Does one need to carry the jack?

[bigwood]

Having done breakdown work for a lot of years I carry the issued Ford jack and my own decent breaker bar and socket. Provided the location is safe to change a wheel I will tackle a front wheel change but not a rear with the issued jack.
The rear is awkward to get the wheels off our coach build. The guy from Tyres on the Drive had to borrow the wooden blocks I carry to get the body high enough to get the rear wheels off.
When I was doing breakdown work we had our Bradbury 3 ton jacks taken off us because of manual handling issues. They were replaced with 2 ton lighter jacks. Hopefully the breakdown guy will have a decent capacity jack if I call them out.

 

[cyberyacht]

I carry a 2 ton bottle jack. I have used it on the drive and this couple with my inability to remove the wheel even after taking the nuts off convinced me that there was no way I was going to do this on the hard shoulder assuming there was one.

 

[wp1234]

I thought the OP was trying to reduce the weight of the van

I thought it was because he had lost the storage position for his jack .

 

[ElliesBoss]

No the breakdown service always has one, we do not carry the Jack and our MoHo like many does not have a spare tyre. Opinions vary but when was the last time you saw a HGV driver change their own wheel !

Frequently but the truck has to have eastern European plates.

 

[Coolcats]

Frequently but the truck has to have eastern European plates.

? the plate just shows where the vehicle is from not the nationality of the driver. Plenty of nationalised European (and from other parts of the world) drivers living in the U.K. driving trucks displaying U.K. plates

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[ElliesBoss]

? the plate just shows where the vehicle is from not the nationality of the driver. Plenty of nationalised European (and from other parts of the world) drivers living in the U.K. driving trucks displaying U.K. plates

Did realise that. Been a truck driver for far too long. But! When you do see drivers changing wheels it is invariably eastern European vehicles and I would guess a driver from eastern Europe. Can't see a driver working for a British company having to change a wheel, indeed probably haven't got a spare or the equipment to do it.

 

[TheBig1]

I dont trust the fiat supplied junk, so dead weight. Replaced with a 5 tonne high lift bottle jack and a decent socket and torque wrench

The cheap 2 tonne rated trolley jacks from the likes of Aldi are fine for a car, but useless on a motorhome. You are not lifting the whole van, but an over rated jack is far more capable than one right at it's limit of capability. With a small one, you are asking for trouble. The 5 tonne jack and wrench weighs about the same as the fiat kit and takes way less space to store. Keep the locking wheel nut key with it in an externally accessible locker

Funniest tyre I ever changed was for a WPC on her marked police car. She had radioed for the garage to turn out and was obviously getting bored waiting. She had absolutely no idea how to change a wheel or even where the spare and jack were in the boot. 10 minutes later she was on her way

 

[Coolcats]

. Can't see a driver working for a British company having to change a wheel, indeed probably haven't got a spare or the equipment to do it.

So there we go my point is that from a breakdown point of view we do not need a jack or a spare and is why manufactures are stopping supplying them. Whilst many feel capable of changing a wheel and I know I may get flamed for this but few have been trained to do this safely on heavier vehicles and would also suggest that given the demographic of owners it is far safer just to make the call and get the recovery service to do this for you. It’s not a slight on anyones manhood to do this

 

[Coolcats]

I dont trust the fiat supplied junk, so dead weight. Replaced with a 5 tonne high lift bottle jack and a decent socket and torque wrench

The cheap 2 tonne rated trolley jacks from the likes of Aldi are fine for a car, but useless on a motorhome. You are not lifting the whole van, but an over rated jack is far more capable than one right at it's limit of capability. With a small one, you are asking for trouble. The 5 tonne jack and wrench weighs about the same as the fiat kit and takes way less space to store. Keep the locking wheel nut key with it in an externally accessible locker

Funniest tyre I ever changed was for a WPC on her marked police car. She had radioed for the garage to turn out and was obviously getting bored waiting. She had absolutely no idea how to change a wheel or even where the spare and jack were in the boot. 10 minutes later she was on her way

My Wife is more than capable of changing a tyre I suspect that WPC was as well but we all make choices. There is no way I would want my wife changing a wheel by the side of the road which is why we have breakdown cover.

