ADDING A BLACK TANK

[Sue and Rick]

If your using your home water supply for cleaning flushing etc when you get home.
Would you really connect your drinking water to something that was filled with poo?
It’s also illegal to do so. That’s why we have flushing cisterns on your toilets

 

[cmcardle75]

If your using your home water supply for cleaning flushing etc when you get home.
Would you really connect your drinking water to something that was filled with poo?
It’s also illegal to do so. That’s why we have flushing cisterns on your toilets

You'll find that your home's toilets are also connected to your drinking water supply for cleaning and flushing. It is not illegal, but quite normal. Indeed, I'd think it illegal not to connect the mains water supply in such a fashion. Or do you mean that there needs to be a means of preventing back siphonage? This could be an air gap (i.e. a cistern with ball valve), a double return valve, or manual operation (i.e. a tap that can't be left on without inconvenience).

 

[Reallyretired]

You'll find that your home's toilets are also connected to your drinking water supply for cleaning and flushing. It is not illegal, but quite normal. Indeed, I'd think it illegal not to connect the mains water supply in such a fashion. Or do you mean that there needs to be a means of preventing back siphonage? This could be an air gap (i.e. a cistern with ball valve), a double return valve, or manual operation (i.e. a tap that can't be left on without inconvenience).

As a slight digression, most French bogs flush directly from mains water and will flush indefinitely while holding the tap open.

 

[Sue and Rick]

Yo

You'll find that your home's toilets are also connected to your drinking water supply for cleaning and flushing. It is not illegal, but quite normal. Indeed, I'd think it illegal not to connect the mains water supply in such a fashion. Or do you mean that there needs to be a means of preventing back siphonage? This could be an air gap (i.e. a cistern with ball valve), a double return valve, or manual operation (i.e. a tap that can't be left on without inconvenience).

You are correct, toilets in the home are usually connected to the mains supply but a toilet cistern arrangement provides the necessary back flow prevention. In the uk we have 5 fluid categories for water 5 being the most dangerous (poo etc) 1 being drinkable. So you need a device that will give fluid category 5 protection against backflow and back pressure. A double check valve does not give this nor a break tank unless in has a Type A-A or type A-B air gap. A manual tap can also be used provided it is fitted with the necessary backflow protection. Like a DC device.

All explained here

Water Regs UK Limited Backflow Prevention Arrangements

www.waterregsuk.co.uk

 

[Southdowners]

Yo

You are correct, toilets in the home are usually connected to the mains supply but a toilet cistern arrangement provides the necessary back flow prevention. In the uk we have 5 fluid categories for water 5 being the most dangerous (poo etc) 1 being drinkable. So you need a device that will give fluid category 5 protection against backflow and back pressure. A double check valve does not give this nor a break tank unless in has a Type A-A or type A-B air gap. A manual tap can also be used provided it is fitted with the necessary backflow protection. Like a DC device.

All explained here

Water Regs UK Limited Backflow Prevention Arrangements

www.waterregsuk.co.uk

Surely when a black tank is flushed through it is empty?

In ours you connect a water supply which goes to the sprinklers inside the tank which then flush through the tank. The outlet pipe from the tank is placed in a drain. I can’t see how there’s any likelihood of backflow or back pressure.

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[bigtwin]

Glas Robin
If you use grey water as the flush water for the toilet it means that the overall volume of water carried is less than if you use fresh for flushing.

I’m not sure that you end up carrying less water, you just end up increasing your fresh water endurance as a result of not using any for flushing.

Ian

 

[WildBunch]

The flush water for a Thetford loo is connected directly (via the pump ) to the fresh water supply in your motor home ?

 

[EuroTrotters]

We have a black tank on our Hymer , bit of a rarity, but adopts a different take to the RV

our toilet looks more conventional although still plastic, fitted with a macerator pump on the outlet so it delivers poo soup to the black tank that can be discharged by gravity alone

We dump black first then the grey through the discharge pipe (If used) to flush it through

we need a hose most times, including home where we are lucky enough to have a manhole close to where park the MH

We also chose to carry a standard cassette which we can fill by gravity if no low level dump option available, been used three times in 6 years

we only have a small black tank, 45 litres from memory , but can easily do a 3 night weekend away and return home to empty if no dump option as is common on rallies

I would not chose to have another if we change MH’s

I was expecting a thumbs up !

 

[eddie]

Can we see some photos please? And a more detailed explanation of how it works?
Many thanks,
Richard

Hard to show a picture really. This is the campers "black tank" locker. Very few sites don't have a "dump" most sites if you ask will left a manhole or inspection cover, every toilet block has them.

I pull out the hose, drop it down the manhole, pull the lever in the middle of the picture (yellow writing on it) and when it stops, I shut the valve. If there is a tap near by, I plug a hose on to the "San-T-Flush" a tank cleaner that has a one way valve built in, and after a few minutes, turn off the tap, and open the valve again.

I rarely use any chemical, it doesn't need it, as I'm getting ready to go to Spain shortly I have put a bottle of Elsan in just in case, but I suspect as normal it will come back unopened.

