Do I need Lithium?

Blisteringblue

Blisteringblue

Joined
May 3, 2023
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Autocruise Accent
New to us Autocruise Accent 2013. I'm all booked in for Gaslow and 150w solar with split charger to bypass the Sargent EC400 and feed cab & leisure. I need to check but think the leisure is the original 75ah AGM from the factory.

We are planning a late trip to France in October but will tour and will find some hook up. Not sure what our plan is between aire and ehc site (depends if still open) so our route might be dictated by our power situation.

We aren't power mad, fridge, water & heating will all be on gas, so it's just lights, water pump and entertainment / wifi ( just a small 12v mifi).

Thinking of just seeing how it goes this time and tour accordingly before spending £800+ on a lithium leisure battery.

Am I going to be disappointed early and find I need ehc more than not. Have been looking at the 110ah eco tree lifepo, but the gaslow and solar are already making my purse strings quiver 😅 and can I just swap a 75ah agm for a 110ah Lifepo anyway?
 
A Fogstar 105ah Lithium is only £369, lots of Funsters using them without problems.
It going to the expense of fitting lithium to get the best out of them you need to fit a B2B, a solar controller with a lithium profile and if using EHU a lot a mains charger with the correct profile.
 
If you go solar I would double the solar and also get a B2B charger rated at about 50 amps then you won’t need any hookups.

If the cost is too high get a couple of Varta sealed lead acids at say 125 amps each, do the solar and get say a 25 amp B2B to charge as you drive.
 
Get a cheap shunt and take a few days trip and it'll give you a better idea how much energy you use per day.

October might not yield a lot of solar power. So a harsher test might be to disable the solar.

If you move a lot, which will give you some charge, and you're fairly economical with the electrons, you could find you're fine.

Or the battery is goosed. In which case marswell go lithium. 😁
 
Thanks for the tips, I am thinking of a fact finder to be honest and get what I need for next season, it's just a minefield. We've come from the dark side of caravanning where it was all basic batteries and hook ups.

All trips so far have been with hook up so unsure about the true health of the leisure battery. I'm having to get the van weekly from storage to charge the cab battery, it lasts 2 weeks at absolute most, already had to jump start it once after about 2 1/2 weeks so keen to avoid that again. Hence the solar split charge.

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Hearing will require battery power if it’s blown air …but I would vote for suck it and see first too. There are so many things to spend cash on at the start - less is more !
 
Blisteringblue said:
Thanks for the tips, I am thinking of a fact finder to be honest and get what I need for next season, it's just a minefield. We've come from the dark side of caravanning where it was all basic batteries and hook ups.

All trips so far have been with hook up so unsure about the true health of the leisure battery. I'm having to get the van weekly from storage to charge the cab battery, it lasts 2 weeks at absolute most, already had to jump start it once after about 2 1/2 weeks so keen to avoid that again. Hence the solar split charge.
Click to expand...
Most solar duo chargers only supply 1 amp to the starter battery and that's only once the habitation battery is full so in winter when there is very little charge from the solar your engine battery will get very little charge at all. Some can be set by the user to send a bigger portion of the available solar to the starter battery so check the controller before fitting.
 
If the starter battery is going done that quick & it's been too low to start a couple of times it need replacing.
 
Lenny HB said:
If the starter battery is going done that quick & it's been too low to start a couple of times it need replacing.
Click to expand...
from another thread ..?
 
Blisteringblue said:
New to us Autocruise Accent 2013. I'm all booked in for Gaslow and 150w solar with split charger to bypass the Sargent EC400 and feed cab & leisure. I need to check but think the leisure is the original 75ah AGM from the factory.

We are planning a late trip to France in October but will tour and will find some hook up. Not sure what our plan is between aire and ehc site (depends if still open) so our route might be dictated by our power situation.

We aren't power mad, fridge, water & heating will all be on gas, so it's just lights, water pump and entertainment / wifi ( just a small 12v mifi).

Thinking of just seeing how it goes this time and tour accordingly before spending £800+ on a lithium leisure battery.

