Rally Chat Fuel Cell (Efoy)

[Rob Su]

Hi, has anyone tried an Efoy fuel cell?

 

[funflair]

We have one and it does what it says on the tin.

Martin

 

[daveandsan]

Hi, has anyone tried an Efoy fuel cell?

Hi Rob, you have posted this in the wrong section really, I don’t know if @Jim can move it to the Tech/Mech section.
With regards to your question I’m sure Martin @funflair can answer it.

 

[Lenny HB]

Rally Chat?

 

[daveandsan]

Martin, I was to slow.

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[Rob Su]

We have one and it does what it says on the tin.

Martin

Fab, thx Martin - other than the cost (£2k?) is there a downside? Seems to just top up electricity endlessly, is it like being in electric hook-up all the time?

Is it easy to instal/attach? (Imagine a guy who finds wiring a plug a little tricky - not that we need to any more )

 

[Rob Su]

Rally Chat?

Soz, I’m not only new to MoHos, but also forums

 

[Theonlysue]

The fluid costs, but I'm not sure hiw much, and how long it lasts
@Sundowners had one i think.
Good alternative to lithium batteries??

 

[funflair]

Fab, thx Martin - other than the cost (£2k?) is there a downside? Seems to just top up electricity endlessly, is it like being in electric hook-up all the time?

Is it easy to instal/attach? (Imagine a guy who finds wiring a plug a little tricky - not that we need to any more )

Price £2k++ I think depending on model, the EFOY has a good control module so no it doesn't run all the time as you set set it into various control modes "on" "off" and "automatic" I use the automatic setting as then you can customise other parameter like the voltage it comes on at, the time it sits at that voltage to avoid false starts from voltage troughs from the inverter, the switch off voltage or amps drawn. Yes they are expensive to buy and expensive to run for me I wanted something that would ensure that the batteries were always fully charged when the van was in storage under cover and the solar was not working, it does exactly that but I very rarely use it in the field as we have a decent solar bank and that is much cheaper to run.

Fitting is easy but don't do what I did and put it in the garage but under the head end of the bed as although they are "silent" there is actually a slight hum from the fuel pump or so she tells me

Martin

 

[funflair]

The fluid costs, but I'm not sure hiw much, and how long it lasts
@Sundowners had one i think.
Good alternative to lithium batteries??

Hi Sue

The fluid is about £5 a litre if you buy the 2x10 litre box but delivery is expensive for hazardous goods so you are best buying 2 boxes, 0.9l will give you 1kwh which would roughly bring 2x100ah batteries from 50% charge back to full, so if you run your batteries down it will cost you £5 to bring them back up, with electric on Spanish sites being up to €0.5 per kWh this makes EFOY power over 10 times site hook up cost I said it wasn't cheap.

Martin

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[Littlewheels]

Martin explains it very well,however,it’s not all about cost you have to measure other benefits that might fit your criteria, most MHomers that have Efoy spend a large amount of time using the MH and often off grid.
It’s mainly about piece of mind and having the availability of 240v to live the MH life with all that 240v items bring Coffee Machine etc etc you don’t need to compromise to me this has a value.
We have 380w Solar, 200amh Lithium, Victonic MPPT and Efoy , therefore, we can pretty much never worry about run down Batteries.

 

[Sundowners]

This is just our opinion----- but --------- it is great if , like Martin the van is stored away from the sun, it will keep batteries topped-up------- but for the cost solar is FAR better, efoy is a slow charge and if you are used to using a fair amount of power it will run for a long time to keep up, it also means you need to carry another fuel type------- we ALWAYS carry our little Honda Genny and as we are nearly always away from other vans when we need extra power that is what we use------ the efoy was in the van when we bought it so it didn't actually cost us anything, we used it so little that eventually we took it out and sold it-------- but you must remember that we have almost 500w of solar and same battery plus 3kva inverter so we are used to using a lot of power -------- they do have their place but charge at too low a rate for our power consumption!!!!

 

[hilldweller]

0.9l will give you 1kwh
Martin

Anyone who wants to live off grid with one had better make sure their supply lines are good, as well as having deep pockets.

I wonder what the legalities are, for a big trip you would have to safely store a huge volume of dangerous liquid.

 

[Wissel]

The fluid is about £5 a litre if you buy the 2x10 litre box but delivery is expensive for hazardous goods so you are best buying 2 boxes, 0.9l will give you 1kwh

Ouch

I did have in the back of my mind fitting an Efoy.

