Economics of LPG

[Two on Tour]

The only reason I said 60L is the cost for an underslung tank, price difference between say 20L and 60L is about £40 which is a small percentage of the total cost.

But you will be carrying around more weight for little or no gain in having extra LPG, but that extra weight will take away usable payload and may reduce your MPG, so in the long run it may cost you more than £40 to haul the extra dead weight around.

 

[EuroTrotters]

Fridges are big burners of gas

 

[gus-lopez]

On recent trip to the Uk I more or less ran the fridge on gas permanently. Water heater for 10 minutes for showers in morning & odd bit of cooking. used a total of 40litres of gas over 62 days.

 

[Lenny HB]

On recent trip to the Uk I more or less ran the fridge on gas permanently. Water heater for 10 minutes for showers in morning & odd bit of cooking. used a total of 40litres of gas over 62 days.

Our fridge uses about a litre a day.

 

[The Wino]

I think you're missing one of the big advantages of refillables you can top up whenever you like you don't need to run to empty. It's therefore possible to have one with a calor as backup it would be a lot cheaper than your original figure. If you decide to add a second later it's easy.

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[scotjimland]

Fridges are big burners of gas

indeed they are...

Absorption fridges are old outdated tech, high maintenance, expensive repairs and parts, and rated as climate class SN, they only work between +10°C and +32°C. not much use during the recent heat waves in parts of Europe.

By comparison, compressor models are very reliable, little or no maintenance, and work extremely well, even in high ambient temperatures.. and don't care about the van being level or not. They are also usually bigger on the inside compared to an absorption fridge of the same external dimensions.

If you are looking for a fridge that cools quicker and performs better in hotter environments, the compressor 12V fridge is a no brainer.

 

[The Wino]

There's an 11 kg gaslow refillable in classifieds

 

[EuroTrotters]

indeed they are...

Absorption fridges are old outdated tech, high maintenance, expensive repairs and parts, and rated as climate class SN, they only work between +10°C and +32°C. not much use during the recent heat waves in parts of Europe.

By comparison, compressor models are very reliable, little or no maintenance, and work extremely well, even in high ambient temperatures.. and don't care about the van being level or not. They are also usually bigger on the inside compared to an absorption fridge of the same external dimensions.

If you are looking for a fridge that cools quicker and performs better in hotter environments, the compressor 12V fridge is a no brainer.

I agree, RAC (not the AA competition) fir almost 40 years

 

[herald_400rl]

indeed they are...

Absorption fridges are old outdated tech, high maintenance, expensive repairs and parts, and rated as climate class SN, they only work between +10°C and +32°C. not much use during the recent heat waves in parts of Europe.

By comparison, compressor models are very reliable, little or no maintenance, and work extremely well, even in high ambient temperatures.. and don't care about the van being level or not. They are also usually bigger on the inside compared to an absorption fridge of the same external dimensions.

If you are looking for a fridge that cools quicker and performs better in hotter environments, the compressor 12V fridge is a no brainer.

Our fridge consequently has an issue with the igniter and that's 88 quid alone. Would live a new 12v compressor but we only have a 90aH lead acid and no solar so it would guzzle the battery in a day.

There's an 11 kg gaslow refillable in classifieds

Sadly our gas locker will only fit 2 x 6Kg.

 

[scotjimland]

Would live a new 12v compressor but we only have a 90aH lead acid and no solar so it would guzzle the battery in a day.

yes, I understand .. but another battery and a solar panel would not be mega expansive.. long term it would be a lot cheaper than buying bottled gas or indeed fitting a tank.

I only have 2 x 100ah batteries and 160watt solar...

Ours it not huge, 56 lt, but more than adequate, and current consumption (according to specs) is only .. ... 1.2 Ah at +25°C ambient temperature.. about 28ah per day

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[TrudeandDall]

An added benefit of gas low, is that they can be easily and cheaply switched between vans if you are thinking of changing.

And Gaslow bottles are kept inside a locker so there are no issues from corrosion which underslung tanks can have. You just need to see some of the images of corroded tanks that Basildog shares with funsters to see the benefit of the bottles being away from the elements...
Gaslow, inside the van with an external fillpoint is the system I have and I am 100% happy with it....

 

[Riverbankannie]

biggest sensible tank I could fit which is 60L

That size (diameter) tank may not fit under your van. We have a maxi chassis van which sits high off the ground and I wouldn’t want a bigger diameter one than ours which is 25ltr.

