How long will they be using the 9-speed autos on Fiats (1 Viewer)

[Saucer]

Peter Vaughan has said that they are phasing these out for motorhome manufacturers, at least as I understand it. I think there has been discussion on here about a newer (?inferior) 8 speed auto on the way. We may not be ready to buy until next year when we may buy new. Do people think they will still be selling the 9-speed auto on new vans then? I thought some of you good (and well informed) people might know.
Thanks

 

[Jim]

I think the 9 speed is history already

 

[Lenny HB]

The 8 speed auto will be fitted to Series 10 Ducato's, I think the Series 10 is already in production for vans but not heard of any used for any Motorhomes yet, they are normally 6 to 9 months behind vans.
So it will probably be in 2025 model Motorhomes from September this year.

 

[Saucer]

Very helpful folks. So it’s buy new this year or second hand next if want it

 

[1967bowesj]

The 8 speed auto will be fitted to Series 10 Ducato's, I think the Series 10 is already in production for vans but not heard of any used for any Motorhomes yet, they are normally 6 to 9 months behind vans.
So it will probably be in 2025 model Motorhomes from September this year.

Lenny HB do we know which box manufacturer they are sourcing from?

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[dash300]

Very helpful folks. So it’s buy new this year or second hand next if want it

It would appear so. The 9 Speed is sublime but if the 8 speed is as good as my Volvo 8 Speed it will be good. Having said that it's the highly regarded Japanese Aisin Box. Not sure who is making the 8 speed. It could well be ZF.

 

[1967bowesj]

It would appear so. The 9 Speed is sublime but if the 8 speed is as good as my Volvo 8 Speed it will be good. Having said that it's the highly regarded Japanese Aisin Box. Not sure who is making the 8 speed. It could well be ZF.

I have the 6 speed aisin and it’s good but not as smoother as the last 8 speed zf I had.

 

[Lenny HB]

Lenny HB do we know which box manufacturer they are sourcing from?

I think it is being made by Chrysler at their South Carolina plant, same place as the 9 speed not sure if it is a ZF design but I think it is.

 

[Guigsy]

I think it is being made by Chrysler at their South Carolina plant, same place as the 9 speed not sure if it is a ZF design but I think it is.

The fact that there's a change suggests to me that it's not ZF. The ZF 9 speed is continuing in other brands. Auto boxes are a great way to decrease the average emissions of your vehicle line. But the ZF is far too expensive for most delivery vans. Only motorhomers option it and we make up an insignificant minority of their sales. Which is why I think they've found an in-house option from one of the Stellantis brands.

 

[Winger]

What I’ve read on here re Fiats and their gearboxes I’ll be steering clear. A manual causes me no issues

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[dash300]

I have the 6 speed aisin and it’s good but not as smoother as the last 8 speed zf I had.

That would be right; more gears the smoother. The Fiat 9 speed I rate highly and is widely acclaimed compared to previous Fiat Auto box reports. However I said above my 8 Speed Aisin is excellent also!

 

[TrudeandDall]

What I’ve read on here re Fiats and their gearboxes I’ll be steering clear. A manual causes me no issues

But we are not discussing a Fiat auto box - this is all about replacement for the ZF auto, which is definitely in a different league to the Fiat Comfortmatic box!

 

[andyelbac]

I think the new 8 speed is already available. Saw a YouTube clip of a new MH review last week and it quoted as having an 8 speed auto, just can't remember what video clip or which brand but was on a new Ducato. Think we are probably very lucky then to have the 9 speed, given the short window they have been available. Whatever the issues with the Fiat Comformatic box (never had one), I find the 9 speed fantastic to drive and we are pulling nearly 4000kg fully laden with just the 140hp multijet. It's been nearly 20 years since I bothered with a manual on a car; I certainly wouldn't consider a manual on a motorhome. For me, driving is all about being relaxed behind the wheel and only an automatic does that for me. Admittedly, that may say more about my driving style and state of mind than the advantage of an auto v manual!