 

[TheBig1]

So there we go my point is that from a breakdown point of view we do not need a jack or a spare and is why manufactures are stopping supplying them. Whilst many feel capable of changing a wheel and I know I may get flamed for this but few have been trained to do this safely on heavier vehicles and would also suggest that given the demographic of owners it is far safer just to make the call and get the recovery service to do this for you. It’s not a slight on anyones manhood to do this

When you have had the pleasure of lifting a wheel and tyre from a motorhome or lorry into place whilst freezing cold and soaked to the skin, it makes you value the breakdown guys even more. I used to be able to swap out a set of road tyres and wheels for the the huge off road ones on my 4x4 in 20 minutes. These days they would take an hour each with a coffee and a rest between each one.

I really would not recommend most of the members on fun try and change a wheel on their motorhome. As you say, it really is beyond most and can be very dangerous if you get it wrong

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[vzac]

I would never ever travel without the jack. I’ve also brought myself a breaker bar to tackle the wheel nuts, which has a dedicated socket fitted as well, along with 2 collapsable axle stands.

They all take up very little room and would be a real life saver should the need ever arise.

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If you are going for a breaker bar I would recommend a 3/4 in not 1/2in knuckle. I used to sell them, 1/2in were always coming back brpken especially on the longer bars. This was usually due to mechanics using over powered impact guns, rather than them tightening to the correct nm. As for Jack's, look at the axle weight you need not go for a size larger than required. Jack's cM be very heavy especially when you go to bottle, and trolly Jack's.

 

[L' Hobo]

No the breakdown service always has one, we do not carry the Jack and our MoHo like many does not have a spare tyre. Opinions vary but when was the last time you saw a HGV driver change their own wheel !

The average cost of an HGV wheel change used to be £200 on my trucks/buses AND we carried the spare.

 

[L' Hobo]

5 ton minimum.

Are you going to lift the WHOLE van or just one corner?

 

[dazandandrea]

I take the wife .

 

[L' Hobo]

No one has mentioned something I consider as important, something to put the jack on. I use a short piece of scaffold board.

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[599]

this was bills first hgv job he called it the buzz bomb then moved on to the bmc laird his was a box van back in the late sixties . & in those days if you had a puncture you got out & did it yourself on m/ways & all no waiting for the tyre company to come

 

[L' Hobo]

this was bills first hgv job he called it the buzz bomb then moved on to the bmc laird his was a box van back in the late sixties . & in those days if you had a puncture you got out & did it yourself on m/ways & all no waiting for the tyre company to come

 

[PP Bear]

I take the wife .

I’d take Mrsambulancekidd, made from tough stuff and very capable

 

[599]

bills just informed me there was no HGV in those days you just had to be 21 & WHAT m/ways it was the east lanc's road in them days i stand corrected

 

[Dorwyn]

Mine's a 3.5t pvc, the only time I've needed a jack in more than 5 years was to get out of a boggy axle height hole in a French field. Together with a short length of planking found nearby, it worked just fine. So it was definitely worth it. I assume it's still there, under the passenger seat !

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[Madcaravanner]

I would say yes . I had a blow out on the M5 and called the breakdown insurance (Well established motorhome ins company) . The AA turned out to me stranded on the hard shoulder, however his mid sized trolley jack wasn't able to lift the motorhome high enough to get the wheel off. We ended up using my Peugeot scissor jack to get the job done.
The recovery companies are set up for cars.
Mike

We had a blow out on M20 earlier in the year
- we called our insurance (Comfort) breakdown number and we said we were 4.25T they said no problem
- the AA man turned up and the AA had organised properly so sent a truck mechanic

Our new recovery service copes with motorhomes up to 7.5t and 8m in length but hoping I will not need them

 

[L' Hobo]

Mine's a 3.5t pvc, the only time I've needed a jack in more than 5 years was to get out of a boggy axle height hole in a French field. Together with a short length of planking found nearby, it worked just fine. So it was definitely worth it. I assume it's still there, under the passenger seat !

I totally agree, jack's are not just for changing wheels or for Christmas

 

[gerry mcg]

I was looking to see if it was worthwhile swapping the fiat supplied scissor jack with a 3T or 5T bottle jack - but the issue i see is the distance between the ground and the jack point is between 210 and 230mm (R and F) with 16” tyres that are fully inflated.
There is approx 150mm sideally on a 225/75/R16 tyre , so in the worst case, if it were completely flat, the clearance between the ground and chassis is going to be <200mm, which is less than the minimum bottle jack height (e.g a 3T jack has a range of 188-363 mm, a 5T jack has a lift of 207-402 mm https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-craft-5-tonne-bottle-jack/345hf) compared to a scissor jack with a range of 100-370 mm

i wonder if a bottle jack is too tall to be of any use if one actually got a flat tyre that completely deflated? (Yes, one could drive the flat onto a ramp to get clearance, but wouldn’t fancy doing that on a roadside…)

