A Flat battery despite having solar panels! Pretty miffed!!

[sb1957]

Be wary - the TRUMA kits are very expensive for what they are. You could probably do a lot better going to an independent fitter like Vanbitz. Looking at the kits they are still using cheapo PWM controllers.

Vanbitz website quoting £100 more for a 160W system than I'm paying for a 150W. No idea how the quality compares, but Truma reviews seem pretty good. But- that sounds like I'm being ungrateful for the advice which I'm definitely not! I had initially settled on what I thought was a good price (from an independent fitter... again based on the Truma kit), but then realised that I could get the same kit locally for pretty much same price. There's something reassuring about dealing with a local dealer who, so far, has been spot-on.

 

[gus-lopez]

if that does not work I will take it to an auto electrician I know and he can diagnose it... the cost will be passed back to the dealer.

I'd do that anyway.

 

[cmcardle75]

Vanbitz website quoting £100 more for a 160W system than I'm paying for a 150W. No idea how the quality compares, but Truma reviews seem pretty good. But- that sounds like I'm being ungrateful for the advice which I'm definitely not! I had initially settled on what I thought was a good price (from an independent fitter... again based on the Truma kit), but then realised that I could get the same kit locally for pretty much same price. There's something reassuring about dealing with a local dealer who, so far, has been spot-on.

Make sure you're comparing like for like. PWM and MPPT are completely different devices. A PWM controller should cost about a quarter the price of an MPPT, although prices of both vary considerably.

 

[TinTentTourist]

Well, I'm actually dropping the van off this afternoon for service and repairs (after yet another door falls off!), this was the earliest they could do it!!
On the charge controller, I now have two solid lights - this seems to tell me that both batteries are fully charged (unless someone with more knowledge can correct me).
I have not isolated the van via the button on the steering since I recharged the battery two months ago. After studying the Truma charge controller manual (not well written or designed) I changed the existing setting from gel to lead acid, as that is what I have fitted. SO fingers crossed, I think I now have a working charge system, that works despite much less sun.
I'm not telling the dealer, I still want them to investigate, the way it is wired up needs checking - but I'm hoping it was just set up for the wrong sort of battery and that is why it was not charging. Who's fault that is I have no idea, they will blame each other - but it may be the answer to other peoples issues too if correct. The system of lights and codes on the Truma is a joke in this day and age.
To be continued, but hopefully not for much longer!

 

[Just smiffy]

Should have bought my van, no such problems with anything.... not helpful I know but just my opinion like most others on here...

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[sb1957]

Make sure you're comparing like for like. PWM and MPPT are completely different devices. A PWM controller should cost about a quarter the price of an MPPT, although prices of both vary considerably.

So £599 for Truma (150W) fitted locally compared with £699 (160W) + travel + overnight stay for alternative seems about right assuming that, once labour charges are taken out and the cost of the panels are taken out the cost of the controller is a relatively small part of the full cost. And, in the hopefully unlikely event that it goes wrong (!), they're only 10 minutes away.

 

[eddie]

So £599 for Truma (150W) fitted locally compared with £699 (160W) + travel + overnight stay for alternative seems about right assuming that, once labour charges are taken out and the cost of the panels are taken out the cost of the controller is a relatively small part of the full cost. And, in the hopefully unlikely event that it goes wrong (!), they're only 10 minutes away.

Does the £599 include the Van Bitz Battery Master?

Not touting for work as we are probably too busy to sort your problem in your time frame, but as we are being used as a "comparison, it seems sensible to ask

 

[sb1957]

Well, I'm actually dropping the van off this afternoon for service and repairs (after yet another door falls off!), this was the earliest they could do it!!
..... The system of lights and codes on the Truma is a joke in this day and age.
To be continued, but hopefully not for much longer!

Certainly agree with Truma codes.... trying to figure out why I can't turn the fridge or hot water on shouldn't require a major exercise involving manuals, codes, headscratching rather than a panel that says something like "You havent turned the gas on you halfwit".

 

[Simon Select]

Thanks folks. I've just been to the MH (Which is new, and has that same Truma unit fitted) I have retrieved both the manuals and the battery for attention back home. I have emailed both the dealer and Bailey but have not had a reply yet from either. The battery is now on a smart charger and hopefully will be recovered in a day or two.
Since there in NO charge on the vehicle battery despite the fantastic weather, I can only assume it's not connected and the Batt #1 and #2 refers to the option for a second habitation battery (Only guessing!).
Either way, as a newbie to motorhomes and having spent so much on the machine, I'm feeling constantly let down by Bailey. If there is a valid reason that the vehicle battery is not maintained, why is this not pointed out in the paperwork or mentioned by the dealer - I was really pleased to think it would be maintained during the winter so that the security equipment always had power!
*Battery Master - Dyslexia rules KO.

