Internet Router, some questions

[kevenh]

The thing is, if someone rocks up with an all singing all dancing wi-fi solution on their van, will they suck up all the bandwidth for themselves, leaving mere mortals with even patchier internet connection? Or will their systems not need the campsite router and just draw down from passing satellites or local residents domestic systems? I ask because years ago I was moored up in a marina on Guernsey which had free wi-fi if you were prepared to go and sit on a bench in a particular corner of the marina. The guy on the boat next to us was very proud of his military grade wi-fi aerial which meant he got the signal where he was but he was a bit cagey about whether that was impacting on our ability to get it.

I haven't heard of Mobile telecoms transmitters being overloaded.
Although, related, when people started sending SMS text messages to people, when they ALL tried to do that at 00:00:01* on NYE they were a bit unreliable in when the recipient received them.

That was a decade or 2 ago & the mobile communications network is different now.

So, what that means, IMO, is that lots of campers using 4G/5G to get their wifi won't overload the local area.
But if they were all just hanging on the campsite's Wifi then, yes, that site's own network is a much smaller resource to share the available bandwidth around.

*- I know that's crossing over to NYD

 

[autorouter]

If I install my own system, will it give me this option and will I be using my mobile ‘phone providers plan?

You first need to understand what a router does. A router is a two-sided device. One side sets up a local wifi connection, so you can connect laptop, ipad etc. The other side connects to the internet. At home, the internet connection is over the phone line.

A mifi is a router that connects to the internet via a mobile phone mast using a mobile phone data connection. It has a SIM, and needs a data package for the SIM that you pay for. The mifi router also sets up a local wifi connection, so you can connect your laptop, iPad etc.

There is a third possibility - a wifi booster. This is also a router. One side connects to the campsite wifi, which has internet access. The other side sets up a local wifi connection, so you can connect your laptop, iPad, etc. Because the aerials on the wifi booster are bigger and better than the tiny aerials in the laptop or iPad, it can pick up the campsite wifi from a greater distance. Another advantage is that, because it's a router, you can connect several devices to it, and the campsite wifi thinks there's only one connection to it.

The data transmission speed of a campsite wifi connection (aka the bandwidth) is limited. If there's many people sharing it, there won't be enough for everyone to stream TV, but checking emails and general browsing will probably be OK.

 

[Markman]

I started where you are.....in fact I’m still thick.

The Motorhome WiFi kit we have fitted is easy to use. We had it fitted by the dealer before picking our van up, however I believe the full kit is £299.

We use the Smarty Sim Card that came with it, and use a flexible contract. £10 for 30gb of data for 30 days. We don’t auto renew, but it’s easy to credit via the websit / app. As long as you credit the account one in 180 days the account stays open. If you are heavy data users you can buy more.

We then watch TV through our iPad. Even been able to do this when no signal shown on our phone.

I did quite a bit of research, and experimentation using phones on both 3 and O2 networks (i.e. having to leave the van to use the phone). After all that ended up with exactly this solution. And get signal almost always.

A question you need to answer yourself is whether to go for a 4G or a 5G antenna and router. 5G isn't available in places you'll park the campervan today. How fast is it rolling out? How long will you keep the van? How good, and expensive, is the 5G technology today compared to 2-3 years when it may well be available where you park your campervan?

My conclusion was to pay £100 extra for a 5G antenna but no extra for a 4G router. Replacing the antenna would be a pain (on the roof, holes, sealants, etc) but replacing the router would be trivial (unclip off magnet).

 

[mikeandmary]

You first need to understand what a router does. A router is a two-sided device. One side sets up a local wifi connection, so you can connect laptop, ipad etc. The other side connects to the internet. At home, the internet connection is over the phone line.

A mifi is a router that connects to the internet via a mobile phone mast using a mobile phone data connection. It has a SIM, and needs a data package for the SIM that you pay for. The mifi router also sets up a local wifi connection, so you can connect your laptop, iPad etc.

There is a third possibility - a wifi booster. This is also a router. One side connects to the campsite wifi, which has internet access. The other side sets up a local wifi connection, so you can connect your laptop, iPad, etc. Because the aerials on the wifi booster are bigger and better than the tiny aerials in the laptop or iPad, it can pick up the campsite wifi from a greater distance. Another advantage is that, because it's a router, you can connect several devices to it, and the campsite wifi thinks there's only one connection to it.