 

[Guigsy]

We use a single Gaslow cylinder instead of two Calors. Saves weight and space. We could fit a larger Gaslow, which made up for some of the loss of capacity of two cylinders. But we can also fill it whenever we want and the gauge is reasonably accurate. With a Calor, you can't "top it up" without losing the money on the gas that's left, or you run it until it's empty and then need a second cylinder. Refillables can be used differently.

 

[berni109]

£550 is a good price if you can do it for that(or get it done) go for it.

 

[Two on Tour]

And Gaslow bottles are kept inside a locker so there are no issues from corrosion which underslung tanks can have. You just need to see some of the images of corroded tanks that Basildog shares with funsters to see the benefit of the bottles being away from the elements...
Gaslow, inside the van with an external fillpoint is the system I have and I am 100% happy with it....

Remember that Basildog is sharing the worst of what he comes across, but if you protect an underslung tank with anti-stone chip rubberised coating as I and those with any sense have, then external corrosion is not a concern. (forget the red line on the photo, I was pointing out this area to another Funster)

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[starquake]

Sadly our gas locker will only fit 2 x 6Kg.

Are you sure. Reason I ask is I have a Bailey and although 2x6Kg is all the manufacturer says, several fitters and posters with same van have informed me it's near trivial to fit 2x11Kg in the locker. The 11kg (EU, ie Gaslow) and 6kg (UK) style bottles are reasonably near same dimensions. I think the regulator may need moving slightly upwards, but if you're getting a professional install that shouldn't be a big deal.

We plan to upgrade before our inaugural EU trip, just got Calor (one came with van) and Flogas as an interim measure as we acutally have the van parked within walking distance a flogas depot most of time, and we'll keep the old bottles to use in the garden on the BBQ so wont waste any gas when we "upgrade". Don't assume that only 6Kg will fit as thats all you have "now" as thats a mistake I made when planning/pricing up this upgrade.

As other posted have pointed out on pure economics front we need to keep the van 3-4 years to repay so if it wasn't for the EU trip I doubt we'd bother, as so far we only seem to need to swap gas bottles every 20-21 days away, and the availability isn't an issue with the fact we actually have to go past the flogas main site for the region we live in to park the van!

 

[Guigsy]

Are you sure. Reason I ask is I have a Bailey and although 2x6Kg is all the manufacturer says, several fitters and posters with same van have informed me it's near trivial to fit 2x11Kg in the locker. The 11kg (EU, ie Gaslow) and 6kg (UK) style bottles are reasonably near same dimensions. I think the regulator may need moving slightly upwards, but if you're getting a professional install that shouldn't be a big deal.

We plan to upgrade before our inaugural EU trip, just got Calor (one came with van) and Flogas as an interim measure as we acutally have the van parked within walking distance a flogas depot most of time, and we'll keep the old bottles to use in the garden on the BBQ so wont waste any gas when we "upgrade". Don't assume that only 6Kg will fit as thats all you have "now" as thats a mistake I made when planning/pricing up this upgrade.

As other posted have pointed out on pure economics front we need to keep the van 3-4 years to repay so if it wasn't for the EU trip I doubt we'd bother, as so far we only seem to need to swap gas bottles every 20-21 days away, and the availability isn't an issue with the fact we actually have to go past the flogas main site for the region we live in to park the van!

Our Geist can only fit 6Kg Calor cylinders. But 11kg Gaslows fit fine.

 

[hja]

Ulez zones are pricing out cheap (old diesel ) cars. In the cities that have Ulez zones, cheap cars, that are compliant, are petrol. Petrol isn't efficient(or cheap) but it's easy to convert to lpg and that's what's happening around city centers , taxi drivers are leading the charge towards lpg and lpg stations are opening around these centers.

Is Ulez going away? No.
Is Ulez going to move into more cities and towns? Yes.

Is Lpg going to disappear?.........

Be ahead of the curve , not 2 years behind it.

Really interesting

 

[iandsm]

Ulez zones are pricing out cheap (old diesel ) cars. In the cities that have Ulez zones, cheap cars, that are compliant, are petrol. Petrol isn't efficient(or cheap) but it's easy to convert to lpg and that's what's happening around city centers , taxi drivers are leading the charge towards lpg and lpg stations are opening around these centers.

Is Ulez going away? No.
Is Ulez going to move into more cities and towns? Yes.

Is Lpg going to disappear?.........

Be ahead of the curve , not 2 years behind it.

That's encouraging

 

[hja]

Gaslow installed system for us with external filler. No problems filling in uk on our journeys. Just as you would diesel. No lugging cylinders. The system was installed when we bought the van so not sure of cost but it’s not just about pay back time but about convenience and ongoing costs, which are less than exchange cylinders.

