Payload confusion (1 Viewer)

[Captain Yoghurtpot]

Can anyone help with my confusion please.
This is the plated information on our motorhome inside the engine bay.
What do these 4 figures actually mean, and can I work out my payload from them as a rule of thumb.
Thanks.

 

[Lenny HB]

That is the Fiat plate so not relavant to Motorhome it is the converts plate that counts. You need to find the converters plate.

But this is what it means.

3200kg MAM the max you can weigh used to be called Gross weight.
4800kg is the Train weight, the max total with a trailer.
1690kg Max on front axle.
1750kg Max on rear axle.

 

[dalspa]

Phone CI with VIN No. and ask them where the plate is and/or what numbers they put on it.

But since being constructed there may have been additions such as awning, satellite dish, solar panel, heavier battery(s) etc which would all reduce the actual payload. Only true way would be to have it weighed.

 

[Brian Thompson]

We all wish - it would then provide decent payloads. Alas 3200kg is the maximum laden weight and 4800kg is the max when towing a trailer

I stand corrected, my mistake You are correct

 

[Toskana75]

My Hobby has 4 plates the Fiat manufacturers plate for the Chassis cab, the Alko plate, the converter Hobby plate and finally a chartered motor engineers uplate.
And the V5 was a shambles
It had 2axel when it was 3 (tag axel)
No engine number, weight wrong. All rectified when I up-plated it.
There are loads of tags registered incorrectly as 2axels, out of 10 random advertisements 8 were still reg as 2 axel’s.

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[poppycamper]

Deleted.. Lenny HB got there first.
AGAIN!!!

 

[JockandRita]

Can anyone help with my confusion please.

Hi Iain, it's exactly as Lenny HB's advice.

The converters plate may be on the bonnet slam panel close to the Fiat plate, or inside the cab, often seen stuck to the seat base, as you open either of the cab doors. On an A Class, it can be on a lower external body skirt, or just inside the habitation door, pending make and model.

Good luck finding it.

Jock.

 

[Headrush]

Whichever plate is in effect on the vehicle, the only way to work out your payload is to visit a weighbridge while empty and get the weight.
Then subtract that figure from the gross weight (MAM). What remains will be your maximum payload.

It's impossible to guess the payload from the plate. Note that the axle weights add up to more than the gross weight, they are the maximum allowed, not something to aim for.

 

[Captain Yoghurtpot]

Thanks so far to the replies.
I have tried, and tried and tried to find a converters plate and have had no success whatsoever having turned the van almost inside out.
Not sure if in 2001 such things were so rigidly applied by Ci which is when our van was built.
I am looking to put the van up for sale and want to give as accurately a description and relevant weight levels etc as possible.
So.........basically then, get total van weighed EMPTY, then subtract that figure from MAM weight( gross weight) of 3200kg to give the payload available, with a MAXIMUM load on the FRONT axle of 1690kg, And REAR axle of 1750kg?.
I seem to recall that when I first joined the forum I THOUGHT I had this sussed around 2018 ish, but now I am not at all convinced, so will start again.
Thankfully though, on our trips of the last 6 years we have travelled extremely light without much water to start but almost full fuel and limited food and chattels, and people, so am fairly convinced we were within any limits.
But we shall see.

 

[pappajohn]

Note that the axle weights add up to more than the gross weight, they are the maximum allowed

But not at the same time.
They allow for a heavier load on one axle up to the axle limit at the expense of the other axle (deduct weight from other axle if gross weight is reached)

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[Detnor]

Bearing in mind everything that has been said, the only figure you can say is what it is legally on the road at, that is the revenue weight on the V5 (log book), that at least will tell any potential purchaser where they stand and the excise duty.

 

[nicholsong]

Thanks so far to the replies.
I have tried, and tried and tried to find a converters plate and have had no success whatsoever having turned the van almost inside out.
Not sure if in 2001 such things were so rigidly applied by Ci which is when our van was built.
I am looking to put the van up for sale and want to give as accurately a description and relevant weight levels etc as possible.
So.........basically then, get total van weighed EMPTY, then subtract that figure from MAM weight( gross weight) of 3200kg to give the payload available, with a MAXIMUM load on the FRONT axle of 1690kg, And REAR axle of 1750kg?.
I seem to recall that when I first joined the forum I THOUGHT I had this sussed around 2018 ish, but now I am not at all convinced, so will start again.
Thankfully though, on our trips of the last 6 years we have travelled extremely light without much water to start but almost full fuel and limited food and chattels, and people, so am fairly convinced we were within any limits.
But we shall see.