The data transmission speed of a campsite wifi connection (aka the bandwidth) is limited. If there's many people sharing it, there won't be enough for everyone to stream TV, but checking emails and general browsing will probably be OK.

Thanks and appreciation for this very informative information. I now have a better understanding of the subject. Just need to make a decision on which way to go.

 

[Sapper520]

The antenna for ours is the black thing to the left of the solar panel. I can take a photo of the inside fitment if you want?

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[mikeandmary]

The antenna for ours is the black thing to the left of the solar panel. I can take a photo of the inside fitment if you want?
View attachment 477390

That would be great, thanks.

 

[Crafty]

+1 for the teltonica RUT 955

It also has a gos connection, so if you install a combined 4g/gps/wifi antenna, you can text the router to find out where the van is, or have it text you when it leaves home.

 

[Sapper520]

That would be great, thanks.

 

[autorouter]

The Teltonika routers have a special 4-way plug that I haven't seen anywhere else. It works from a 12V supply (8 to 30V) that doesn't need to be stabilised (also works from 24V). The router comes with a wall-plug mains supply, and wires with a cigarette-lighter plug or 4-way terminal block are available on the website.

Two of the pins are, obviously, the supply positive and negative. The extra two pins can be ignored if you don't use them. They are an output and an input that can be read/controlled by the router, to switch something on and off, or register an alarm etc. You can set and read them by text message, for example.

 

[mikeandmary]

Thank you for the pics.
I note Motorhome Wi-fi kit. Was on their website earlier today because of positive reviews, obviously very knowledgeable and helpful. Did you install yourself? Very neat and tidy.

View attachment 477406View attachment 477407

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[Sapper520]

Thank you for the pics.
I note Motorhome Wi-fi kit. Was on their website earlier today because of positive reviews, obviously very knowledgeable and helpful. Did you install yourself? Very neat and tidy.

No, fitted by the Dealer as part of our deal on the van. I’m sure Motorhome Wifi will have a list of authorised / recommended installers.

Wouldn’t want the responsibility of drilling through my new roof. And electrical stuff is a black art to me. Able to knock up a plug in fan.....following instructions on YouTube but that’s it.

 

[RichardB]

We have the Teltonika RUT955 router mated to the Poynting MIMO 3 V2 roof mounted WI-FI/LTE/GPS antenna and have found it a fantastic combo, not cheap but does the job.

dpsuk999
After another weekend away with no internet, I have ordered a Mini 3 v2 to replace my Puck and a RUT955 to replace the netgear.
quick question, can I just wire the power direct to my 12v or does it come with a 12v power cable/cog lighter socket and also how did you mount yours to the wall?
Thanks
Richard

 

[dpsuk999]

Yes, as the RUT955 has a wide input range so can cope with voltage fluctuations well. I simply used Velcro to mount to the wall so I can move it to insert different SIM cards if required. Here is a picture:

 

[autorouter]

After another weekend away with no internet, I have ordered a Mini 3 v2 to replace my Puck and a RUT955 to replace the netgear.
quick question, can I just wire the power direct to my 12v or does it come with a 12v power cable/cog lighter socket and also how did you mount yours to the wall?

My RUTX11 has the same power socket as the RUT955, and came with a mains adapter with a 4-terminal plug - there is a 4-terminal socket on the router. Two of these are the standard '12V' positive and negative, the other two are a control output and a control input. It will be happy with any voltage from 8V to 40V, so no problems with voltage fluctuations. The control terminals can be ignored, but are there if you need them in the future.

I've not seen that 4-terminal plug before, so I have no idea where to buy one from, except from the suppliers of the router. I had to buy a cig lighter lead, which just had the positive and negative connected. Alternatively, they sell a wire with a 4-way screw terminal block on the end, if you want to wire it in directly.

They also sell some small clips that slot into grooves on the router box, and allow it to be screwed to the wall, which is what I did. dpsuk999's suggestion of velcro sounds a good idea too.

 

[RichardB]

Thanks both Velcro it is

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[Hagstrom]

I find this all bewildering!

Does the Motorhome WiFi £299 kit (I'm happy to fit it myself) not only receive 4g LTE mobile phone signals and re-broadcast through the van as WiFi via the router but also recieve public WiFi signals and re-broadcast them via the router?

