relay do?

 

[lamach76]

Found the connector. Had to push a hole through the little board. Hurt my thumb, war wound. Anyway, I can see the top of the fridge. Also realised I could pop the sink off and get access to everything from there! Lol. I’m doing this before I head to Halfords tomorrow morning to get a couple of replacement relays.

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[lynnian]

Could the other relay be for charging the leisure battery. Also check the relays are the same action ie normally open or normally closed when there is no power to the coil. Obviously if they are the same all the connection diagrams are the same.

 

[lamach76]

Change of plan. The sink is a nightmare to remove (without ruining it) so I’m gonna grab the relays tomorrow instead. I’m thinking the relays are the same (normally closed?) because in order to work the water pump I have to flick to battery (main or leisure, doesn’t matter). Same goes for the fridge - switch it to 12v then comes on when engine running. I’m hoping the issue is a couple of relays, but then it begs the question why they have both blown... dun dun dun!!! To be cont’d!

Pic of relay attached. Is this a normally open or normally closed?

 

[GeoffnDee]

They may both use the same earth (-) connection which may be worth checking. You could use your meter with its probe to check the red/yellow wire voltage at the relay, when running.. (up from underneath)

 

[lamach76]

Just realised they’re different relays to the one in the wardrobe, these ones are 4 pin as opposed to 5 pin (in the wardrobe, for the water pump). The diagram in the top of the relay is different too - you can very slight make it out in on the left one in the pic. So it looks like I need to get a couple of these from Halfords:

Halfords HEF553 Relay 12V 30A 4 PIN | Halfords UK

Shop the latest Halfords HEF553 Relay 12V 30A 4 PIN at Halfords UK

www.halfords.com

Also, each has its set of wires, presumably earth included? Pic attached.

 

[lamach76]

What’s this? I didn’t unplug it btw, just found hanging! Lol

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[Itsmcb]

They both look pretty old. They could definitely both have corroded over the long winter of non-use. They are both the same so that makes it easier. The base wires are similar both have solid brown live feeds from the starter battery. The left hand has red/yellow live out to the fridge, the right hand has the brown/blue live to the hab battery. The thinner wires are the ones that switch the relays on and off

 

[Itsmcb]

What’s this? I didn’t unplug it btw, just found hanging! Lol

Not sure but it doesn't look like a Swift connector

 

[Manic]

Could be your 12volt element has gone.
im sure you could find a YouTube video on checking that.

 

[autorouter]

I don’t even know if I’ve got a “cooling” problem with my fridge, or whether it’s just a dodgy switch not glowing red.

The elements go into the insulated tin cylinder, and there's a pipe coming out of the top of it. When the fridge is working, whatever the power source, that pipe will be hot. So you could try on 240V or gas to feel how hot it should get, then try it on 12V and compare. It should get hot in minutes rather than hours.

 

[lamach76]

I’m loathed to spend £15 on new relays when, having swapped them over a couple of times the leisure battery still appears to be charging fine (but then I haven’t drained and run the van to see), telling me that both relays are likely ok. So I think I’m just gonna have to bust a (bigger) hole through the board inside/above the grill for the fridge and get access to that chocolate block to stick the prongs in. Annoying that it’s not as accessible like on newer vans, but hey ho.

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[Itsmcb]

Change of plan. The sink is a nightmare to remove (without ruining it) so I’m gonna grab the relays tomorrow instead. I’m thinking the relays are the same (normally closed?) because in order to work the water pump I have to flick to battery (main or leisure, doesn’t matter). Same goes for the fridge - switch it to 12v then comes on when engine running. I’m hoping the issue is a couple of relays, but then it begs the question why they have both blown... dun dun dun!!! To be cont’d!

Pic of relay attached. Is this a normally open or normally closed?

Are you sure that's your pump relay? Someone will confirm if I'm correct but I believe it's a switching relay, It's more likely the relay that turns off the habitation electrics when the engine is running, only fitted on British vans.

 

[Itsmcb]

The elements go into the insulated tin cylinder, and there's a pipe coming out of the top of it. When the fridge is working, whatever the power source, that pipe will be hot. So you could try on 240V or gas to feel how hot it should get, then try it on 12V and compare. It should get hot in minutes rather than hours.