If its a new 75-4 it should be a dual regulator for the hab and engine battery.

 

[sb1957]

Does the £599 include the Van Bitz Battery Master?

Not touting for work as we are probably too busy to sort your problem in your time frame, but as we are being used as a "comparison, it seems sensible to ask

Hi Eddie (?). No, no Battery Master. But- to be clear- I wasn't the one doing the comparing. As a newcomer to this, I did the usual thing... reviews, YouTube etc and the Truma kit sounded safe if not exciting. I then got a few quotes which ranged from £599 to £999. One of the "better" quotes then wanted an extra £70 if I actually wanted it connected to both batteries rather than just 1. I'd originally ruled out the local dealer because they were heavily booked-up into what then seemed like the distant future. But then, a price of £599 fitted, connected to both batteries and literally 10 minutes away seemed decent and worth waiting a bit. In terms of Battery Master, I've read the website description. I've got a 2019 Adria Twin 600 and I appear to have successfully charged the starter battery from the electric hook up. Does this mean I wouldn't need a Battery Master or am I misunderstanding something?

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[eddie]

In terms of Battery Master, I've read the website description. I've got a 2019 Adria Twin 600 and I appear to have successfully charged the starter battery from the electric hook up. Does this mean I wouldn't need a Battery Master or am I misunderstanding something?

If you keep your van plugged in to hook up all the time there is no point wasting your money on a Battery Master.

If not the Battery Master is the best way to keep your engine battery "maintained" Dual Solar works OK, but in the depth of Winter solar activity is poor to say non existent at times, short days get a couple of weeks "greyed out" like we experienced with the "Beast from the East" and you can forget about solar.

Ironically solar works best in June, when we all sit outside from first thing in the morning till late at night LOL

 

[sb1957]

Cheers. Really clear answer. I'm learning stuff all the time! Makes cars seem so simple....

 

[cmcardle75]

But then, a price of £599 fitted, connected to both batteries and literally 10 minutes away seemed decent and worth waiting a bit.

I would check that the kit includes MPPT, or what the cost of adding MPPT to it is. A decent MPPT controller costs more than £100 more than a PWM controller.

 

[sb1957]

No- no MPPT controller. Had a good chat with dealer. Adria apparently fitting MPPT controllers when van fitted with solar panels as new (as an option) and they have also done quite a few retrofit MPPT controllers in addition to the SDC20 that comes with the Truma kit. Their view is that so far, although the MPPT squeezes some extra power out of the panels, the Truma stuff is proving to be trouble-free. To be honest, as long as the panels charge both batteries I don't really care what happens between.

 

[Gerby]

Hi TinTentTourist have you had a chance to read the manual for the mppt in the van yet, looking at mine (79-6) it shows that you can set what percentage of charge from the solar panel goes to which battery (hab or cab) if your mppt is fitted with 2 sets of outlet wires it is possible that the mppt has been set to output its charge just to one of the batteries (the mppt just talks about battery 1 or 2, in our case 1 is the hab and 2 is the cab though it may possibly vary from van to van)

When I got ours I set my mppt to output 80% to Hab and 20% to cab and have found that this is more than adequate to maintain the charge in the cab battery, I don't isolate the cab battery and have tracker and alarm fitted and even after leaving it on the drive for 4 months it started first time with no issues

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[Minxy]

No- no MPPT controller. Had a good chat with dealer. Adria apparently fitting MPPT controllers when van fitted with solar panels as new (as an option) and they have also done quite a few retrofit MPPT controllers in addition to the SDC20 that comes with the Truma kit. Their view is that so far, although the MPPT squeezes some extra power out of the panels, the Truma stuff is proving to be trouble-free. To be honest, as long as the panels charge both batteries I don't really care what happens between.

The dealer is talking b*llocks ... there is no reason whatsoever that a MPPT can't be fitted in place of a PWM one without causing any issues. Call me cynical but it sounds more like they don't do it because they have either bought in kits with the PWM as standard or they don't tell people who want solar fitted so that their price compares more favourably with other installers who it with an MPPT.

The dealer should install what the customer wants, not what is 'convenient' for them.

 

[sb1957]

The dealer is fitting what I asked for. One with Mppt was more expensive and I didn’t want to pay any more. They’d have happily fitted a more expensive one or I could have gone for a 100W panel + MPPT for same price.

 

[sb1957]

Also see that MotorHome and Caravan club sell the same Truma kit, with member discount, for just under £700 without fitting. Time will tell, but I’m happy with the deal. 150w, £599 fitted by a firm I know well who are 10 minutes away and to date have been spot-on.

 

[Timbo57]

Chance are your solar only charges the hab battery. Ask how I know! I have a 2019 Burstner so have the same issue.