How could you spend the £299 better? A 4g LTE Teltonika RUT240 router and a 5g ready (suspect this term is a bit suspicious and not quite what it claims to be) Poynings Puck MiMo aerial may future proof the aerial side? Plus aerial cable extenders? Plus wiring into a 12v source?

 

[DBK]

I find this all bewildering!

Does the Motorhome WiFi £299 kit (I'm happy to fit it myself) not only receive 4g LTE mobile phone signals and re-broadcast through the van as WiFi via the router but also recieve public WiFi signals and re-broadcast them via the router?

How could you spend the £299 better? A 4g LTE Teltonika RUT240 router and a 5g ready (suspect this term is a bit suspicious and not quite what it claims to be) Poynings Puck MiMo aerial may future proof the aerial side? Plus aerial cable extenders? Plus wiring into a 12v source?

None of these broadband routers capture public WiFi as far as I know. For WiFi you need a completely different type of device - a WiFi booster which can pick up a distant WiFi signal and generate a much more powerful signal inside your MH. The only exception is some mifis can capture a Wi-Fi signal and repeat it but there is no amplification and if the external WiFi signal is strong enough for the MiFi to detect it you could connect with this WiFi signal directly from your phone and cut out the MiFi.

I wouldn't buy the Puck antenna and you wouldn't need a 5g one anyway with the RUT240 as that's only 4g. The Puck, or at least the ones I've seen, have very long cables which introduce losses. The cables between the antenna and the router should be as short as possible.

 

[autorouter]

None of these broadband routers capture public WiFi as far as I know.

My Teltonika RUTX11, with the Poynting A-MIMO-2_V2-15 can be configured to pick up my house wifi on the drive at home. I've not tried it on campsite wifi but no reason to think it won't work. The aerial unit is 5 in 1, ie it contains 5 aerials: 2 Mobile, 2 Wifi and 1 GPS. Solwise also do other 5-in-1 and 4-in-1 aerials that should work, including a 4-in-1 puck. They are omni-directional. However whenever I've tried picking up campsite wifi (with other equipment) I found I needed a directional aerial, which needs to be pointed towards the campsite router aerial.

Solwise - MIMO-3-15 POYNTING 5-in-1 MIMO 2xLTE, 2xWiFi, 1xGPS - A-MIMO-3-V2-15 | Solwise Ltd

www.solwise.co.uk

 

[Jonno1103]

We have the same motorhome wifi set up as mikeandmary and have now replaced the Huawei with a Netgear M1 which easily attaches to the power pack and TS9 antenna plugs. Needed a a micro usb to C adapter and an adhesive metal plate for the magnetic mount.

 

[Lenny HB]

Poynings Puck MiMo aerial may future proof the aerial side?

I wouldn't use a Puck they have naff all gain in the 800mhz bandwidth. OK if you only camp in urban areas, rural cell masts tend to use the 800mhz band.

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[DBK]

My Teltonika RUTX11, with the Poynting A-MIMO-2_V2-15 can be configured to pick up my house wifi on the drive at home. I've not tried it on campsite wifi but no reason to think it won't work. The aerial unit is 5 in 1, ie it contains 5 aerials: 2 Mobile, 2 Wifi and 1 GPS. Solwise also do other 5-in-1 and 4-in-1 aerials that should work, including a 4-in-1 puck. They are omni-directional. However whenever I've tried picking up campsite wifi (with other equipment) I found I needed a directional aerial, which needs to be pointed towards the campsite router aerial.

Solwise - MIMO-3-15 POYNTING 5-in-1 MIMO 2xLTE, 2xWiFi, 1xGPS - A-MIMO-3-V2-15 | Solwise Ltd

www.solwise.co.uk

Thank you, I didn't know they could do that but I suspect it is the same as some MiFi can do. The WiFi signal has to be strong and they are not really a WiFi booster like a Ubiquiti Nano Station.