 

[L' Hobo]

I was looking to see if it was worthwhile swapping the fiat supplied scissor jack with a 3T or 5T bottle jack - but the issue i see is the distance between the ground and the jack point is between 210 and 230mm (R and F) with 16” tyres that are fully inflated.
There is approx 150mm sideally on a 225/75/R16 tyre , so in the worst case, if it were completely flat, the clearance between the ground and chassis is going to be <200mm, which is less than the minimum bottle jack height (e.g a 3T jack has a range of 188-363 mm, a 5T jack has a lift of 207-402 mm https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-craft-5-tonne-bottle-jack/345hf) compared to a scissor jack with a range of 100-370 mm

i wonder if a bottle jack is too tall to be of any use if one actually got a flat tyre that completely deflated? (Yes, one could drive the flat onto a ramp to get clearance, but wouldn’t fancy doing that on a roadside…)

Machine Mart has a greater range of jacks than Screwfix. and, presuming that you have a 3.5tonnes vehicle, why do you need a 5tonne Jack?
Your only lifting one corner so a 2 tonne should be ample (2ton x 4 = 8tons)

Bottle jacks come in all sizes, especially the older one for trucks & buses. On one of my trucks, I used to have a 3 section, 8ton one that only stood 6inches tall and would lift to over 14inches.
They are about, have a mooch around your local bus & coach garages. I might still have a few at the back of my garage shed??

 

[TheBig1]

I was looking to see if it was worthwhile swapping the fiat supplied scissor jack with a 3T or 5T bottle jack - but the issue i see is the distance between the ground and the jack point is between 210 and 230mm (R and F) with 16” tyres that are fully inflated.
There is approx 150mm sideally on a 225/75/R16 tyre , so in the worst case, if it were completely flat, the clearance between the ground and chassis is going to be <200mm, which is less than the minimum bottle jack height (e.g a 3T jack has a range of 188-363 mm, a 5T jack has a lift of 207-402 mm https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-craft-5-tonne-bottle-jack/345hf) compared to a scissor jack with a range of 100-370 mm

i wonder if a bottle jack is too tall to be of any use if one actually got a flat tyre that completely deflated? (Yes, one could drive the flat onto a ramp to get clearance, but wouldn’t fancy doing that on a roadside…)

A "flat" tyre is never completely pancake flat, unless the tyre is off the rim of course, then you have bigger problems. The tyre may slump 50% ish so about 70mm at worst

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[gerry mcg]

A "flat" tyre is never completely pancake flat, unless the tyre is off the rim of course, then you have bigger problems. The tyre may slump 50% ish so about 70mm at worst

In that case one could reasonably require a Jack with a 150mm low clearance, which is pretty low for a bottle Jack

 

[10tenmen]

So there we go my point is that from a breakdown point of view we do not need a jack or a spare and is why manufactures are stopping supplying them. Whilst many feel capable of changing a wheel and I know I may get flamed for this but few have been trained to do this safely on heavier vehicles and would also suggest that given the demographic of owners it is far safer just to make the call and get the recovery service to do this for you. It’s not a slight on anyones manhood to do this

The Fiat Ducato base is supplied with a spare wheel and tyre + Jack. The motorhome manufacturer removes these to save weight nothing to do with safety, I don’t blame anyone for not changing a wheel themselves. There is a seller on EBay who sells the spare wheel and tyres for £100 that’s less than the price of a new camper tyre. he openly admits they come from the motorhome manufacture.

 

[68c]

Be careful with hydraulic jacks without immediately inserting an axle stand or at the very least putting the removed wheel under the vehicle. If the seal fails the jack can drop very quickly. One advantage of the screw scissors jack is there is no seal to fail, it always acts as an axle stand for the short period it takes to replace the wheel.

 

[L' Hobo]

Be careful with hydraulic jacks without immediately inserting an axle stand or at the very least putting the removed wheel under the vehicle. If the seal fails the jack can drop very quickly. One advantage of the screw scissors jack is there is no seal to fail, it always acts as an axle stand for the short period it takes to replace the wheel.

What you say is true and I ALWAYS put the removed wheel under the chassis BUT in over fifty years in the transport business, I have never known a seal to fail completely. Slowly leak, yes, but never suddenly fail!

 

[Folkranger]

Maybe should think about ditching my jack

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