I have 400Ah of LiFePO4 and use about 1.2kWh per day. So on top of the £5,500(ish) price tag for the one recommended for my setup, it COULD cost a further £160 per month if no solar

I'm sure in reality it wouldn't be anywhere near this high, but as I was only thinking about an Efoy as a kind of insurance policy (3 days with no solar + ill so can't drive = sods law), it seems a little OTT for me

With 750w of solar that will likely be able to angle for winter months (working on the design for this at the moment) and a true 60A per hour whilst driving (have to love LiFePO4 charging efficiency), I think a small silent (lol) generator will do as my insurance

(not knocking anyone else's choice - we all have different needs - just thinking aloud about our own setup)

 

[Littlewheels]

What Sundowners has fits his Criteria and I respect his choice,however, for me the Efoy runs through the night and whilst your actually using power as a Generator can do but on say a French Aire and the rules don’t allow it , I wouldn’t carry Petrol and I believe Ethanol is stable and there are no fumes. Additionally, if you “Wild “ and need to move pronto if an event occurred you don’t need to retrieve anything you simply start up an drive off.

It’s horses for courses and that’s why this forum is so good, opinions matter.

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[funflair]

Ouch

I did have in the back of my mind fitting an Efoy.

I have 400Ah of LiFePO4 and use about 1.2kWh per day. So on top of the £5,500(ish) price tag for the one recommended for my setup, it COULD cost a further £160 per month if no solar

I'm sure in reality it wouldn't be anywhere near this high, but as I was only thinking about an Efoy as a kind of insurance policy (3 days with no solar + ill so can't drive = sods law), it seems a little OTT for me

With 750w of solar that will likely be able to angle for winter months (working on the design for this at the moment) and a true 60A per hour whilst driving (have to love LiFePO4 charging efficiency), I think a small silent (lol) generator will do as my insurance

(not knocking anyone else's choice - we all have different needs - just thinking aloud about our own setup)

I have just bought 40 litres of fuel so about £200 ish but it will last at least 3 years as it is not used that much, you mentioned "insurance policy" that is exactly what it is for us, what works for one person does not work for all but as long as we go into it with our eyes open it is OK.

Martin

 

[Sundowners]

Because on most Aires you can only stay two days you will charge travelling between them, this means that you don't actually need to charge via Genny while on one, especially if there is some light for the solar set-up.
The same applies while wild camping ---- unless you stay a long time in one place in very bad light conditions!!!!!
Until this last couple of weeks when our motorhome is stored in UK and we are in our caravan in Portugal the Genny was mainly run just to keep it servicable-------- how we miss all that usable power of the van!!!!!!!!
We now have to run the Genny to run the washing machine!!!!!! And with a little solar panel have to be careful with power---- no electric toaster or kettle etc until we get things sorted!!!!!!

Tilting the solar panels makes a huge difference to their efficiency especially during winter months when the days are short and the sun is low!!!!!

 

[Robert Clark]

We’ve thought about an Efoy a couple of times, but have been able to balance batteries, solar and consumption so far.
We did swap 6x lead acid batteries for 2 LifePO4 to save weight and this has worked really well. So we’ll in fact that on this trip to Spain we’re using an electric kettle to conserve gas. The lithium batteries charge so quickly and I think are the perfect pairing with solar panels.
Not sure I’d invest in Efoy until I’d seen that our current set up couldn’t cope with our consumption

 

[Sundowners]

Ouch

I did have in the back of my mind fitting an Efoy.

I have 400Ah of LiFePO4 and use about 1.2kWh per day. So on top of the £5,500(ish) price tag for the one recommended for my setup, it COULD cost a further £160 per month if no solar

I'm sure in reality it wouldn't be anywhere near this high, but as I was only thinking about an Efoy as a kind of insurance policy (3 days with no solar + ill so can't drive = sods law), it seems a little OTT for me

With 750w of solar that will likely be able to angle for winter months (working on the design for this at the moment) and a true 60A per hour whilst driving (have to love LiFePO4 charging efficiency), I think a small silent (lol) generator will do as my insurance

(not knocking anyone else's choice - we all have different needs - just thinking aloud about our own setup)

IMHO .a small 'silent' Genny is far more versatile than efoy and takes up similar space------- it can produce 240v and 12 volt --- could run all day on one fill of fuel if necessary-------- we have used ours several times to get us out of trouble------- it is our insurance that is why we never travel without it-------- even with our caravan!!!!!!!!!

 

[Sundowners]

Duplicate post

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[funflair]

IMHO .a small 'silent' Genny is far more versatile than efoy and takes up similar space------- it can produce 240v and 12 volt --- could run all day on one fill of fuel if necessary-------- we have used ours several times to get us out of trouble------- it is our insurance that is why we never travel without it-------- even with our caravan!!!!!!!!!

