France and Spain - plans and budget

[Andacami]

Hi,

We are planning a trip to France and Northern Spain starting in early September 2023. We are thinking that ten weeks should do it; it will be our first time in Europe in the Moho. Bar seeing relatives nr Santander, we have no defined places to go as yet but will be taking previous advice and will continue to research on these forums as to where to go along the way; we will take our time, we will be in no rush.

I think we will start by taking the Portsmouth - Saint Malo overnight ferry and will try to avoid too many toll roads. Probably hug the coast on the way down with options on heading inland to any places we really should not miss; get around Spain a bit after meeting up with relatives nr Santander and then head inland and east on the way back home via Brugge/Ghent perhaps for some early Christmassy things.

What would be helpful for me to understand from the more experienced on here is:

• As described above, is ten weeks enough. We will of course be back at some stage to do the things we will inevitably miss, but will ten weeks be enough for a leisurely pace for a first-time tour?
• Budget-wise, and parking the £600.00 odd for the ferry/tunnel, is £50.00 per day enough to cover everything inc the odd site, dinner out, tolls, food, and fuel?
• Does anyone perhaps have a ready-made budgeting spreadsheet/itinerary they are willing to share?

So far, I've found this helpful: https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/foru...outhwest-france-spain-with-minimal-tolls.284/ and a few posts have mentioned around £50 a day to be very much enough for the sort of thing we are intending to do, although we do like our comforts and feel we deserve a little bit of the nicer things on this trip

 

[Guigsy]

In 2019, we did a long European tour. We moved pretty much every day. We did a loop of Spain in about 6 weeks. We camped in quite a lot of car parks in Spain (which I think it's harder now?). We ate at lots of cafes, but we didn't have many evening meals out. Didn't drink much. Saw quite a lot of touristy stuff. We were burning through about £80 per day in Spain. Lots due to fuel.

Though Germany, Italy, etc, we spent quite a bit more. Mostly because camping was more.

 

[Chuns]

Ten weeks is either nowhere near enough, or plenty!

So much will depend on how you begin to understand the way of touring away from the UK. What I would do in the first instance is to have a bit of a stab at your fuel usage. As with all budget exercises, err on the worst side, and then add 10%. I'm a simple soul, and can only work in round numbers, so let's say it is 2500 miles, and you get 25mpg. That is a hundred gallons at let's say 2€ (who knows what it will be then) a litre. Say a 100 gallons is 500 litres, and your fuel bill will be £1000, over your ten weeks. Put that to one side and then the budgeting becomes more straightforward.

Estimate how many times a week you will eat out, say one casual every week, and a posh one three or four times in the trip. I noted your comment about "nicer things". Google a few restos along the way and look at their tariffs. You can easily frighten yourself at this stage, so modify your expectations. Once there you will tailor your dining out according to your experiences. A lot will depend on how much booze you will want to drink in the places you choose! The range of prices will be vast, and there are tricks to avoid silly prices. Go for the day's offering, or set 'menus'. And remember touristy areas in a tourist town will be very expensive. It is nice to sit on the quayside looking at the boats, but your meal will be a lot cheaper two blocks back. And possibly more enjoyable.

So let's try and put some numbers in it. Say 10 meals in informal restos at say £75 for the two of you. £750. Say 5 posher meals, for argument's sake. Let's call that £750 too. So you've got £1500, say £150 a week, roughly £20 a day!! You could easily halve that if you wanted to, or no expensive meals. Even if you got to £1000 that is still £16 a day. But you get my drift - only you know whether that is your lifestyle or not. But it puts a line in the sand.

There are quite a few Funsters who live in France, and I dare say some of them will be along to talk more knowledgeably than I about eating out, and probably everything else.

As far as tolls are concerned, they can eat a budget at a stroke. You will have to do a cost/benefit assessment at the time. If you have got to get a move on, then it will cost a lot. Do some sample routes in ViaMichelin, it will tell you the cost with or without tolls. MoHos are normally Class 2, unless you have something a lot higher than most. Once you've seen what the differences are you will be better informed. ASFA (the toll operator's association) is another good source of costs. I think a Car + Caravan might be Class 2, so use that. Just plug in an example journey and see.

Again without knowing your style, food will cost you more or less the same as it does in the UK. You will be able to drink better wine for the same, or more of the cheaper. Sitting in a cafe with a beer is nice, but you'll be a tenner or more lighter for two 25cl beers!

You mention the 'odd site'. Again it will be easy to pick a few and just see what it will cost in September. If you want sites for laundry, fine, but don't forget you can get water and get rid of waste in so many places for free, and also get electricity if you want. CampingCarPark has a network of cheaper places that are a cross between a site and an aire. No showers or restos, but secure and all services included.

So going back to your question, once you have taken out the fuel from your £50, you are looking at a £35 a day budget for stuff. That doesn't then cope with the sudden impulse to visit tourist places, museums and all the other good things. I might think about upping that a bit! Better to come home with change than having to worry, or cut things short because you have run out of budget.

I hope that helps, and that I have not introduced more questions than answers. Doing the research is easy once you get the feel of things - you can work out likely prices for most things with a bit of Googling. And of course there are very knowledgeable people here who record their touring, so worth following them.

Good luck with your planning - if you like to plan and budget your tour will be all the more rewarding, but don't let it restrict you. As they say "Follow your front wheels".

Do PM me if you think I can help further.

 

[Barti Ddu]

Excluding tunnel / ferry costs, we budget on £50 per day. We therefore transfer £350 from our usual current account to our Starling "holiday account" each week we are away.

We did 75 days last year in France, Spain and Portugal, and that was fairly realistic figure. We are currently about 3/4 of our way through a 85 day trip through France and Spain. This year we find that we sometimes transfer the £350 a bit more often. Inflation is not just a UK issue. A tankful of diesel is well over €100 if close to empty.

We like to eat and drink well, go to museums and attractions, take boat trips, hire e-bikes, kayaks, etc.. We travel quite slowly, and general avoid tolls. Haven't used any so far in the 9 weeks away this trip.

We are happy to use aires and "wild camp", (we're parked in an enormous car park tonight in Moraira in the Costa Blanca with about another 20 motorhomes of pretty much every European nationality), but we'll use campsites too if they are where we want to be.

Each country is very different though in how the costs stack up.

France is excellent for free or cheap aires that keep accomodation costs low, but is expensive for food in supermarkets, (especially fresh fruit and vegetables and meat), and is no longer good value to eat out.

Spain doesn't have the same network of aires as France, but plenty of free park-up opportunities. Food and drink both from supermarkets and markets, and eating out is considerably cheaper than in France, and excellent value. (Mercadona are probably the best supermarkets I've ever used anywhere. Amazing quality, especially fresh seafood, and not at all expensive). Eating out is also good value. Menu del Dia three course meals around the €15 mark including wine.

Portugal is not motorhome friendly in terms of park-ups (we got moved on last year by the GNR during the day, nevermind overnight), but campsites are cheap, even some very plush ones). Food and drink is cheap, but quality a bit variable.

Anyway, I've rambled on too much. In essence, £50 per day is a decent budget for a relaxed trip as long as you are happy to stay off grid a good chunk of the time.

Happy travels.