Battery power running low on a field - do we need to go home?

Regularly run my engine while stationary, heats up the engine, charges batteries and clears windows. Engines just done 40,000 miles and has started to really pull well, so getting there as it still beds in.

I don’t go for this mustn’t, shouldn’t, can’t and run it when required. My 80 year old neighbour has a Tribute on a 05 plate and had from new and his only vehicle so used for shopping, doctors etc. Now on 70+k miles and all he ever does it run the engine when the solo hab batt gets low (no solar, doesn’t believe in it) and he’s had that batt for more years than I dare say and still it performs well. Him, his SWMBO and dog lived in it full time for 4 months a few years back, while sorting out houses and not so much as a flicker of reduction in performance.

In the Army, we’d always run up all engines for an hour, including the armour, so I’d say fire it up, charge the batt, warm up and enjoy 👍🏻
You are making a big assumption here that all Diesel engines are the same. Those examples you mention above, do not have a catalytic oxidiser and diesel particle filter. These to distinctive components that are fitted to reduce the emissions will suffer on idle, not the engine. And they are tested on MOT.

Just see. Lenny’s post, he beat me to it. 👍
 
Funny thing is my 4 year old leisure battery has (accidentally) been run totally flat about 3 times over the years, but when fully charged again, it holds at 13.4 volts perfectly - for several weeks in storage. Maybe I'm just lucky.

Batteries can be quite resilient. I sometimes think we are a little paranoid on here. My Renault car battery is now 12 years old (still on original battery). For 3 years it sat unused and uncharged while we were out of the country. Stuck it on the charger for 20 mins when we got back and its been fine for the last 2 years.
 
a great shame to end a trip for such a thing. It's fine to run the engine for however long is needed to put sufficient charge back into the leisure battery. When I used lead acid batteries and split charge relay I did it many, many times especially during ski holidays in the camper where the evenings lighting and TV then the blown air heating blower slowly discharged the leisure batteries overnight. The noise and fumes of the engine running being irritation to others is the only issue. I guarantee you can run at idle indefinately, it will not damage any engine, old or modern.

The problem would be slow charging, as the lead acid battery has high internal resistance and after the first few minutes it will only take a few amps at typical alternator voltage. But as long as you have enough fuel just wait it out.

A B2B charger and lithium batteries are a fantastic investment, you can now have both for £600 if you install yourself, simple enough, or 2 hours labour for a vaguely competent installer. It will allow you to put 50ah into your leisure batteries in 1 hour of engine idle, fantastic.

I'd also recommend solar panels, the more the better, though they are next to useless at this time of year especially if near trees.
 
So back to the stationary running point, a modern car has de-icing front and rear screens etc....so you start the car/van/whatever and press the buttons....it can take some time to clear the screens....at what point does damage occur to the engine ?

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So back to the stationary running point, a modern car has de-icing front and rear screens etc....so you start the car/van/whatever and press the buttons....it can take some time to clear the screens....at what point does damage occur to the engine ?
There is no damage to the engine, but, dpf and oxidiser it’s another matter. To defrost the windows it takes less than 2mins, and you are off. To charge a battery takes allot longer.
 
a great shame to end a trip for such a thing. It's fine to run the engine for however long is needed to put sufficient charge back into the leisure battery. When I used lead acid batteries and split charge relay I did it many, many times especially during ski holidays in the camper where the evenings lighting and TV then the blown air heating blower slowly discharged the leisure batteries overnight. The noise and fumes of the engine running being irritation to others is the only issue. I guarantee you can run at idle indefinately, it will not damage any engine, old or modern.

The problem would be slow charging, as the lead acid battery has high internal resistance and after the first few minutes it will only take a few amps at typical alternator voltage. But as long as you have enough fuel just wait it out.

A B2B charger and lithium batteries are a fantastic investment, you can now have both for £600 if you install yourself, simple enough, or 2 hours labour for a vaguely competent installer. It will allow you to put 50ah into your leisure batteries in 1 hour of engine idle, fantastic.

I'd also recommend solar panels, the more the better, though they are next to useless at this time of year especially if near trees.
Well, we decided to try one of the suggestions, so we connected our Bluetti power pack to the EHU. 3 hours later the Bluetti is dead but hey Presto - we had a fully charged leisure battery again! Wonderful though this is, we will indeed take heed of the advice and consider the three options suggested. An additional leisure battery, a generator a solar panel or some combination. So ends our first year in the new van with this ’wild camp cold weather trial’ - thanks for all the suggestions folks.
 
All those engines you lot are referring to are not modern diesels.
A Modern diesel is totally different, They have CAT & DPF and when run from cold on tickover they don't get up to operating temperature which causes condensation in the bores and wrecks the CAT & DPF.
If you want to run them on tickover take them for a 10/20 mile drive so they are fully up to temperature first.

There is a least one Funster who use to charge his batteries on tickover until it cost him a few grand in engine repairs.
Oh, okay - so I assume for vehicles with these "modern" (how modern is modern?) engines there is a warning in the handbook that says "DO NOT RUN THIS ENGINE AT TICKOVER FOR ANY LENGTH OF TIME - SERIOUS DAMAGE MAY OCCUR"? That would be a step in the right direction of providing some actual evidence.
 