Phone CI with VIN No. and ask them where the plate is and/or what numbers they put on it.

 

[Lazyboy]

What does it say on the V5?

 

[FrankNicklin]

That is the Fiat plate so not relavant to Motorhome it is the converts plate that counts. You need to find the converters plate.

But this is what it means.

3200kg MAM the max you can weigh used to be called Gross weight.
4800kg is the Train weight, the max total with a trailer.
1690kg Max on front axle.
1750kg Max on rear axle.

Why don't the convertors remove the vehicle plate after conversion or replace it with the conversion weights. Is there a legal requirement to keep the original manufacturers plate as it will never be that weight again.

 

[Lenny HB]

Is there a legal requirement to keep the original manufacturers plate

Yes.

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[FrankNicklin]

On mine the weights from the Fiat manufacturer plate and the swift plate are exactly the same.

 

[Captain Yoghurtpot]

Phone CI with VIN No. and ask them where the plate is and/or what numbers they put on it.

What, in Italy?
Conversion was done in Italy I believe as all documentation is in Italien as it was imported to a RH spec by Don Amott Leisure Kingdom in 2001.

 

[Captain Yoghurtpot]

Bearing in mind everything that has been said, the only figure you can say is what it is legally on the road at, that is the revenue weight on the V5 (log book), that at least will tell any potential purchaser where they stand and the excise duty.

V5 has no revenue weight stated.
But does state 'Motor Caravan' and thus is taxed accordingly at £300+ od per year.
Mot is class 4.

 

[Spriddler]

Phone CI with VIN No. and ask them where the plate is and/or what numbers they put on it.

What, in Italy?

I believe they do have phones in Italy and people who speak English , although they may not have records from 20+ years ago. Worth a try though - now't to lose, eh?

 

[Captain Yoghurtpot]

I believe they do have phones in Italy and people who speak English , although they may not have records from 20+ years ago. Worth a try though - now't to lose, eh?

No, nothing to loose at all.
Just got to find who exactly to phone and where, ie who now would be the ownership group.
Think the easiest is empty van, weigh it unladen with only known water on board at 1kg per ltr and roughly the same for diesel, then do the maths.
Needs to stop raining first though otherwise will get soaked.

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[Minxy]

Deleted.. Lenny HB got there first.
AGAIN!!!

I think he's just sitting there like a preying mantis waiting for an interesting thread to pop up so he can answer it!

 

[gus-lopez]

V5 has no revenue weight stated.

You need to see what MAM is on the V5

 

[FrankNicklin]

For the record my Swift plate is attached to the slam panel next to the manufacturers plate.

 

[The Artilleryman]

Bailey's trick is to put it in the gas locker, usually behind a gas bottle so difficult to see.

 

[Littlewheels]

Why don't the convertors remove the vehicle plate after conversion or replace it with the conversion weights. Is there a legal requirement to keep the original manufacturers plate as it will never be that weight again.

If it’s legal that is so obvious the thing to do so there is no confusion for the lifetime of the MH , so why the hell don’t they do it.

Yes.

I personally have no knowledge of this but stand to be educated, the confusion caused if correct is illogical.

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[Captain Yoghurtpot]

You need to see what MAM is on the V5

According to the reply from Lenny HB to my photograph of the manufacturers Plate, the MAM is 3200kg, but this is not printed on the V5 , which also has a lot of other stuff missing from it.
Maybe when registered in 2001 new, they did not fill in all the blanks.
Doesn't even have specified number of seats.
I really don't know.

 

[Captain Yoghurtpot]

You need to see what MAM is on the V5

According to the reply from Lenny HB to my photograph of the manufacturers Plate, the MAM is 3200kg, but this is not printed on the V5 , which also has a lot of other stuff missing from it.
Maybe when registered in 2001 new, they did not fill in all the blanks.
Doesn't even have specified number of seats
I really don't know.

 

[Lenny HB]

Plate, the MAM is 3200kg, but this is not printed on the V5 , which also has a lot of other stuff missing from it.

Has it got an entry for Revenue Weight?

 

[Mr Colpot]

You could weigh it in holiday mode and then you can tell prospective buyers that weight and compare it to the 3200kg on the base plate (if you cant find the converters one) So they (and you) will know what payload is available.

 

[FrankNicklin]

My 52 Plate Swift has no weights at all listed on the V5, not a single one.