Motorhoming in Greece - Drastic news.

[Northernraider]

Nope, it has been illegal to wild camp for over a decade, they ars only now clamping down and have added more restrictive elements.

Yes but there has always been a distinction between camping and parking, the police were generally not bothered about vans being parked unless there was a specific no motorhome restriction. The law was amended in January this year which no bans parking a motorhome or caravan etc anywhere other than a campsite .

That's the issue .

I don't camp in Greece. Most places I am simply parked .

There are places where you can take a chair outside etc because they're miles from any houses or campsites etc and no one ever bothered.

The new part of the law is ridiculous

 

[AlanandMayya]

Well as you all know, I just started last year and was hoping to get at least 10 years of usage from the van. Seems that goal gets less and less likely every day

We're just in our second year in Das Van. Having been moved on by police a few times, and found sites full, we now go only off grid, to remote spots. If you're far enough from the nearest bar, nobody else wants to be there and you can have a blissful time. Really the whole point of camping, be it in a van or a tent, I think. With a good electrical setup and 150 litres of water a week between trips to town is still comfortable. There's also nothing for The Dog to bark at, which is a huge bonus.

 

[Molly A]

Yep

Yes but there has always been a distinction between camping and parking, the police were generally not bothered about vans being parked unless there was a specific no motorhome restriction. The law was amended in January this year which no bans parking a motorhome or caravan etc anywhere other than a campsite .

That's the issue .

I don't camp in Greece. Most places I am simply parked .

There are places where you can take a chair outside etc because they're miles from any houses or campsites etc and no one ever bothered.

The new part of the law is ridiculous

Yep. Pretty conversant with the additional bits of nonsense. One interesting part is the prohibition for private landowners to have more than one motorhome on their land, which also prevents tavernas from having motorhomes in any context on their land/ carparks. The taverna we stayed at outside Agrinio did not seem bothered by any changes to the law, but it is a quiet area and still early in the season. It seems like the government in is trying to prevent informal " pop up" motorhome stops doing business, but at this point, unwilling to understand the impacts of prohibiting anything other than the use of campsites , which are unlikely to be able to deal with the demand . I suspect a lot will depend on the appetite of the police in differing geographic areas, as to how hard they intend to crack down . And that will vary from Draconian action to looking the other way at the behest of local businesses who benefit significantly from motorhome business .

 

[Northernraider]

Nope, it has been illegal to wild camp for over a decade, they ars only now clamping down and have added more restrictive elements.

As I said it's been illegal to wildcamp ...it has not been illegal to park a camper van on a beach or forest mountains etc. I've been doing Greece now for 3/4 month periods since 2019 and have been asked to move on less than 6 times during that time.

There is a difference between camping and parking. If you are parked there was never an issue. The new law makes it illegal to park a camper anywhere bar official campsites.

 

[Molly A]

As I said it's been illegal to wildcamp ...it has not been illegal to park a camper van on a beach or forest mountains etc. I've been doing Greece now for 3/4 month periods since 2019 and have been asked to move on less than 6 times during that time.

There is a difference between camping and parking. If you are parked there was never an issue. The new law makes it illegal to park a camper anywhere bar official campsites.

Therein lies the problem, the differentiation between camping and parking. It is clear that the intent of this law is to ignore the difference and prohibit parking in it's widest sense, be it for 20 minutes to hit the shops or grab a coffee, or to sleep for the night in a quiet town car park, as we have frequently done in Preveza in November , having shopped and stayed out for dinner . It is very much a sledgehammer to crack a nut, as I'm pretty sure the law intends to prohibit any parking with the intention to sleep in your van , and not the day to day domestic requirements of using a van as ones primary vehicle. This is the area that many greek businesses are rightly furious about and causing ructions politically. Having said that, we have parked up to shop, including outside the main police station in Agrinio , in a which we had business and had no issues.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[CazPaul]

Therein lies the problem, the differentiation between camping and parking. It is clear that the intent of this law is to ignore the difference and prohibit parking in it's widest sense, be it for 20 minutes to hit the shops or grab a coffee, or to sleep for the night in a quiet town car park, as we have frequently done in Preveza in November , having shopped and stayed out for dinner . It is very much a sledgehammer to crack a nut, as I'm pretty sure the law intends to prohibit any parking with the intention to sleep in your van , and not the day to day domestic requirements of using a van as ones primary vehicle. This is the area that many greek businesses are rightly furious about and causing ructions politically. Having said that, we have parked up to shop, including outside the main police station in Agrinio , in a which we had business and had no issues.

You would think the Greek business owners would have had a say before all this crackdown occurred, surely local policemen will have sympathy and not be strict as some of them may know the taverna business owners.

