Dark Comfortmatic Clutch fluid

[Meg and Sue]

The clutch fluids dark even though it has been replaced recently.
1. What is the cause?
2. Will it eventually lead to master cylinder failure?

Many thanks

 

[Pausim]

The system was drained fully and flushed as part of the release bearing replacement. The next time 3 months later it was only the reservoir that was sucked out.

I am told draining the reservoir achieves very little because it is the fluid trapped at the far end of the system that gets polluted and that it doesn’t circulate.

 

[MisterB]

Are seals available as "spare parts"

No idea, I just assumed they would be, but as most things nowadays are replaced and not repaired it wouldn't surprise me if replacement seals were not available or at least difficult to identify/purchase?
Kannon Fodda has previously pointed out that he doesn't think repair kits are available, as he has been through the nightmare I'm happy to trust his comment.

 

[MichaelT]

The system was drained fully and flushed as part of the release bearing replacement. The next time 3 months later it was only the reservoir that was sucked out.

So did you do all this yourself or was it a Fiat Professional garage?

 

[Landy Andy]

I am told draining the reservoir achieves very little because it is the fluid trapped at the far end of the system that gets polluted and that it doesn’t circulate.

If the oil (fluid) didn’t circulate then the fluid would remain clear inside the reservoir, which I doesn’t. I would have thought.

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[Pausim]

If the oil (fluid) didn’t circulate then the fluid would remain clear inside the reservoir, which I doesn’t. I would have thought.

I believe that is exactly the problem, the reservoir can stay clear whilst all sorts of dark problems are going on at the operational end of the system. If dark fluid gets to the reservoir I guess the problem is well advanced.

 

[Landy Andy]

I believe that is exactly the problem, the reservoir can stay clear whilst all sorts of dark problems are going on at the operational end of the system. If dark fluid gets to the reservoir I guess the problem is well advanced.

I know that it doesn’t take long for a brake reservoir to change colour so think fluid must move about a bit.

 

[jockaneezer]

I wonder if, as things start to warm up (brake calipers, clutch plate etc) whether a thermal siphon starts up, which would move the fluid around, even in a closed system and so disperse the contaminated fluid ?

 

[Meg and Sue]

So did you do all this yourself or was it a Fiat Professional garage?

Thanks Michael, I did it all myself.

 

[Meg and Sue]

I wonder if, as things start to warm up (brake calipers, clutch plate etc) whether a thermal siphon starts up, which would move the fluid around, even in a closed system and so disperse the contaminated fluid ?

The brake hydraulic system including calipers is completely separate from the clutch system on a RHD Comfortmatic.
The concentric slave cylinder (csc) and part of the master cylinder circuit is a completely isolated sealed system using Dot 4 clutch fluid. It's the only part of the RHD Comfortmatic gearbox/ clutch hydraulic system that uses dot4 brake/clutch fluid.

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[Badknee]

My comfomatiic fluid was very dark last year so I’m having it changed again on our way to the Santander boat to check it.

What year and milage was on your motorhome when you first had the fluid {dot 4} changed?
Has the new fluid got darker since it was fitted?

I believe it is recommended to be chamged every 2 years

The van was six yrs old and 21k miles. Had it changed on Thurs at AM Portsmouth and the fluid was the colour of olive oil and clear.
If changing it every year is good enough for Simon at AM who owns a moho it’s good enough for me. The improvement last year was very noticeable and even better this year, don’t know if it’s the fluid change or the settings but I’m very happy.

 

[Meg and Sue]

If the oil (fluid) didn’t circulate then the fluid would remain clear inside the reservoir, which I doesn’t. I would have thought.

If its the fluid at the far end (slave cylinder end) that gets contaminated first , how can the contamination come from the master cylinder ?? Could it be possible that the slave cylinder is causing the problems

 

[Pausim]

If its the fluid at the far end (slave cylinder end) that gets contaminated first , how can the contamination come from the master cylinder ?? Could it be possible that the slave cylinder is causing the problems

My understanding is it is a far more complex system than a simple master and slave unit. All the important bits are at the gearbox end of the system, hence the contamination does not show up in the only visible bit which is the remote reservoir.

 

[Meg and Sue]

My understanding is it is a far more complex system than a simple master and slave unit. All the important bits are at the gearbox end of the system, hence the contamination does not show up in the only visible bit which is the remote reservoir.

It does show in the reservoir!
How does the contamination get to the slave cylinder if there is no circulation of fluid due to the slave cylinder being a dead end?

 

[Meg and Sue]

Mega brave of you!!

I didn't have any choice as I could find no motorhome dealer or Fiat Commercial to do it. When I contacted the only main dealer for my motorhome in IRELAND in early March they advised me to call back in December. Not a pretty answer......

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[Pausim]

It does show in the reservoir!

Eventually.

How does the contamination get to the slave cylinder if there is no circulation of fluid due to the slave cylinder being a dead end?

I believe it may happen in this gearbox mounted unit which dunnah01 helpfully posted a picture of in 2023. The unit combines clutch and gear selection functions using different fluids and cross contamination sometimes seems to occur.

 

[Don Campbell]

I took the advice of the forum, and went to Adam Morey in Portsmouth.
Not cheap, but it is apparently essential to get every part of the drain/refil/bleed done.
A yardstick is that I phoned three motorhome workshops and all of them said they wouldn't touch a comfortmatic fluid change.

I did the same and went to Adams Morey. I thought their charge of approx £150, if I remember correctly, was very reasonable for the knowledge that I was in safe hands!

 

[BusyBuilder]

When i had mine done at Fiat Inverness, the invoice said F000001508G160 WO 144 CS Speed oil for parts used. Whatever that is cost £12.55 + vat.

 

[MichaelT]

When i had mine done at Fiat Inverness, the invoice said F000001508G160 WO 144 CS Speed oil for parts used. Whatever that is cost £12.55 + vat.

That's just the cost of fluid. When I spoke to our local dealer he said as I'm a regular he would do the change for free just charge cost of fluid.

 

[Robert1351]

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[Robert1351]

After reading this thread I took a look under my bonnet. I don’t know if any of the pictures above are recognisable but I’m guessing that things are not as they should be. I’m suspecting that I should book a visit to Adams Morey?

 

[Pausim]

After reading this thread I took a look under my bonnet. I don’t know if any of the pictures above are recognisable but I’m guessing that things are not as they should be. I’m suspecting that I should book a visit to Adams Morey?

If the fluid hasn’t been changed recently this would be a good idea.

 

[Robert1351]

If the fluid hasn’t been changed recently this would be a good idea.

Thanks Pausim. I’ll start planning the journey from Shropshire… No plans to go that way hitherto but I don’t want that item to let me down even though we generally only do short trips. The system seems to work well - so far, that is.

 

[Pausim]

Thanks Pausim. I’ll start planning the journey from Shropshire… No plans to go that way hitherto but I don’t want that item to let me down even though we generally only do short trips. The system seems to work well - so far, that is.

Lots to do and see in Portsmouth whilst you are down there.