Best advice is to invest in a Battery Master from Van Bitz.

Our 2020 Ixeo gives a float charge to the starter battery. It's worth a look as the starter battery is more important in a lay over than the hab battery

 

[Huw s]

I took our truma two output controller apart today - 2 blown fets. I've ordered some from cpcfarnell.

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[Paul Wilkins]

Apologies for being late to the party on this thread, but I though I'd add my 3p worth. I had the same issue with my 79-4. I asked my dealer, "Should the solar panel maintain the vehicle battery?". "Yes, if you'd like to bring it in we'll check it for you."
Turns out Bailey had not installed the wiring from the Truma unit to the vehicle battery. Very common in 2017/18 built units apparently. So, if you have a 17/18 Bailey 'whatever', check there are 6 cables coming out of the Truma unit.

Happy New Year Folks.

 

[Pugsy]

TinTentTourist ,how did you get on in the end??

 

[Paul and Kate]

Apologies for being late to the party on this thread, but I though I'd add my 3p worth. I had the same issue with my 79-4. I asked my dealer, "Should the solar panel maintain the vehicle battery?". "Yes, if you'd like to bring it in we'll check it for you."
Turns out Bailey had not installed the wiring from the Truma unit to the vehicle battery. Very common in 2017/18 built units apparently. So, if you have a 17/18 Bailey 'whatever', check there are 6 cables coming out of the Truma unit.

Happy New Year Folks.

6 ????
As in 2 in from the panel and 4 out going to batteries???

 

[Paul Wilkins]

6 ????
As in 2 in from the panel and 4 out going to batteries???

Yup..

 

[mitzimad]

a lot of people recommend mppt as being superior to pwm best i can see is a 20 per cent gain, if you have the roof space a second panel is a much better watts per pound solution

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[The Wino]

a lot of people recommend mppt as being superior to pwm best i can see is a 20 per cent gain, if you have the roof space a second panel is a much better watts per pound solution

I dithered about that this year when I fitted mine but in the end decided that as I had no panel before and few times when we were short of battery that a smaller one would be ok but bought a poshish controller (victron) . mainly in a hope of reliability.

 

[two]

a lot of people recommend mppt as being superior to pwm best i can see is a 20 per cent gain, if you have the roof space a second panel is a much better watts per pound solution

I agree.

MPPT may be up to 20% more efficient than PWM but PWM may be good enough most of the time.
So long as you can 'fill' your battery bank, it does not matter how long it takes.
MPPT may be technically superior but good enough is all you need.

I'd go for MPPT if buying a new controller, but I don't think it's worth replacing a PWM one for such a small gain. I'd not bother about a dual controller (especially if I had mixed battery technologies) - I'd use a single controller for the habitation bank and a BatteryMaster type device to keep the starter battery topped-up.

 

[Driventemple]

a lot of people recommend mppt as being superior to pwm best i can see is a 20 per cent gain, if you have the roof space a second panel is a much better watts per pound solution

Depends on the output voltage of the panel. Most 100 - 150w panels output 18v. If the panel output is higher then the MPPT controler can make use of the extra.

 

[cmcardle75]

I agree.

MPPT may be up to 20% more efficient than PWM but PWM may be good enough most of the time.
So long as you can 'fill' your battery bank, it does not matter how long it takes.
MPPT may be technically superior but good enough is all you need.

I'd go for MPPT if buying a new controller, but I don't think it's worth replacing a PWM one for such a small gain. I'd not bother about a dual controller (especially if I had mixed battery technologies) - I'd use a single controller for the habitation bank and a BatteryMaster type device to keep the starter battery topped-up.

As well as general efficiency gains in normal summer conditions, an MPPT can get much more power in winter, particularly if you wire multiple panels in series, as a MPPT controller can typically cope with a much higher voltage (i.e. 75-100V), meaning that when the light levels are low, the reduced voltage is still useful. When a "12V" panel (actually 19V) drops much below 14V, it can't put anything into the battery at all.

 

[TinTentTourist]

Hi, sorry for my delayed reply... one of those days... again!

No real update on my issue. The van went into the dealer a couple of weeks before the last lockdown. Bailey again sent the wrong parts (another wrong overhead door!). And Bailey modified the heater ducting into the driver footwell when they built it, resulting in no airflow to the drivers side footwell. Bailey didn't respond to requests for information in a timely manner (they never do) and my van went into lockdown with the dashboard in pieces, still at the dealer.

Despite three emails to the dealer since they reopened, I have not even had the courtesy of a reply... Can't say I'm enjoying this experience at all (and I know I'm not unique in that respect).

One day I hope to be able to update this tread properly - from a campsite in Scotland?

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