 

[jumar]

First point jumar lives in Spain.
Fiddlesticking is the forums answer to f'eckin
Their point about f,d,and nl vans is due to the vast amount of German and Dutch motorhomes who don't respect the no camping rules and insist on having chairs tables bicycles etc outside vans on display...many even have large plant pots etc now.. often reserving spaces on beaches and carparks with the aforementioned items whilst they go off out for the day. And as a result have caused countless restrictions on the costas and other places.....of course other Nationalities including some brits do this too but they're in the minority overall. Even the French are less guilty than the Germans and Dutch.


And Spain is always clogged up ....mostly over winter

Couldn't put it better myself Tam..

 

[Soycd]

T

Certain parts of the UK. No problems up where I'm at thanks.

Then you are very lucky. I spent many years living in Germany and was staggered when we came back to see the lack of places to stay (legally) overnight in UK in a motorhome/campervan. Even the small town we lived in had two stellplatz, one free the other paying.

 

[nicholsong]

That's interesting. So effectively before the new law came in it would have been perfectly legal to stay there, with the owners consent. Seems the sledgehammer to crack the nut applies with the new law. at CamWe stayedperstop Fanaria near Corinth last year, presumably at the moment it's even illegal to stay there if there is more than one camper. I doubt they would have a formal licence as its a restaurant that allows you to stay over. I'm trying to be optimistic that once the dust settles things will look brighter. We still plan to go back to Greece again next year so am watching developments with interest. Certainly don't want the whole of Europe to become narrow minded about motorhomers........... like the UK.

We have stayed at Fanaria 3 times and it would stupid if the law prevented that ex-filling station hosting MHs.

Since this and other places are private land, what rights do the police have to evict anyone from it?

If they do have such rights, how can the police be prevented from evicting the landowners if they are critical of the government, Via a Vis the Trump government attempts.

 

[CAB96]

Until the EES system starts...

What does the EES system have to do with EU residents?

Nicholsong's post was about getting EU residence. If you are an EU resident, EES is not a problem.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Molly A]

You would think the Greek business owners would have had a say before all this crackdown occurred, surely local policemen will have sympathy and not be strict as some of them may know the taverna business owners.

I have heard that in some areas that may be the case. I suspect that the main 'trouble spots' like some of the beaches that dozens and dozens of wild campers stay on for weeks or months on end will be the obvious targets. The small village inland with an obliging taverna owner with a couple of vans a night will possibly not attract the same attention, particularly out of season. My understanding was that nobody had a say, not even the motorhome dependant businesses.

What does the EES system have to do with EU residents?

Nicholsong's post was about getting EU residence. If you are an EU resident, EES is not a problem.

Fair point.

 

[pandas]

So is it like Spain, tolerated in winter out of season but as soon as the season hits they are clearing everyone off?

Cannot think why anyone would want to be on the coast in Spain in or out of season. Quite unbelievable how the Spanish have managed to decimate their heritage for a shilling or two.

 

[MichaelT]

Cannot think why anyone would want to be on the coast in Spain in or out of season. Quite unbelievable how the Spanish have managed to decimate their heritage for a shilling or two.

Don't knock it till you've tried it we've done last 2 winters and it's wonderful.

 

[Jon Stewart]

Cannot think why anyone would want to be on the coast in Spain in or out of season. Quite unbelievable how the Spanish have managed to decimate their heritage for a shilling or two.

Laurie Lee's 'A Rose for Winter' is worth a read in that context.

 

[pandas]

Don't knock it till you've tried it we've done last 2 winters and it's wonderful.

Travelled through several times but yes I haven’t tried staying there as a snow bird over the winter months - having seen it up close and personal we would not want to. Others have other opinion which I respect.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[jerryz]

What alternatives are there to over crowded Spain , Portugal and anti MH greece in the winter months , that is not Morocco .

 

[jumartoo]

Cannot think why anyone would want to be on the coast in Spain in or out of season. Quite unbelievable how the Spanish have managed to decimate their heritage for a shilling or two.

The worst bits are the bits people shouldn't be long staying on, but yes the Spanish authorities need to get their act together (already passed into law) and enforce it.

 

[Emmit]

I would love to go to Greece, but. HOWEVER

Not that I'm an expert on Legislation phrasing but it seems me that, as reported, the new law in Greece is unenforceable.
Yes, I know it's all right saying this from a rally field in Blighty but think for a minute.

If the new law says that a motorhome cannot be parked even on private land, how have the lawmakers in Greece made motorhome owners in Greece non culpable.
After all, they are parking a van on private land.
It would take a real legal wording contortionist to get around that.