Am I going to be disappointed early and find I need ehc more than not. Have been looking at the 110ah eco tree lifepo, but the gaslow and solar are already making my purse strings quiver 😅 and can I just swap a 75ah agm for a 110ah Lifepo anyway?
Click to expand...
Providing your leisure battery is in a reasonable condition, I'd expect you'd get 2 days power from it quite easily.... Maybe more. Moving between sites and occasional hookups should be fine for your trip. I'd minimise the use of heating though.
 
Been reading up recently on the combined renogy B2B&mppt controller. Put one of those in with the solar and see how it goes.
If the current battery proves to need replacement then you are good to go with just a change to the battery type.
I would probably put another panel on as well but you can just add another if needs be.
 
I think it is the NDS dual battery mppt controller that will be fitted. There isn't a lot of real estate on the roof which is why I'm looking at 150w panel to begin with can see what's left afterwards.
 
Lenny HB said:
If the starter battery is going done that quick & it's been too low to start a couple of times it need replacing.
Click to expand...
Yes, I'm going to do this before the solar is fitted, probably when I'm having the van serviced next month.

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Don't know how much a NDS controller is or the Renogy but expect it will be more.
But it gives you B2B as well as mppt which will keep batteries topped up and charged quicker when driving and is future proof when you need to change batteries.
And you will at some time unless you move on to another van.
 
Blisteringblue said:
New to us Autocruise Accent 2013. I'm all booked in for Gaslow and 150w solar with split charger to bypass the Sargent EC400 and feed cab & leisure. I need to check but think the leisure is the original 75ah AGM from the factory.

We are planning a late trip to France in October but will tour and will find some hook up. Not sure what our plan is between aire and ehc site (depends if still open) so our route might be dictated by our power situation.

We aren't power mad, fridge, water & heating will all be on gas, so it's just lights, water pump and entertainment / wifi ( just a small 12v mifi).

Thinking of just seeing how it goes this time and tour accordingly before spending £800+ on a lithium leisure battery.

Am I going to be disappointed early and find I need ehc more than not. Have been looking at the 110ah eco tree lifepo, but the gaslow and solar are already making my purse strings quiver 😅 and can I just swap a 75ah agm for a 110ah Lifepo anyway?
Click to expand...
Our usage of power is very similar to yours in our 2004 Burstner which has a single 100w solar panel and two habitation 85ah lead acid batteries. The batteries are over 8 years old. We also have a gaslow set up with two cylinders, 11+ 6.

In the summer we can go for months without hook up and no power issues at all the solar more than keeps up with our needs. This winter we spent three months in Morocco with no need of any hook up. The only time we hook up is for our electric bikes that’s it.

In travelling down to Morocco in January running the heating for several hours each evening was not a problem. We are going away for seven weeks to Burgundy/Carmague in September/October and I wouldn’t envisage changing our need for EHU.

An alternative view just to balance off others who advocate lithium. You might be in a better position than you think.
 
100 watts of solar and 220 ah of non lithium was just (and I mean just) enough to be able to charge our 2 e bikes every night with no telly, going away September to South of France. We had to refill ebikes every night
We now have lithium and shed loads of electricity.
Our other electric usage is similar to yours
If you arent big users it is quite a cost to justify (IMV)
 
Blisteringblue - welcome. May sound a stupid question but are you sure you have a 3 way fridge? I ask because I have an Autocruise Alto (same age as yours) and it is a compressor fridge! I have 2 x 100 amp lead acid batteries and 2 x 100 wt solar panels.
All the answers above are assuming your fridge can run on gas.

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I‘d look at either fitting more solar or making sure that what‘s fitted now leaves room for more in the future (have just removed a 160w panel because it was fitted across the middle of our roof and fitted 4x 130w). I’d also add more battery as 75ah isn’t much (useable half that on AGM) depending on your weight and space. Good luck. Lots of knowledge on here.

Gordo
 
Remember that should you go abroad and then find out your battery is shot and you want a non lithium replacement(s) then Naurauto are pretty good for off the shelf drop ins and are pretty much in every centre commercial. Possible to find them in huge auchans as well
 
Barchetta47 said:
Our usage of power is very similar to yours in our 2004 Burstner which has a single 100w solar panel and two habitation 85ah lead acid batteries. The batteries are over 8 years old. We also have a gaslow set up with two cylinders, 11+ 6.

