Dedicated Van for Motorhome

[Mixyblob]

Currently sat in an aire looking at all the different coachbuilt motorhomes and I would say that 90% of them have a Sevel made base vehicle.
All of them have a cab which is substantially narrower than the body.
Can anyone explain why no vehicle manufacturer appears to makes a base vehicle the same width as the most popular coachbuilt bodies.
Surely motorhome converters would jump at the chance to produce a more aesthetically pleasing motorhome based on such a vehicle.
Of course there are A class motorhomes but I know absolutely bot all about them and even less about what lurks under their brick shaped exterior. Apologies to all A class owners, no offence meant.

 

[Lenny HB]

I think you summed it up - buy an A Class. So much easier to drive.

 

[Pausim]

The cab is designed for the much more widely used vans, I doubt it is worth their while to design a wider cab just for coach built motorhomes. I guess they cater for that market by supplying the cab less version used for A class construction. With an A class you get a fully integrated body, with a wider chassis cab you would still only get a semi integrated body with joins between the separate bits. As already said buy an A class.

 

[EuroTrotters]

I think you summed it up - buy an A Class. So much easier to drive.

prefer a real cab myself Lenny

 

[Pausim]

prefer a real cab myself Lenny

Any particular reasons?

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[VXman]

I think you summed it up - buy an A Class. So much easier to drive.

Why easier? The mechanics of the vehicle is no different, it's just a bespoke made body to replace the oem cab.

I would have thought an A class was harder to drive in terms of visibility. You are miles away from the windscreen and front of the vehicle (always thought those metre depth dashes are a waste of space)

 

[Pausim]

I would have thought an A class was harder to drive in terms of visibility. You are miles away from the windscreen and front of the vehicle (always thought those metre depth dashes are a waste of space)

Quite the opposite, great visibility and the dash board ends only a few centimetres short of the front of the vehicle. No bonnet sticking out beyond the windscreen. Width is also much easier to judge, you are not sitting in a deceptively narrow bit. I have had van conversions, coach built and A class motorhomes and the only type I would not go back to is coach built.

 

[Pausim]

I would have thought an A class was harder to drive in terms of visibility. You are miles away from the windscreen and front of the vehicle (always thought those metre depth dashes are a waste of space)

Quite the opposite, great visibility and the dash board ends only a few centimetres short of the front of the vehicle. No bonnet sticking out beyond the windscreen. Width is also much easier to judge, you are not sitting in a deceptively narrow bit. I have had van conversions, coach built and A class motorhomes and the only type I would not go back to is coach built.

Edit. No idea why this has popped up twice.

 

[Lenny HB]

Why easier? The mechanics of the vehicle is no different, it's just a bespoke made body to replace the oem cab.

I would have thought an A class was harder to drive in terms of visibility. You are miles away from the windscreen and front of the vehicle (always thought those metre depth dashes are a waste of space)

Much easier to drive, nice flat sides easier to get through narrow gaps better viability with a nice large windscreen and you get a nice view of the countryside.
Also flat sides make it easier to reverse into tight spaces.

The driving position is the same as in a coach built steering wheel is exactly the same distance to the front of the vehicle same with the seats same distance from the side of the van. And let's not forget more useable space inside.

When I get in a CB or PVC my first impression is how can anyone drive in such a cramped cab with the windscreen so close.

On our 2nd A Class after the first one decided we didn't want any other type of van and have a 3rd one on order.

 

[VXman]

When I get in a CB or PVC my first impression is how can anyone drive in such a cramped cab with the windscreen so close.

Don't quite understand the flat sides thing as it is flat from just behind my shoulder and if the wing mirrors fit then the rest will. Mirrors give a full view of everything anyway.

Regarding size/feeling of space. Well like anything it's what you get used to. My VX220 feels like sitting in a matchbox after the motorhome. My wife's Megane feels enormous after getting out of my VX220. Not surprising a Ducato feels small in comparison if you are used to the space in the A class but cramped it certainly isn't. When I see people in a Ducato PVC I cannot imagine how they manage. Then I see people in a VW camper and it puts it all into perspective.

