Can you SORN MH when using vehicle abroad?

[sueandjohn]

The gov.uk says about SORN “ Your vehicle must stay in the UK for your SORN to be valid. Find out what you need to do if you’re taking a vehicle out of the UK.” As per #28

 

[Larby]

It could be argued that you don't need a valid MOT when abroad as it is not available overseas.
It is a requirement to be able to produce documents, ie. Licence, MOT certificate, V5, Insurance certificate. In the event of being stopped, I would produce all required and be sent on my way with a wave and a smile from the nice Gendarme.
I would not want aggro when on holiday, why invite problems?

 

[Gaston aires]

Can you imagine if this were true ? long termers would all SORN our vans when abroad and use them.
Phil

 

[Nanniemate]

Hi,
Might be a daft question but can you SORN you MH when travelling abroad for a number of months. Surely your insurance would be independent?
Thoughts please?
Ta

I reckon this is could be wind up to see how high the horses can get .

Its a raining in Wales and we are not free to roam as yet so it maybe a form of entertainment

 

[mikebeaches]

Admit I haven't read the whole thread, but when our van was trapped in Spain in March because of the lockdown - secure in a commercial indoor storage hall - I telephoned the DVLA to ask if I could SORN it, as it was likely to be off the road for a number of months until it could be recovered.

The answer was NO!

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[gus-lopez]

Why as not in UK?

Has to be legal in country of regisration

If you were stopped by the police abroad then how would they know as they don’t have access to the DVLA database?

They have access to everything, here anyway

Whilst I note your views and agree regarding insurance and MOT I cannot see how the vehicle would be unlawful if it was SORN but used on a foreign highway?

See above.It is the law that all vehicles used in europe are legal in there country of registration. Like qusetions about towing all this should now be in the driving test.

The police on the continent would not prosecute for no tax?

They'll prosecute for anything & it is on the spot fines for non-resident. If you wish to appeal , after having paid, you have to deposit 900€ as a deposit.

I will update you all when I have spoken with the DVLA and insurance company. May take some time because of COVID.

Just look onlike at the vatious gov.uk sites

It’s not about the money but what is lawful

& sorn'ing out of the UK isn't lawful

It could be argued that you don't need a valid MOT when abroad as it is not available overseas.

This is true & why you have to return to get it done . + out over 12 months is permanent export + Ask some Jersey residents who have been fined for " no mot" here by trafico how they tried to explain that in Jersey there is no mot. & how the Guardia could not understand anywhere not having a vehicle test.

 

[Geo]

When they were talking about 2 year testing in line with the EU, and from the early days of computerised testing it was said that they were introducing EU wide testing, so any car could be tested in any EU state, not only that but a certificate based on reg No would be able to have certificate in their own language.
Whatever happens to that?
,

 

[Pete5996]

When they were talking about 2 year testing in line with the EU, and from the early days of computerised testing it was said that they were introducing EU wide testing, so any car could be tested in any EU state, not only that but a certificate based on reg No would be able to have certificate in their own language.
Whatever happens to that?
,

Bit late now, I'd say

 

[Geo]

No they could still do it
But I know what you mean lol

 

[Odd job]

The laws are not there to be avoided or ignored

Unless you are a pie key

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[poppycamper]

Soooo as i said in thread 3
No x 2

 

[busby]

Why as not in UK?

Because its illegal..BUSBY.

 

[busby]

When they were talking about 2 year testing in line with the EU, and from the early days of computerised testing it was said that they were introducing EU wide testing, so any car could be tested in any EU state, not only that but a certificate based on reg No would be able to have certificate in their own language.
Whatever happens to that?
,

Who knows,,doubt it will happen now with BREXIT..BUSBY.

 

[Sheddy]

The Spanish police last winter in Benidorm pulled a UK registered scooter for no tax when it was just days overdue, the owner did not have the V5 or reminder to complete the renewal on line, however the police were apparently able to help complete the renewal on his behalf after he paid the fine at the local compound.
Plenty of access to the UK system me thinks.
Oh and the compound was full of UK registered vehicles including a Roller.
Cheers
Ed

 

[nicholsong]

I am surprised that we got down to MikeD's post#22 before we got chapter and verse on why it cannot be done.

Although a DVLA employee pointedly told me that they do not ask on the SORN form where the vehicle is parked. My query was about SORN when parked abroad, not being used, as it seemed unreasonable to have to pay tax when vehicle is out of commission, whatever country it is parked in, especially when that country does not levy VED or equivalent.

Geoff

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[DJA]

Well Toady I take it from what you are saying that you have no objection to thousands of European cars and lorries etc driving all over our country that are not legally allowed to drive in their own country. That is what you are expecting Europe etc to accept you wanting to do.

Whilst you are at it why don't you only have it MOT'd every other year because that's what happens in other countries.

 

[Ridgeway]

I'd just assume that a lack of any valid document, certificate or being able to receipt a Shakespeare sonnet whilst standing on your head would be enough for any insurance company to laugh at you when you rang them up to make a claim..... not worth it at all.

We do have an oddity here though for vans above 3.5t as they are subject to an additional road tax (above the usual super expensive one, i pay about £1,100 a year for road tax here) and that is you can each month declare how many days you were out of the country and they knock those off your bill, in effect you get a credit for next year and as many of the larger van owners are retired or just use the van a lot then it does add up to a decent saving p/a.