Horses for courses you see our Efoy is just to sit on Auto in the shed and keep everything tickedy boo not for mainstream power, for that you are right a genny fits the bill.

Martin

 

[Littlewheels]

In reference to Aires there is a misconception that stays are 1/3 days there are many that allow longer, on a long trip we might stay a week on the odd one but have stayed for 3 month on one in the South of France without upsetting the Marie.

Sorry for going off topic but since it’s a Rally thread about Efoy I thought I’d follow the trend

 

[TheDogMan]

I have an efoy, fitted it in my previous van refitted it in my present van, they are good and suppliment the solar panel's, if you can afford it I would recomend it, BUT having just installed lithium at the moment It won't let me start it as the lithium battery is showing too much power in it, Over easter I am going to see if that continues. It will be a good test as when they built mine both the TV's, Sat Box and 7 or 8 mains sockets work off the Victron inverter.

 

[Pausim]

I have an efoy, fitted it in my previous van refitted it in my present van, they are good and suppliment the solar panel's, if you can afford it I would recomend it, BUT having just installed lithium at the moment It won't let me start it as the lithium battery is showing too much power in it, Over easter I am going to see if that continues. It will be a good test as when they built mine both the TV's, Sat Box and 7 or 8 mains sockets work off the Victron inverter.

The latest Efoys have lithium settings too. Can you update the software to overcome your problem?

 

[funflair]

I have an efoy, fitted it in my previous van refitted it in my present van, they are good and suppliment the solar panel's, if you can afford it I would recomend it, BUT having just installed lithium at the moment It won't let me start it as the lithium battery is showing too much power in it, Over easter I am going to see if that continues. It will be a good test as when they built mine both the TV's, Sat Box and 7 or 8 mains sockets work off the Victron inverter.

I am surprised that you can’t turn it on manually, but I can understand it not working in “auto” as it senses voltage to turn on and off and your lithium’s will sit at a steady voltage.

I believe you can update the software by getting a dongle thingy from EFOY but don’t know if it gives lithium compatibility to older machines.

Martin

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[JJ]

I have lived all this century (and much longer) off-grid in a van.

I have a small genny which I operate occasionally for my oven (and air fyer and toasted sandwich maker) but otherwise I just use solar power.

The Apollo Moon Landing Project used fuel cells as a power source... now I believe most space craft mostly feature solar for the job.

Of course I did think it would be cool to have a fuel cell on board... great to display to other van folk one comes across in life... but, in the end, common sense won out!


JJ

 

[Reallyretired]

You used to, and maybe still can get a small automatic generator that runs on lpg, thus no extra fuel to carry. About half the price of efoy, but not as silent.

 

[Rob Su]

I have an efoy, fitted it in my previous van refitted it in my present van, they are good and suppliment the solar panel's, if you can afford it I would recomend it, BUT having just installed lithium at the moment It won't let me start it as the lithium battery is showing too much power in it, Over easter I am going to see if that continues. It will be a good test as when they built mine both the TV's, Sat Box and 7 or 8 mains sockets work off the Victron inverter.

I thought they were as effective as mains? Solar only tops up battery, but won’t give you mains style power, or am I wrong in that?

 

[Reallyretired]

I thought they were as effective as mains? Solar only tops up battery, but won’t give you mains style power, or am I wrong in that?

Yes, you are wrong Both fuel cell and solar are for battery charging Mains can come from an inverter running from the batteries.

 

[Rob Su]

So - and apologies for labouring the point - some electrical items only run when I gave electric hook-up.

I used to have 100w solar panel on caravan, but don’t think solar gives enough oomph (sorry, I’m completely ignorant of electricity, despite coming from Clerk Maxwell country).

From what I’ve read of Efoy, the power you get is as good as electric hook-up (so better, albeit more expensive) than solar. Any thoughts?

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[Littlewheels]

I thought they were as effective as mains? Solar only tops up battery, but won’t give you mains style power, or am I wrong in that?

The whole concept of both Solar and Efoy is to keep your Leisure Batteries topped up,so when you are not driving or on EHU you can still enjoy the benefit of 240v via your Inverter.

The additional benefit is that when stationary for a few days and the Sun is hiding away the Efoy kicks in and assists the charging process silently and 24hours day and night,therefore,after poor weather late evening when they are being used heavily the Efoy working all evening and throughout the night is of great benefit.

It’s not all about cost it’s about the benefit the cost brings. It works for me and a number of other Funsters that have spoken up but as with everything it’s not for everyone.