Ubiquiti Networks NanoStation M2 150 Mbit/s White Power over Ethernet (PoE) (LOCOM2)

Networks NanoStation M2 - 150 Mbit/s - 150 Mbit/s - 10,100 Mbit/s - 2.412-2.462 GHz - IEEE 802.3,IEEE 802.3u - 10000 m - 2.4 GHz - 10/100 Ethernet RJ-45 - 32 MB SDRAM - 8 MB Flash - 5+ km - PoE

www.senetic.co.uk

Edit: I've just had a scan of the manual and I'm fairly sure it has no "boost" capability. In other words it can pick up a WiFi signal but no better than any other device you might have - with the provisio it will be able to it better because the antenna is on the roof - but they are not a WiFi booster.

 

[dpsuk999]

My Teltonika RUTX11, with the Poynting A-MIMO-2_V2-15 can be configured to pick up my house wifi on the drive at home. I've not tried it on campsite wifi but no reason to think it won't work. The aerial unit is 5 in 1, ie it contains 5 aerials: 2 Mobile, 2 Wifi and 1 GPS. Solwise also do other 5-in-1 and 4-in-1 aerials that should work, including a 4-in-1 puck. They are omni-directional. However whenever I've tried picking up campsite wifi (with other equipment) I found I needed a directional aerial, which needs to be pointed towards the campsite router aerial.

Solwise - MIMO-3-15 POYNTING 5-in-1 MIMO 2xLTE, 2xWiFi, 1xGPS - A-MIMO-3-V2-15 | Solwise Ltd

www.solwise.co.uk

My RUT955 along with the above aerial scans all available external WiFi signals from afar and pulls them into my motorhome so if you are on a campsite you can use their WiFi and set the router to for example balance the bandwidth between your sim and WiFi so you only use some of your data along with the campsite data

 

[kevenh]

It sounds like we’ve some WiFi repeaters confused with WiFi boosters.

A simple Huawei Mifi like a 5577C can repeat a campsite’s wifi but not via it’s external antenna source. Just it’s built in receiver.
So that simplifies a one to many device setup but won’t boost poor reception.

 

[Jonno1103]

It sounds like we’ve some WiFi repeaters confused with WiFi boosters.

A simple Huawei Mifi like a 5577C can repeat a campsite’s wifi but not via it’s external antenna source. Just it’s built in receiver.
So that simplifies a one to many device setup but won’t boost poor reception.

I think there's also some confusion between WiFi and LTE too. This should answer some questions.

LTE vs. Wi-Fi: Choosing the Right Connection for Your Business | Blog | WilsonPro

<p>While both LTE and Wi-Fi keep you connected, each serves distinctly different purposes in today’s wireless ecosystem. Understanding their differences is crucial for making informed connectivity decisions for your business. Let’s explore how these technologies work, their unique advantages...

www.wilsonpro.com

 

[Neilfg]

We have been using a Huawei 5577c mifi for a few years, we have a good external aerial which we use rarely as the mifi does a good enough job of connecting to mobile most of the time. Also the battery means we can if needed (not often) take it out of the van with us when we go away.

We have tried some others NetgearAircards/TPLink but not impressed by interface or performance in comparison to the 5577. Teltonika and the new Netgear look very good but at the moment the Huawei does a good job 99% of the time so having difficulty justifying a change.

We always use the mifi to connect to external WiFi hotspots at home or on site when the WiFi is available and fast enough. We could connect devices directly to the external WiFi but would have to do this for each device in the van (Firestick, Android TV, kindles, tablets, sat nav, phones, cameras, Nas box, laptop) if we connect the mifi then all other devices just work, really simple .

For connecting to a distant WiFi or a weak signal we do have a directional aerial and an Alfa Router, but am thinking about removing this as 4g is becoming so widespread we never use it and seem to always use the Huawei 5577 mifi.

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[autorouter]

It sounds like we’ve some WiFi repeaters confused with WiFi boosters.

Wifi equipment is limited by regulations to a maximum output power. Range and bandwidth can be increased by a better aerial. Omnidirectional aerials are inherently not as good as directional aerials, which can concentrate all the power into a narrow beam instead of spreading it out in all directions. The Ubiquiti gear has a very good directional aerial. That Poynting 5-in-1 aerial in my link is about as good as an omni aerial gets.

 

[New Street]

We're using a new Netgear which just seems to require 12v power and absolutely no leads and no antenna. Silly price mind but no install stress.

 

[Hagstrom]

"How could you spend the £299 better?"

Anyone?

 

[New Street]

Sometimes I struggle with understanding the question...

 

[Hagstrom]

For the question read the thread above at #46.

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