I have three interconnecting "dump hoses" on board so can reach about 30' like others I have a macerator, never used it as never needed it and have a "tote tank" that I can hang on the ladder when I am off travelling and don't know what I will find

So I can "decant" into my 15 gallon "Tote" and dump in a conventional chemical waste facility, or, I can pull a lever and let the whole lot disappear down a drain So I see no downside to having large black and grey tanks

I have a new van on order, and will be going back to a PPP (Plastic Pot of Poo) and frankly am dreading it, as I will be one of the myriad of blokes emptying the previous nights waste every morning (I know that some of you can make it last ages by not using it, but not being weird I don't find a tank full of pee and poo, any better or worse than a tank full of wee! #Nutters)

 

[funflair]

We have a black tank on our Hymer , bit of a rarity, but adopts a different take to the RV

our toilet looks more conventional although still plastic, fitted with a macerator pump on the outlet so it delivers poo soup to the black tank that can be discharged by gravity alone

We dump black first then the grey through the discharge pipe (If used) to flush it through

we need a hose most times, including home where we are lucky enough to have a manhole close to where park the MH

We also chose to carry a standard cassette which we can fill by gravity if no low level dump option available, been used three times in 6 years

we only have a small black tank, 45 litres from memory , but can easily do a 3 night weekend away and return home to empty if no dump option as is common on rallies

I would not chose to have another if we change MH’s

But would you have another if it gave you say 12 or 14 days before emptying?

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[DavidG58]

But would you have another if it gave you say 12 or 14 days before emptying?

I almost certainly would , especially with near silent macerator that Morelo fit

My comment all those years back, was related to my 45 litre tank, I think the OP was considering fitting a similar size

 

[jh]

Our new to us van has a 90ltr black tank but it is not something I will be bothering with. We have a Thetford ceramic loo with a cassette, when the cassette is full the panel has a light that lets you know then press to pump into the main tank and start to fill your cassette again,

It’s just as easy to empty the cassette every day or two, it would not have been an option I would have ordered had I bought the van new.

Hi, i know this post is from 2020 but i am intrigued by this system where you can pump the cassette into a black tank and start filling it again. that to me would be the best of both worlds and i would love to know some more details of this set up.

 

[cmcardle75]

Hi, i know this post is from 2020 but i am intrigued by this system where you can pump the cassette into a black tank and start filling it again. that to me would be the best of both worlds and i would love to know some more details of this set up.

It does sound awesome. Empty the cassette if you can. If you can't then pump it out of sight for a week!

 

[jongood]

It does sound awesome. Empty the cassette if you can. If you can't then pump it out of sight for a week!

Im really not finding it difficult tobempty our black tank, ok you do need a decent size 150l for us to make it worth it but you dont need to do it so often

 

[cmcardle75]

Im really not finding it difficult tobempty our black tank, ok you do need a decent size 150l for us to make it worth it but you dont need to do it so often

I found it a complete pain. It was large enough that we could pump it at home for short trips. But even that was a miserable job that stank the ground floor out for hours.

When on a longer trip, we found most UK campsites' facilities not within pumping distance of where you could park, or, frankly, embarassing to pump to, surrounded by people showering and brushing their teeth whilst trying to control a pulsating snake spewing human excrement into the correct cubicle in the shower block was not my idea of fun.

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[Coastal Cruiser.]

Had my first van on the road for about 16 months now and probably been away about 12-14 weeks with up to 3.5 weeks at a time and have not had any issues with emptying the black tank.
We can go a good 2 weeks if needed but I think about 4 days is the longest as always found a drive over service point in the UK and Europe.
Can not comment about a cassette system as not used one but I would not trade by the sound of it

 

[funflair]

Had my first van on the road for about 16 months now and probably been away about 12-14 weeks with up to 3.5 weeks at a time and have not had any issues with emptying the black tank.
We can go a good 2 weeks if needed but I think about 4 days is the longest as always found a drive over service point in the UK and Europe.
Can not comment about a cassette system as not used one but I would not trade by the sound of it

We have had both Mark and you are right “you wouldn’t trade”.

We had three nights on Windsor racecourse and the potty dump was a long way away we didn’t bother dumping, then a night at Canterbury before the ferry and we could but didn’t bother, then two or three nights at Thieu and as you know there are no facilities at all so when we got to Polch we serviced all tanks and set off full of fresh water, to be fair though we could have gone on to our next stop as that has facilities for servicing and we still had capacity.

OK it is a bit different in the UK as apart from anything the management are totally unfamiliar with black tanks, I had a conversation with a site owner who didn’t want me to dump in his drive over grate, we established that it went to the same place as dumping a cassette but he kept saying about paper and wet wipes, with his permission I dumped our tank over his grey waste grate, he wanted to lift the grate as he was still taking about wet wipes blocking everything and didn’t seem to be listening, I dumped and flushed with grey and he was suitably impressed, he had his own MORELO but with cassette.

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

We have had both Mark and you are right “you wouldn’t trade”.

We had three nights on Windsor racecourse and the potty dump was a long way away we didn’t bother dumping, then a night at Canterbury before the ferry and we could but didn’t bother, then two or three nights at Thieu and as you know there are no facilities at all so when we got to Polch we serviced all tanks and set off full of fresh water, to be fair though we could have gone on to our next stop as that has facilities for servicing and we still had capacity.