 

[dunnah01]

What I’ve read on here re Fiats and their gearboxes I’ll be steering clear. A manual causes me no issues

Not aware of any Fiat gearbox failures except some newer 9 speed autos?

 

[catjuggler]

Picked up our new auto Rapido Dreamer campervan in March. The dashboard shows what gear you are in and I noticed it only goes up to 8 so I must have the new 8 speed box. It is very smooth in operation and has enough kick down to deal with German Autobahns and the Audis with blacked out windows that slash past you.

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[MichaelT]

Picked up our new auto Rapido Dreamer campervan in March. The dashboard shows what gear you are in and I noticed it only goes up to 8 so I must have the new 8 speed box. It is very smooth in operation and has enough kick down to deal with German Autobahns and the Audis with blacked out windows that slash past you.

You may not be going fast enough or have enough revs to go to 9th.

 

[Guigsy]

You may not be going fast enough or have enough revs to go to 9th.

The 9 speed is pretty shift happy. From what I've heard, it'll go to 9th at 50mph if you're coasting.

The 9 speed in the previous generation proudly said "9 SPEED" across the top of its gloss black gear knob... but I guess any change could just be styling.

 

[catjuggler]

We are going past the Nurburgring soon. Will check it out.

You may not be going fast enough or have enough revs to go to 9th.

 

[Brian Thompson]

I think the new 8 speed is already available. Saw a YouTube clip of a new MH review last week and it quoted as having an 8 speed auto, just can't remember what video clip or which brand but was on a new Ducato. Think we are probably very lucky then to have the 9 speed, given the short window they have been available. Whatever the issues with the Fiat Comformatic box (never had one), I find the 9 speed fantastic to drive and we are pulling nearly 4000kg fully laden with just the 140hp multijet. It's been nearly 20 years since I bothered with a manual on a car; I certainly wouldn't consider a manual on a motorhome. For me, driving is all about being relaxed behind the wheel and only an automatic does that for me. Admittedly, that may say more about my driving style and state of mind than the advantage of an auto v manual!

I have a Honda CVR with an automatic gearbox and a Motorhome with the Comformatic which isn't a true Auto but an assisted manual, there is no comparison. I'm looking to get a true Automatic Motorhome but I'm not sure what make to go for.

 

[Guigsy]

I have a Honda CVR with an automatic gearbox and a Motorhome with the Comformatic which isn't a true Auto but an assisted manual, there is no comparison. I'm looking to get a true Automatic Motorhome but I'm not sure what make to go for.

The new 8 speed is confirmed to be a true torque converter automatic. We just don't yet know where the design comes from, if it's as smooth as the ZF9, or if it's reliable.

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[Steve I]

The fact that there's a change suggests to me that it's not ZF. The ZF 9 speed is continuing in other brands. Auto boxes are a great way to decrease the average emissions of your vehicle line. But the ZF is far too expensive for most delivery vans. Only motorhomers option it and we make up an insignificant minority of their sales. Which is why I think they've found an in-house option from one of the Stellantis brands.

I personally think the 8 or 9sp in itself is almost irrelevant, the difference in ratios will be minuscule but the ZF box is very proven and I’d be reluctant to invest the sort of money a new van would be with a predominantly car manufacturers untested box at 3-4 tonne usage. Just my opinion and no doubt many will disagree, I am an auto Moho user btw but 6sp Ford 170 and been an excellent and reliable almost 5 years now.

 

[Guigsy]

I personally think the 8 or 9sp in itself is almost irrelevant, the difference in ratios will be minuscule but the ZF box is very proven and I’d be reluctant to invest the sort of money a new van would be with a predominantly car manufacturers untested box at 3-4 tonne usage. Just my opinion and no doubt many will disagree, I am an auto Moho user btw but 6sp Ford 170 and been an excellent and reliable almost 5 years now.

I agree. The number of ratios doesn't really matter. Anything from 6 up is diminishing returns. It's more that ZF are good at gearboxes. The ZF 9HP is smooth, fast, intuitive and reliable. Any change is a concern, just because it's unlikely to be better. And being new, it may have teething troubles.