Oh, okay - so I assume for vehicles with these "modern" (how modern is modern?) engines there is a warning in the handbook that says "DO NOT RUN THIS ENGINE AT TICKOVER FOR ANY LENGTH OF TIME - SERIOUS DAMAGE MAY OCCUR"? That would be a step in the right direction of providing some actual evidence.
Obviously not read your Fiat handbook then.

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Anybody know the general date of when a ‘modern’ engine is fitted.
Say, just as an example off the top of my head, for instance a fiat 2011 regd 2.3?
 
Anybody know the general date of when a ‘modern’ engine is fitted.
Say, just as an example off the top of my head, for instance a fiat 2011 regd 2.3?
Depends on the vehicle but around 2004 some Fiat JDT's had CAT's then some didn't.
X250`s from 2006 had CAT's, DPF's fitted around 2012.
 
Depends on the vehicle but around 2004 some Fiat JDT's had CAT's then some didn't.
X250`s from 2006 had CAT's, DPF's fitted around 2012.

Correction, mine is a 2007 Euro4 X250 and has neither Cat or DPF. :unsure: (thank goodness!)
 
Just a small point when people are stuck in traffic and cannot move, I've been stuck 4hrs how do people keep warm especially in this weather. I've also been stuck in traffic in Spain for 4hrs stationary and the engine running the aircon 35 to 40 degrees.
 
Just a small point when people are stuck in traffic and cannot move, I've been stuck 4hrs how do people keep warm especially in this weather. I've also been stuck in traffic in Spain for 4hrs stationary and the engine running the aircon 35 to 40 degrees.
This is a very valid point - especially if you are in an EV. How much battery life is used keeping you warm when you are stuck for any length of time?

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This is a very valid point - especially if you are in an EV. How much battery life is used keeping you warm when you are stuck for any length of time?
Answer - diesel power in your electric vehicle. Simples :)

 
Not so "simples" if your EV doesn't have a diesel engine! Or any type of power other than electric.
stll simples :) did you watch the video? does that vehicle have a diesel engine?

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Right now with this cold snap in full swing, there are quite a few expensive engines being ruined along our road as the owners leave the cars sat on their drives, engines running, de-mist at full chat and engine ticking over to de-frost them. Local garages and car dealers should be looking forward to some profitable work coming their way . . . .
 
We have the MH connected to the house mains. With heater running in the MH. Just to take the chill off . Been doing that every winter, every years.
 
Right now with this cold snap in full swing, there are quite a few expensive engines being ruined along our road as the owners leave the cars sat on their drives, engines running, de-mist at full chat and engine ticking over to de-frost them. Local garages and car dealers should be looking forward to some profitable work coming their way . . . .
The point that LennyHB and others have been trying to make but have been ignored in a wave of hyperbole is that it's not the engine which is being affected, it's the CAT and the DPF downstream in the exhaust system.

It's always been the case with IC engines that slow warm-up in cold conditions causes acidic condensation to accumulate in the exhaust. Back when the exhaust was just a basic collection of mild steel pipes and boxes, that could lead to early rot in the system. Not ideal but cheap to repair/replace.

Today, if you make a regular habit of extended periods of idling without getting the engine properly up to temperature first you are creating that same acidic condensation but now it's attacking expensive metals inside the cat convertor and clogging up the DPF. Both of these are costly to repair and inconvenient to have fail on the road.

So, there aren't expensive engines being ruined along your road as a result of a week or two of driveway defrosting during this cold snap. Yes, this will likely shorten the lifespan of the cat con and DPF but that will be over a period of years.

Seems to me the advice has been sensible all along. Get the engine up to proper working temp quickly and then let it idle, if you must. Better to reduce the need to do this to charge leisure batteries by installing solar and a second leisure battery if you can, but don't sweat impending disaster if you're caught out and have to adopt this procedure to get you out of a fix.
 
The point that LennyHB and others have been trying to make but have been ignored in a wave of hyperbole is that it's not the engine which is being affected, it's the CAT and the DPF downstream in the exhaust system.
It does affect the engine as well because they never get up to operating temperature you get condensation in the bores which can do damage.

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Question.
After a couple of minutes of idling If you bring your revs up to 2000 rpm using the stick to pedal method, to say charge your battery dose that help as this would help bring the engine temperature up.
 
Question.
After a couple of minutes of idling If you bring your revs up to 2000 rpm using the stick to pedal method, to say charge your battery dose that help as this would help bring the engine temperature up.
Not a lot they need to be under load to get them up to temperature.
 
It does affect the engine as well because they never get up to operating temperature you get condensation in the bores which can do damage.

Correct, which I knew and perhaps what I should have said was 'it's not the engine being affected as much'.

Whenever I've needed to run at idle, I start by holding constant rpm around 2-3k to get the motor up to temp sooner, raise oil pressure and promote exhaust gas flow.

I think we're both pushing the same point. :)
 
Have you had the van from new?
They started fitting them in July 2006.

No, I did not have it from new (don't believe in, normally, taking the initial cash hit and teething problems) but I did query & checked with Fiat and it is original spec which was one of the reasons I bought it (sans Cat & Dpf).

Perhaps, as your vehicle was a Hymer, they started the fitting emission control in Germany earlier? :unsure:
 
No, I did not have it from new (don't believe in, normally, taking the initial cash hit and teething problems) but I did query & checked with Fiat and it is original spec which was one of the reasons I bought it (sans Cat & Dpf).

Perhaps, as your vehicle was a Hymer, they started the fitting emission control in Germany earlier? :unsure:
Yep was Hymer a self import but it was RHD.

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