That's handy to know, I can check if mine is working now

 

[Itsmcb]

I’m loathed to spend £15 on new relays when, having swapped them over a couple of times the leisure battery still appears to be charging fine (but then I haven’t drained and run the van to see), telling me that both relays are likely ok. So I think I’m just gonna have to bust a (bigger) hole through the board inside/above the grill for the fridge and get access to that chocolate block to stick the prongs in. Annoying that it’s not as accessible like on newer vans, but hey ho.

You should be able to check if the relays are working by using you probe to check if you have current on the output side of the relay at the base

 

[lamach76]

Are you sure that's your pump relay? Someone will confirm if I'm correct but I believe it's a switching relay, It's more likely the relay that turns off the habitation electrics when the engine is running, only fitted on British vans.

Thinking about it - I flick the switch to battery, switch the water pump on, it primes for a few mins (sometimes the bugger doesn’t turn off for ages), then it goes off. Then it’ll come on when the taps are turned. So it’s definitely the pump relay (coz it didn’t prime when I whipped it out), but it’s also a different relay to fridge/leisure battery under the bonnet - least of all coz it’s got 5 pins vs 4 and a different diagram on the top.

 

[lamach76]

The elements go into the insulated tin cylinder, and there's a pipe coming out of the top of it. When the fridge is working, whatever the power source, that pipe will be hot. So you could try on 240V or gas to feel how hot it should get, then try it on 12V and compare. It should get hot in minutes rather than hours.

Handy tip!

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[autorouter]

How to test a relay, with your nice new multimeter, Set it to the lowest resistance range. Touch the probes together to check - about 0.3 ohms when touching, and a very high resistance when not touching (the display will probably read something like OVL, OV or OL, ie Overload).

Now to test the relay. Probes on the 87 and 30 terminals should read OVL. If it reads anything else, the relay has failed with the contacts stuck closed. Probes on the 85 and 86 terminals should read a hundred, or maybe a few hundred ohms. If it reads anything else,the coil has failed.

Now the exciting bit. If you connect 85 to negative and 86 to the positive of the battery, it should click as the contacts between 87 and 30 pull together and close. If you touch the probes to 30 and 87, the reading will change from OVL, ie OFF, to 0.3 ohms, ie ON. If it doesn't click, then it has failed.

5-terminal relays are similar, except they have an additional 87A terminal. If you touch the probes to 30 and 87A, it should change from ON to OFF when the relay switches on, ie the opposite of the 87 terminal

 

[lamach76]

How to test a relay, with your nice new multimeter, Set it to the lowest resistance range. Touch the probes together to check - about 0.3 ohms when touching, and a very high resistance when not touching (the display will probably read something like OVL, OV or OL, ie Overload).

Now to test the relay. Probes on the 87 and 30 terminals should read OVL. If it reads anything else, the relay has failed with the contacts stuck closed. Probes on the 85 and 86 terminals should read a hundred, or maybe a few hundred ohms. If it reads anything else,the coil has failed.

Now the exciting bit. If you connect 85 to negative and 86 to the positive of the battery, it should click as the contacts between 87 and 30 pull together and close. If you touch the probes to 30 and 87, the reading will change from OVL, ie OFF, to 0.3 ohms, ie ON. If it doesn't click, then it has failed.

5-terminal relays are similar, except they have an additional 87A terminal. If you touch the probes to 30 and 87A, it should change from ON to OFF when the relay switches on, ie the opposite of the 87 terminal

This is awesome. I’m doing this tomorrow. Thank you.

 

[autorouter]

I don't know exactly what the power of your fridge element is, but they are usually around 100 to 200 watts. So the resistance is around 0.75 to 1.5 ohms.

The last picture in post#22 shows it is 12V 120W, so that means it takes a current of 120/12 = 10 amps, and has a resistance of 12/10 = 1.2 ohms.

Pic of relay attached. Is this a normally open or normally closed?

This is a normally open (NO) relay - most 4-terminal relays are NO. The picture shows the unenergised state, ie with no power to the coil (85 & 86). The path between 30 and 87 is interrupted when the coil is not energised.

 

[Mike Smart]

Hi
Just had the same problem today. Fridge alarm was beeping when I was driving. At the same time the reverse camera, which operates all the time stopped working. After much checking. It was fuse no 13 on the Sergeant, swift command electrical control box under the lounge Seat, 20 amp fuse had blown. Replaced it camera and fridge now working perfectly. Job Done.
Mike Smart