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[Russ N Tracey]

Just a quick one on Gaslow. if you've got a defence discount card or blue light card you get discount, you need to call them directly.
Saved me about £40 buying a complete single bottle system.

 

[DT]

One Gaslow and a regular bottle for us. That gives plenty of flexibility and we have never run out. I noticed a MH with an awning rail and canopy on the fridge side which seemed like an inexpensive way to give shade to that side of the vehicle.

 

[herald_400rl]

Are you sure. Reason I ask is I have a Bailey and although 2x6Kg is all the manufacturer says, several fitters and posters with same van have informed me it's near trivial to fit 2x11Kg in the locker. The 11kg (EU, ie Gaslow) and 6kg (UK) style bottles are reasonably near same dimensions. I think the regulator may need moving slightly upwards, but if you're getting a professional install that shouldn't be a big deal.

We plan to upgrade before our inaugural EU trip, just got Calor (one came with van) and Flogas as an interim measure as we acutally have the van parked within walking distance a flogas depot most of time, and we'll keep the old bottles to use in the garden on the BBQ so wont waste any gas when we "upgrade". Don't assume that only 6Kg will fit as thats all you have "now" as thats a mistake I made when planning/pricing up this upgrade.

As other posted have pointed out on pure economics front we need to keep the van 3-4 years to repay so if it wasn't for the EU trip I doubt we'd bother, as so far we only seem to need to swap gas bottles every 20-21 days away, and the availability isn't an issue with the fact we actually have to go past the flogas main site for the region we live in to park the van!

Our Geist can only fit 6Kg Calor cylinders. But 11kg Gaslows fit fine.

Interesting news. Starquake, no I'm not sure, I presumed. I'll get the old tape out. If I could have 1 x 11Kg gaslow and 1 x Calor 6kg for emergencies that would be perfect. I could do away with the auto-changeover if needed for room.

 

[Guigsy]

Really interesting

In the Birmingham clean air zone, initially taxis were rare as lots of drivers weren't prepared to pay the charge. But within a few weeks, a lot of taxis seemed to go to old petrol BMWs and Ford Modeos. Some were converted to LPG, there's several places that sell it around the city centre, mainly for taxis.

Over the past couple of years, an increasing number of taxis have become Priuses, or diesels newer than 2016.

But a taxi I took the other day was an old diesel. I asked the guy why. He said it's cheap to own, less risk of it gets in an accident, still gets good mpg and he did the maths and that easily offsets the daily CAZ charge.

 

[herald_400rl]

yes, I understand .. but another battery and a solar panel would not be mega expansive.. long term it would be a lot cheaper than buying bottled gas or indeed fitting a tank.

I only have 2 x 100ah batteries and 160watt solar...

Ours it not huge, 56 lt, but more than adequate, and current consumption (according to specs) is only .. ... 1.2 Ah at +25°C ambient temperature.. about 28ah per day

I had priced solar up, that will be going on over winter and the cost is sub £400 including the panels, controller, wiring, etc.

Adding another battery is a problem, our LB is in the engine bay and there isn't room to add a 2nd. We would have to split the wiring over into the cab (somewhere) or move both which would lose storage space, and I won't sacrifice any wine compartments. I dare say if we had an underslung tank I could put them in the old gas locker.

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[Bessy765]

Ours have been on around three years and over 20,000 miles we are heavy users of gas in the winter!

 

[Manic]

With the Calor bottles, if you going away you may want to go with full bottles, especially if going to Eu , so then you may have to swap bottles before they are completely empty. This isn’t a problem with refillables

 

[Bessy765]

Calor is not available in the EU and different countries have different bottles. You need ideally at least 1 refillable and a set of adaptors and one calor. When the refillable runs out just use the calor for as little as possible till you can fill the other one. Also you dont have to wait until its empty.

 

[Two on Tour]

Calor is not available in the EU and different countries have different bottles. You need ideally at least 1 refillable and a set of adaptors and one calor. When the refillable runs out just use the calor for as little as possible till you can fill the other one. Also you dont have to wait until its empty.

It makes more sense to have two refillable rather than a calor and a refillable.
When you run out of the first refillable, you simply switch over to the second refillable and get the first refillable refilled, so please explain to me where the advantage is in having for the most part a rarely if ever used calor bottle sat in your gas locker , the only reason I can see is the cost of a second refillable.

 

[Lenny HB]

It makes more sense to have two refillable rather than a calor and a refillable.
When you run out of the first refillable, you simply switch over to the second refillable and get the first refillable refilled, so please explain to me where the advantage is in having for the most part a rarely if ever used calor bottle sat in your gas locker , the only reason I can see is the cost of a second refillable.

Agree we have two 14 kg refillables.

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