 

[gus-lopez]

When they were talking about 2 year testing in line with the EU, and from the early days of computerised testing it was said that they were introducing EU wide testing, so any car could be tested in any EU state, not only that but a certificate based on reg No would be able to have certificate in their own language.
Whatever happens to that?
,

Yes that was kicking about when we first moved here, ..................18 years ago.Can kept being kicked down the road.

Oh and the compound was full of UK registered vehicles including a Roller.

As is the one in Lorca. Then at the Murcia municipal pound alongside the A7 I was looking at some tidy brit registered stuff last week.

 

[Spriddler]

Well Toady I take it from what you are saying that you have no objection to thousands of European cars and lorries etc driving all over our country that are not legally allowed to drive in their own country.

Indeed.
Not sure how road tax works abroad but Brits wouldn't be happy if foreign commercial or domestic vehicles were travelling in the U.K. 'untaxed' in any country.

 

[grumps147]

We are all clocked going in and out of every port.... DVLA have access to the data and when you SORN can check where your vehicle is. I have little doubt if you SORN after you leave, a check will be done to see if you are in the UK still. Likewise, if you drive while on SORN, it will flag. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_number_plate_recognition_in_the_United_Kingdom

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[Toady]

Well that was interesting and some good points raised. Not a wind up but seeking views.

My vehicle has been on SORN for the last few months due to COVID and lockdown here in Wales. Police have been very strict and done a great job.

Interesting point mentioned by some with regards to SORN of their vehicles whilst long term on a site abroad. May be an issue if a claim subsequently made with insurance company?

Please keep calm and carry on

 

[nicholsong]

Indeed.
Not sure how road tax works abroad but Brits wouldn't be happy if foreign commercial or domestic vehicles were travelling in the U.K. 'untaxed' in any country.

Well they cannot complain about Polish vehicles not being taxed, because there is no VED/Road Tax in Poland.

 

[Midnightflyer]

Good Morning Toady
It' very strange you know, something that has puzzled me for years! We lived in Nerja Southern Spain from 1992 to 1995 and one night when returning from Malaga driving a friends British Registered Car I was pulled into a roadside check. The Police addressed me by the name of the owner of the vehicle (My friend) and after explaining why I was driving someone else's car and who I was they let me proceed. However and this is my point I asked them {and this is '93) how did they know it was Mr H........'s car. The officer then showed me that in his Seat Malaga Police car there was a computer terminal that all he needed to do was to enter the registration number and it came up with the owners details direct from our DVLA at 10pm in 1993. When checking with our Police today they can't access the equivalent Spanish Authority. Seems very one way to me.
Recently a friend returning from Southern France was caught on a roadside camera breaking the speed limit, about 2 weeks later he received his 200 Euro fine, again British Registered Car in France. Very strange.

 

[BILL 875]

To cut a long story short, no no and NO . Bill

 

[Ian Bosman]

Because the Motor Vehicles (International Circulation) Order 1975 allows any vehicle registered in one of the signatory states to "circulate freely" in any other sognatory staste provided it is correctly licensed in its own State.

The only alternative and a complicated one at that is to register the vehicle and tax it in another country which can apply in some states if it is imported for more than, usually, three months - I understand. I know when Ilived in Zambia and Ghana that this was the case. Friends I know who brought cars in Zambia on export plates had a only a short time to have it registered and taxed after import. Whatever, to legally drive anywhere you have to be in a taxed vehicle. End of, as they say

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[Theonlysue]

If caught in Spain driving without tax, they could crush your vehicle.
Are you feeling lucky??

 

[nicholsong]

Good Morning Toady
It' very strange you know, something that has puzzled me for years! We lived in Nerja Southern Spain from 1992 to 1995 and one night when returning from Malaga driving a friends British Registered Car I was pulled into a roadside check. The Police addressed me by the name of the owner of the vehicle (My friend) and after explaining why I was driving someone else's car and who I was they let me proceed. However and this is my point I asked them {and this is '93) how did they know it was Mr H........'s car. The officer then showed me that in his Seat Malaga Police car there was a computer terminal that all he needed to do was to enter the registration number and it came up with the owners details direct from our DVLA at 10pm in 1993. When checking with our Police today they can't access the equivalent Spanish Authority. Seems very one way to me.
Recently a friend returning from Southern France was caught on a roadside camera breaking the speed limit, about 2 weeks later he received his 200 Euro fine, again British Registered Car in France. Very strange.

I think the registration authorities charge for access to their databases so he who pays wins.

Geoff

 

[tacr2man]

Some countries eg China you have to re reg vehicle(get chineses plates) , on entry and some after three months if you can get permission to stay that long . I did with landrover in Australia , they take plates back when vehicle leaves .

This maybe of interest, a bit old now as it was 2008 December
Thank you for your email.

You would not be able to make a SORN declaration with regard to your vehicle because it is out of the country. SORN can only be declared on a vehicle when it is laid up within the confines of the UK.

Because you would not be able to tax your vehicle nor declare it off road let alone permanently export it you would need to write a letter into us. It would be necessary for you to quote the registration number and for you to explain what you intend to do with the vehicle over the next couple of years or so. You can even ask for this correspondence to be placed on the vehicle record so that you are not bothered about any fines or penalties with regard to this vehicle.

The address to write or fax into is;
Vehicle Customer Services, DVLA, Swansea, SA99 1BA.
Fax No. 01792 - 782378.

I hope that this information has clarified matters for you.
Regards
David S Evans
Motoring : Directgov

There is a lengthy discussion (years) on The Hubb overlander forum .