An alternative view just to balance off others who advocate lithium. You might be in a better position than you ththink.thanks
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Thanks appreciate that, I do think 2 1/2 weeks pottering round the south of France in October will let us see exactly what we have.
Cal54 said:
welcome. May sound a stupid question but are you sure you have a 3 way fridge? I ask because I have an Autocruise Alto (same age as yours) and it is a compressor fridge! I have 2 x 100 amp lead acid batteries and 2 x 100 wt solar panels.
All the answers above are assuming your fridge can run on gas.
Click to expand...
Absolutely tested all the gas items worked in our hand over with the dealer. I do have the 2013 brochure so just looked too

Dometic 80litre 230v/12v/gas fridge for Rhythm,​
Rhythm Compact, Accent, Forte and Carrera 4​
​
Waeco 72litre 230v/12v/ compressor fridge/freezer on​
Alto and Jazz​
 
We've only got the original wet lead acid 72aH battery and 100w of solar, together with a pretty basic and weedy Sargent split charger in our van.

Our usage is similar to yours. Lights, water pump, mifi, charging phones, tablet and laptop. Blown air heating on cold nights.

We've spent the last 2 autumns (September to early December) with three months away in France, Spain and Portugal. We use aires or wild camp, with only very occasional use of campsites. Probably only on hook up 10 nights over the whole three months away. System coped fine for our needs. Lights never went dim, water always pumped, heating fan whirred away, internet available, and phones were charged. (Using blown air heating puts the most strain on the system but we only use it for a few hours in the evening if its particularly cold).

We're off soon for another 3 months away - back early November - this time to Croatia via Germany, Austria and Slovenia. I've no concerns that our set up will do all that we need again.

If you're not watching telly 5 hours a day, and not trying to use hair driers, coffee machines, or charge eBikes, I think yours will be fine too. (y)
 
berni109 said:
Been reading up recently on the combined renogy B2B&mppt controller. Put one of those in with the solar and see how it goes.
Click to expand...
Anyone fitting one of them needs to be aware that when they detect any solar input the B2B output drops by 50%.
You need to fit a switch or even better a relay controlled by the D+ to disconnect the solar input when the engine is running.

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Last edited:
Blisteringblue said:
I think it is the NDS dual battery mppt controller that will be fitted. There isn't a lot of real estate on the roof which is why I'm looking at 150w panel to begin with can see what's left afterwards.
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Make a cardboard temp plates, you can then shuffle them about infinitum till a solution is found.
Or, buy a cheaper folding one, and lay it out in the windscreen area, dedicated to the starter battery , which is located under the passengers foot area, a bit more faff though.
Mike.
 
If you aren't going to be off grid for long periods I'd say the current set up (with your quite frugal electric usage) would be ok. (providing your battery is in good nick) If you are travelling a bit the alternator will do some recharging on the move and stopping on EHU will also top you up.

Personally I think Lithium is over the top for situations like yours. If you were full time off grid and higher electric users (compressor fridge, electric bike, electric cooking) then maybe. possibly you could add another 75ah battery? A simple and cheap upgrade.

re your starter battery - does the solar not charge it? If not it might be worth fitting one of these that will trickle charge your starter off the leisure - which in turn is being topped up by the solar.

[Broken Link Removed]
 
Lenny HB said:
Anyone fitting one of them needs to be aware that when they detect any solar input the B2B output drops by 50%.
You need to fit a switch or even better a relay controlled by the D+ to disconnect the solar input when the engine is running.
Click to expand...
Thanks Lenny, it's Rhino that are installing, hence it's not until Sept they are busy busy busy.
 
Barti Ddu said:
If you're not watching telly 5 hours a day, and not trying to use hair driers, coffee machines, or charge eBikes, I think yours will be fine too. (y)
Click to expand...

Great to know Barti, I am more confident now reading through a lot of the the replies. I've also just bought the Anker 535 PowerHouse 512Wh Portable Power Station on the Costco deal, so have that for a lot of the phones and tablets too, and a few smaller plug in items as it comes with 2 x 3-pin sockets.
 

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