OK it is a bit different in the UK as apart from anything the management are totally unfamiliar with black tanks, I had a conversation with a site owner who didn’t want me to dump in his drive over grate, we established that it went to the same place as dumping a cassette but he kept saying about paper and wet wipes, with his permission I dumped our tank over his grey waste grate, he wanted to lift the grate as he was still taking about wet wipes blocking everything and didn’t seem to be listening, I dumped and flushed with grey and he was suitably impressed, he had his own MORELO but with cassette.

Im loving the tanks on our van as it’s just so easy to drive up dump and go
We seem to use a lot of water so all the better otherwise I would be at the dump point every day.

One day I might get to use my super duper macerator pump and long hose I have set up and been carrying around for the last 10k miles

 

[jh]

the black tank conversion is on my list to do before we go to italy this summer but i really want to get the design right before i start buying stuff.
we have a twin wheeler base vehicle so the weight is not too much of a worry i hope, but in an ideal world the cassette option would be great if we really cannot find a dump out.

anyone (maybe Steve and Denise?) got a name for this cassette/black tank combo? or is it a diy system maybe?

 

[Steve and Denise]

The cassette pumping system in my opinion is totally not viable, just carry a spare cassette.
Never had a pumped black tank but it has to work much better than the gravity type tank.
It was such a pain I disabled it for our ownership

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[jh]

Coastal Cruiser can you give me a quick idea of how your system works, what sort of bog you've got etc?

 

[Steve and Denise]

the black tank conversion is on my list to do before we go to italy this summer but i really want to get the design right before i start buying stuff.
we have a twin wheeler base vehicle so the weight is not too much of a worry i hope, but in an ideal world the cassette option would be great if we really cannot find a dump out.

anyone (maybe Steve and Denise?) got a name for this cassette/black tank combo? or is it a diy system maybe?

It was fitted by Carthargo but very Heath Robinson and not easy to use

 

[jh]

Steve and Denise can you tell me the make or name of the system though? or any other details that might identify it?

 

[jh]

thanks for the replies.

i am looking at all possibilities at the moment to see what could be best for us.

was the toilet a standard thetford type or something else?

 

[Steve and Denise]

Steve and Denise can you tell me the make or name of the system though? or any other details that might identify it?

It’s a Thetford system but very poor

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[Coastal Cruiser.]

Coastal Cruiser can you give me a quick idea of how your system works, what sort of bog you've got etc?

Mine is the system fitted to the van from new.
250ltr black tank with a valve in the locker that opens the pipe under the van.
Have a camera also that I can see when driving over the dump point and it lines up perfectly
I have made up an additional 50-60mtrs of hose with a 12v macerator pump in line that I connect to the discharge pipe should I need to pump it.
Not needed to use it yet

 

[eddie]

I found it a complete pain. It was large enough that we could pump it at home for short trips. But even that was a miserable job that stank the ground floor out for hours.

When on a longer trip, we found most UK campsites' facilities not within pumping distance of where you could park, or, frankly, embarassing to pump to, surrounded by people showering and brushing their teeth whilst trying to control a pulsating snake spewing human excrement into the correct cubicle in the shower block was not my idea of fun.

Use the dump point then, not where people are brushing their teeth lol

 

[jongood]

I found it a complete pain. It was large enough that we could pump it at home for short trips. But even that was a miserable job that stank the ground floor out for hours.

When on a longer trip, we found most UK campsites' facilities not within pumping distance of where you could park, or, frankly, embarassing to pump to, surrounded by people showering and brushing their teeth whilst trying to control a pulsating snake spewing human excrement into the correct cubicle in the shower block was not my idea of fun.

We dont do much uk, but when we have if the facilities are not up to it we just take it with us, its easily 1o days if not longer. Ive no idea why youre trying to dump black waste in someones shower block

 

[jongood]

The other missing element is that the toilets are different. The marine toilets tend to be proper toilets with a ceramic ball in place of the plastic flap ( much easier to clean) and you flush it with your foot from a standing position.

I wouldnt easily go back to a casette and would think that a Morelo ( as mentioned earlier) or any of the bigger mh's without a blank tank would be more difficult to sell.

 

[funflair]

Coastal Cruiser can you give me a quick idea of how your system works, what sort of bog you've got etc?

We have the same system as Coastal Cruiser it's a Dometic porcelain toilet with a macerator built in and then straight into the tank, Jongood mentioned a marine toilet with ceramic ball instead of a flap so that is different again as the contents of the toilet go straight into the tank in their raw form and the ball is the seal whereas on ours the seal is a U bend water trap, which is best? well there is never a straight answer to that but I would say the straight drop into the tank is more reliable but the macerated into the tank is easier to dump with a slightly longer pipe although it might depend on how long the contents are in the tank before dumping.

EDIT above I said the macerated contents go straight into the tank but in reality they are or can pumped by the macerator so the tank does not need to be directly under the bowl as I assume it does with the "marine" toilet that Jon has.

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