Stopping distance of a motorhome

[BusyBuilder]

We are in litigation with a young lad who pulled out in front of us on a slip road on the A9.

The solicitor wants to know that stopping distance of a 4t Hymer B544 2012, on wet roads.

Basically this young lad pulled out on us and I had to stand on the brakes before we hit him. There wasn't a lot of damage to his car but over £5k to ours, bent inner steel bumper and bent both radiators. Front fibreglass grill was split but not much more, in fact you'd be hard pressed to see any damage looking at the front. His 2005 Vauxhall Corsa had a hole in his bumper where our towing eye punched through it, but not much more.

The accident happened just before Christmas 2023, wet roads with snow on verges. We had very little time to react. We were travelling at an indicated 50mph. I think we had about 15-20m to stop.

So if anyone can give me an idea on stopping distances I'd be interested.

What's really annoying about this accident, is, we are doing all the work for the benefit of Saga insurance who paid out over £5k for our damages. Saga dragged their heels for almost a year before we insisted we used our legal expenses insurance to fight our case. They have basically washed their hands now and left us to do all the work, the solicitor is a bit of a wet blanket too.
I would never recommend Saga insurance going by our claims experiences.

 

[Carpmart]

I can’t imagine any converter (Hymer) would test or has tested, so I’d guess there is no data available. Each piece of road and prevailing weather conditions makes it all completely mute anyway!

What’s the solicitor trying to prove?

 

[berni109]

Unanswerable question but obviously a bit further than the prat in the Corsa anticipated

 

[meanders]

I would ask Vosa if they can help, but I suspect too many variables to be prescriptive.

 

[lorger]

Just did a quick google and it gives you car and lorry braking distances, however as the above post it’s not an exact science as two drivers reactions won’t be the same. I’d tell the solicitor to find out for himself as you’re not required to know this so why would you.

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[pappajohn]

Whatever it states in the highway code.
It hasn't been updated since brakes were invented and applied to all vehicles up to 3500kg.

 

[BusyBuilder]

Whats puzzling me is the air bags didn't activate.

 

[pappajohn]

We were travelling at an indicated 50mph. I think we had about 15-20m to stop.

At 50mph the THINKING distance alone is 50ft....actual braking distance could be another 150ft

 

[tacr2man]

I would suggest that its irrelevant , you were on the main road the other driver failed to give way by virtue of the fact that you collided with him . His pulling out could not be predicated on an estimate of you being able to stop in time because of your vehicle being whatever it was .

 

[Guigsy]

Whats puzzling me is the air bags didn't activate.

It's got to be a pretty catastrophic crash for the airbag to fire. Like, bits of engine hanging out and wheels pointing in the wrong direction. Or there's a risk that the airbag does more damage than it helps, either from the burns, or because you couldn't control the vehicle in secondary knock-on impacts. They've got to make sure they don't go off unless they're really needed. Also, it would have added quite a lot more to the repair bill!

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[Googlebot]

Whats puzzling me is the air bags didn't activate.

They sometimes won’t. If they go off, it’s a very expensive business replacing them all and if the crash doesn’t warrant it, they won’t trigger.

This is very much so in Europe where seatbelt use is very high. The USA tend to have much bigger bags that trigger more easily as compliance with belts is very low.

I suspect Saga aren’t bothered as the cost to fight in court will probably exceed their losses in paying out. It’s frustrating, but I wouldn’t be bothering. My stress levels and time is more valuable than principle.

Ref stopping distances, it depends on the friction co-efficient of the road, how heavy the vehicle was at the time and tyres, etc etc. Impossible to say really and I wouldn’t want to test mine either. Everything ends up everywhere in the cupboards. :-(

 

[bigtwin]

Each piece of road and prevailing weather conditions makes it all completely mute anyway!

Are they attempting to suggest that you could stop in a shorter distance than that given in the Highway Code?

Their argument, presumably, is that they left enough space for you to be able to brake without hitting them. However, that’s a nonsense in any case. The obligation is on their driver to drive in such a way as to not cause a third party to change course, or speed. They materially failed in that obligation and it is not for them to argue that you should have been able to mitigate their failings.

Ian

 

[Guigsy]

Surely the argument should be that if he pulled out and you hit him, then he clearly didn't give way?

 

[L' Hobo]

We are in litigation with a young lad who pulled out in front of us on a slip road on the A9.

The solicitor wants to know that stopping distance of a 4t Hymer B544 2012, on wet roads.

Basically this young lad pulled out on us and I had to stand on the brakes before we hit him. There wasn't a lot of damage to his car but over £5k to ours, bent inner steel bumper and bent both radiators. Front fibreglass grill was split but not much more, in fact you'd be hard pressed to see any damage looking at the front. His 2005 Vauxhall Corsa had a hole in his bumper where our towing eye punched through it, but not much more.

The accident happened just before Christmas 2023, wet roads with snow on verges. We had very little time to react. We were travelling at an indicated 50mph. I think we had about 15-20m to stop.

So if anyone can give me an idea on stopping distances I'd be interested.