 

[Peregrinator]

Who wants to drag a motorhome about when in a couple of hours in a Ryanair plane at £100 each return you can get be here.View attachment 1050732

I want my home with me while Traveling can't carry everything on a plane or in the hold {too much airport tax & Airline fee's}, all too heavy, what is one to do, Hire Camera's, Hire Bike's and Buy clothes when out there? and worst of all stuck in one place, no thank you, I want to travel, hence why I got a Motorhome, if I wanted to stay in one place, I would have bought a Villa or Static Van.

 

[chaser]

I want my home with me while Traveling can't carry everything on a plane or in the hold {too much airport tax & Airline fee's}, all too heavy, what is one to do, Hire Camera's, Hire Bike's and Buy clothes when out there? and worst of all stuck in one place, no thank you, I want to travel, hence why I got a Motorhome, if I wanted to stay in one place, I would have bought a Villa or Static Van.

I could argue all those points but done it that many times I am not going to bother.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Barriesimpson]

What alternatives are there to over crowded Spain , Portugal and anti MH greece in the winter months , that is not Morocco .

Scotland, Wales, Ireland. And of course, the Canary Islands

 

[barryd]

Scotland, Wales, Ireland. And of course, the Canary Islands

The Canary islands is not a bad idea. Years ago we used to do long term lets in the Canaries over winter. Cheap flights, do a deal with the owners of apartments / villas etc. Not been for about ten years but it was pretty good. Properly warm day and night unlike anywhere on mainland Europe.

 

[Lenny HB]

The Canary islands is not a bad idea. Years ago we used to do long term lets in the Canaries over winter. Cheap flights, do a deal with the owners of apartments / villas etc. Not been for about ten years but it was pretty good. Properly warm day and night unlike anywhere on mainland Europe.

But they are in the Schengen zone.

 

[jerryz]

But they are in the Schengen zone.

Schengen does not affect me i have an Austrian passport ,, but I want to Motorhome somewhere hot in the winter otherwise i might as well just go to my place in Thailand ,,,dont fancy crowded spain , i just dont click with it ??? ,, Even though I sort of speak Spanish its not like Latin America where I used to work ....The Culture in Spain is different ,,,

 

[barryd]

But they are in the Schengen zone.

Yep but only a four hour flight so two or three months over winter is fairly easy!

Greece, Spain and Portugal are also in the Schengen zone so unless you naff off to Morocco or into the Balkans your stuffed there as well. The 90 days thing is a complete PIA though for sure. Boils my blood but best not go there.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Barriesimpson]

The Canary islands is not a bad idea. Years ago we used to do long term lets in the Canaries over winter. Cheap flights, do a deal with the owners of apartments / villas etc. Not been for about ten years but it was pretty good. Properly warm day and night unlike anywhere on mainland Europe.

You can take the van too, takes a while to get there but it can be done.

 

[barryd]

You can take the van too, takes a while to get there but it can be done.

So I gather but its a hell of a journey and very expensive. For me personally as the islands are quite small I think I would prefer a villa / apartment and just a hire car. I know someone who often does this in Portugal but they take their own car.

 

[Northernraider]

Scotland, Wales, Ireland. And of course, the Canary Islands

The only one of those places I'd want to be in winter in a motorhome is the canary Islands. The rest are wet and freezing.
Unfortunately the canary Islands is expensive to get to and as part of shengen you're still limited to 90 days .

 

[Barriesimpson]

The only one of those places I'd want to be in winter in a motorhome is the canary Islands. The rest are wet and freezing.
Unfortunately the canary Islands is expensive to get to and as part of shengen you're still limited to 90 days .

Well the main expense is the ferry obviously, and for you guys it is around €2.000 and of course the 90 days business is a pain in the arse. As you know, we are on our way to Ireland and we have been travelling for 3 weeks already and we haven't left France yet. So yeah, not really viable for many.

 

[Northernraider]

Well the main expense is the ferry obviously, and for you guys it is around €2.000 and of course the 90 days business is a pain in the arse. As you know, we are on our way to Ireland and we have been travelling for 3 weeks already and we haven't left France yet. So yeah, not really viable for many.

I love the canaries I've visited many times mostly gran canaria and it was as a result of being offered a job out there that started me fulltiming.. my first long trip in 2018 was meant to take me there but while on route through Spain I was informed the place I was meant to be working had shut down and that led me to just travel around Spain and Portugal for a year instead. And here I am 7.5 years later lol.

I've not taken the van there but I have friends who have but really need to do all the Islands to justify the ferry cost to one of them from Spain..

And that's more expensive again .. and would still have to go to Morocco to extend that 90 days .

At least with Greece there's Turkey and further afield georgia Azerbaijan Almeria etc to explore . Its a pity Bulgaria and Romania are also now in shengen as they're also good to explore but again cold in winter

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}