 

[Bailey58]

Out of interest I have the the 9G-Tronic in the E class Merc and from memory only ever see it in 9th gear once, probably on a German autobahn, certainly not in the UK. What's the criteria, i.e. speed/revs to get in 9th? I'll add that I only ever use it in comfort mode, would that make a difference to achieving 9th?

 

[Lenny HB]

It's more that ZF are good at gearboxes.

Even when they are built by Chrysler.

 

[Rozzer]

It’ll go into 9th in eco. I’m pretty sure it’s ZF. Had an Adria with comfortomatic, like having a geriatric Italian changing gear for you. The Adria 3.5t returned 21-22mog on a good day, our new 4.5t does 30mpg on the autoroutes at 60mph if not too hilly.

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[HugoBNB]

Out of interest I have the the 9G-Tronic in the E class Merc and from memory only ever see it in 9th gear once, probably on a German autobahn, certainly not in the UK. What's the criteria, i.e. speed/revs to get in 9th? I'll add that I only ever use it in comfort mode, would that make a difference to achieving 9th?

Mine won't go into 9th unless it is rolling at about 80mph on my e-class. My SL used to go in at anything from 55mp. Likewise for my GLE. I think it is something to do with the torque development. The e-class is lacking in a few horses!

 

[MichaelT]

It’ll go into 9th in eco. I’m pretty sure it’s ZF. Had an Adria with comfortomatic, like having a geriatric Italian changing gear for you. The Adria 3.5t returned 21-22mog on a good day, our new 4.5t does 30mpg on the autoroutes at 60mph if not too hilly.

Our dethleffs at 4.5t does about 25mpg on a 180hp Comformatic so maybe the higher output engine are more economic than the smaller ones with a heavier vehicle?

 

[G7UXG]

Out of interest I have the the 9G-Tronic in the E class Merc and from memory only ever see it in 9th gear once, probably on a German autobahn, certainly not in the UK. What's the criteria, i.e. speed/revs to get in 9th? I'll add that I only ever use it in comfort mode, would that make a difference to achieving 9th?

If it’s the same 9G gearbox as in the Sprinter motorhome chassis, it’s a ZF.

I went searching around mine and found the ZF badge on the top of the gearbox. It says it’s a ZF9HP48, which I think is the same as the one used in the Fiat Ducato.

 

[Orion]

Out of interest I have the the 9G-Tronic in the E class Merc and from memory only ever see it in 9th gear once, probably on a German autobahn, certainly not in the UK. What's the criteria, i.e. speed/revs to get in 9th? I'll add that I only ever use it in comfort mode, would that make a difference to achieving 9th?

I’ll repost my reply to a similar query in another ‘9 speed auto’ thread:

If you have a 9-speed does it use the top 2 gears (use the manual override, can you get the rev reduction of the higher gears above 7? I tried this on a US van and it does stop at 7, can't access 8th, or 9th, gear).

Yes, can go all the way to 9th using the manual feature with mine.

I'd be interested to know what rpm you get in 7th, 8th, 9th at, say, 65mph, if anyone knows. No rush, just curious.

Had a chance to do this earlier today with a 100+ mile run up from Seville on the Autovia Ruta de La Plata (A-66). It’s a dual carriageway running over some quite hilly terrain, so gave the auto box a good work out with the cruise control on as it dropped into 6th on a few of the inclines.

This is a Ducato 2.2 160bhp and the CC was at a constant 95kph, so enough to keep ahead of the HGVs but still return decent economy. The ECO gear/throttle function was selected. Analogue dials but near enough to these figures:

6th gear 2500rpm
7th gear 2200rpm
8th gear 1800rpm
9th gear 1500rpm

The trip reading showed 33.6 mpg.

 

[Pausim]

Picked up our new auto Rapido Dreamer campervan in March. The dashboard shows what gear you are in and I noticed it only goes up to 8 so I must have the new 8 speed box. It is very smooth in operation and has enough kick down to deal with German Autobahns and the Audis with blacked out windows that slash past you.

My newly arrived but as yet unregistered Malibu Van has “9 Speed” on the gear selector knob.