What's really annoying about this accident, is, we are doing all the work for the benefit of Saga insurance who paid out over £5k for our damages. Saga dragged their heels for almost a year before we insisted we used our legal expenses insurance to fight our case. They have basically washed their hands now and left us to do all the work, the solicitor is a bit of a wet blanket too.
I would never recommend Saga insurance going by our claims experiences.

It's hard to believe BUT, If your tyres etc were legal and your vehicle is constructed to conform with Construction & Use regulations, ALL vehicles should have the same stopping distance. That is the reason there is only one stopping distance shown in the Highway Code, not several.

Only the drivers reaction will make a difference?

Hope that helps!

 

[LesW]

As already suggested, just quote the highway code, if his solicitor wants any info as evidence against you, it's up to him to provide it.

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[Jev88]

As above, how is the answer relevant to the accident. They pulled out, you had right of way.

 

[Guigsy]

If someone pulls out on you and you have to brake, then they didn't give way. Isn't the stopping distance kind of irrelevant?

 

[Lenny HB]

Stopping distance is ilrelavant, if a driver of another vehicle causes you to take avoiding action they are in the wrong.
Sounds like the solicitor is a bit dim or working for the other side.

 

[pappajohn]

Just quote the distances in the highway code.....they can't argue with an official dept of transport document.

At 50mph the thinking distance is 15mtrs, the braking distance is 38mtrs, the overall stopping distance is 53mtrs.

 

[Fdhadi]

As stated by a number of replies above.

Put simply:

Any vehicle emerging from a minor to major road, should NOT cause any vehicle on the major road to “Slow Down, Stop or Change Direction” because of their actions.

In answer to the solicitor’s question, how long is a piece of string.
In this instance, obviously not long enough!

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[Brains]

Tell them to look it up.

I'm sure every police authority and insurance claims manager has access to the tables that tell them the stopping distance of that make make and model of van.
The fact that it's a 4t motorhome as opposed to a 4t van makes zero difference.

A valid question however would be the make, model and tread depth of the tyres as that would make a difference.

But the legal side it the stopping distance in the DVLA produced Highway Code book, which is probably pessimistic, as far as I know it's not changed with the introduction of ABS etc.

 

[Nanniemate]

Defensive HGV driving

Master defensive driving for lorry drivers. Covers observation, anticipation and control and highlights the importance of maintaining good separation.

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Stopping smoothly and safely in an HGV

Understand braking distances and the different types of braking systems on HGVs. Learn how to stop a lorry in a controlled, safe manner.

www.safedrivingforlife.info

 

[L' Hobo]

Defensive HGV driving

Master defensive driving for lorry drivers. Covers observation, anticipation and control and highlights the importance of maintaining good separation.

www.safedrivingforlife.info

Stopping smoothly and safely in an HGV

Understand braking distances and the different types of braking systems on HGVs. Learn how to stop a lorry in a controlled, safe manner.

www.safedrivingforlife.info

Just out of curiosity Lois, I wondered why you had NOT put a link to the OFFICIAL GOV.UK Highway Code?

 

[DandJ]

I'm with everyone else on this...what a ridiculous question. The Highway Code gives a guide but as we all know as experienced drivers, some tyres are better than others at stopping, tread depth makes a difference, road surface makes a difference to stopping distances, wet or dry makes a huge difference. If there was snow at the roadside, I'd hazard a guess at the temperatures being low so a winter or all season tyre will stop better than a 'summer' tyre...but are not a legal requirement. Any figure you somehow managed to find for your specific motorhome could be pulled to pieces by the 'other side' if your figure wasn't based on near identical conditions (which is why at some serious collisions, collision investigators do skid tests to get some real life figures for that specific stretch of road)

 

[The Coops]

Its a pointless question, the investigation has to be done at or as near to the time as possible to replicate the conditions prevalent at the time. Factors are the road surface temp, tyre pressure, tread depth, compound and temp, The road surface condition, skid resistance, mechanical condition of the vehicle, drivers physical and mental state as well as visibility ( Son is a Forensic collision investigator and he says there are pages of questions to ask that should have been addressed at the time if there was any serious injuries) his basic tenet on the collision is that the young lad is at fault as he has failed to take the necessary precautions before emerging onto the major road. You may need to find a more competent solicitor or one that deals specifically in road traffic collisions Contacts your insurance company and tell them why

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[Hedgewitch]

I am sorry you are going through this, but as others have said - if the solicitor wants information he can get it himself, probably far easier than you.

Your horrible situation is why I have both front and rear dashcams.

 

[yorkiebar]

OK, I've only had one coffee so far, please bear with me
If Saga have already paid out for your repairs, then what's the litigation about ? Is the other driver lodging some kind of claim ?

 

[Landy Andy]

Whats puzzling me is the air bags didn't activate.

The contact speed will have to be 30mph or above to fire the bags.

 

[Guigsy]

The insurance default is that when one car hits another in the rear, then the car behind is at fault. There has to be good evidence to counter this position. If they admit they pulled out on you, then that's probably enough.

Your insurance will pay out regardless. But it's now a negotiation that has to be agreed between the insurance companies as to where the fault lies, and hence how much each insurance company pays. Which will have an effect on future premiums.

In my limited experience, if you've got legal cover, they are far more willing to pursue the case.

 

[Oldrat]

Hi BB
You have a PM