Anyway, it's a bit of a pointless argument as we all like what we have and we will buy what suits us for a number of reaosn at the time. Someone in a Morello Palace would problably your Hymer feels cramped!

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[dunnah01]

How do A class pilots judge when to stop when driving on to levelling ramps? It's hard enough when you can see the wheels.
Oh hang on they can all afford hydraulic levellers

 

[68c]

Having an A class Pilote I do miss the ability to hang out of the window while driving onto ramps. Also the more distant screen causes me problems. With a close windscreen I find it easier to focus beyond the screen. Unless the screen is clean and dry I find I have to force myself to focus beyond it at very slow speeds while manouvering. First noticed thus when driving a company 1980's Renault Espace. Luckily my prettier half does most of the driving now.

 

[Shrimp]

Not all of us can afford hydraulic levellers, i put the ramps down and provide the info, Manic does the manoeuvring!
we wouldn’t go back to a coachbuilt, love the open airy space the A class gives.

 

[TheAleMan]

Love the room of an A class, but I do miss having cab doors, it’s just the hab door that we have.

 

[Mixyblob]

Sorry folks, this appears to have turned into an argument/discussion about the merits of A classes and little dicussion about my original post. Just saying

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Westbarn1]

Personal decision of course, my first was a sprinter based coach built, but the layout wasn't to the Mrs liking, so we went bigger, to an A class, but that wasn't to my liking, I preferred driving the coach built, preferred having a crash tested metal body in front of me, a full size bonnet to give access to the mechanical bits, 2 metal front doors with electric windows and a windscreen that if it needed replacement, was readily available, so I have changed back to a coach built, all 3 Hymer Sprinter based. Only thing I have noticed that was easier on the A class, is turning the front seats around.
Fair point made by the original poster, light commercials are produced in 100's of thousands, there is not a big enough market to produce one specifically for the motorhome industry.

 

[MichaelT]

I would have thought an A class was harder to drive in terms of visibility. You are miles away from the windscreen and front of the vehicle (always thought those metre depth dashes are a waste of space)

But its the same length as a normal van or didn't you realise that

 

[VXman]

But its the same length as a normal van or didn't you realise that

Not sure I understand your point (or was it a joke I don't get?)

A classes come in all shapes and sizes. Normal vans (what's a normal van?) come in all shapes and sizes. I was referring to the positioning of the driver in relation to the cab sides and front in an A class. I.e. further back from the front end of the vehicle and further in from the sides.

 

[VXman]

.......preferred having a crash tested metal body in front of me

Interesting point. How do they get away without crash testing?. I suppose because it is built on a crash tested chasis? Does that mean though, that the protection is the same? Is the protection from crash bars and structures underneath the body rather than the body its self? I'm surprised that changing a vehicle in such an extreme manner doesn't require proper crash testing.

Anywayz you make some good points.

 

[VXman]

Sorry folks, this appears to have turned into an argument/discussion about the merits of A classes and little dicussion about my original post. Just saying

It's what makes forum discussions interesting!

Anyway, simple answer to the original question is that it's not worth the manufacturers time/cost. Not big enough market to make money.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Lenny HB]

. I was referring to the positioning of the driver in relation to the cab sides and front in an A class. I.e. further back from the front end of the vehicle and further in from the sides.

No its not seating position relative to front and sides is exactly the same.

 

[Lenny HB]

preferred having a crash tested metal body in front of me

A lot of A Class's are crash tested there is a video of crash testing that's been posted on here previously the A Class came out better than the CB.

 

[wolfie2]

A lot of A Class's are crash tested there is a video of crash testing that's been posted on here previously the A Class came out better than the CB.

Do you have any links please Lenny HB

 

[Pausim]

Not sure I understand your point (or was it a joke I don't get?)

A classes come in all shapes and sizes. Normal vans (what's a normal van?) come in all shapes and sizes. I was referring to the positioning of the driver in relation to the cab sides and front in an A class. I.e. further back from the front end of the vehicle and further in from the sides.

You are not further back from the front end and you are not further in from the widest part of the vehicle in an A class. The cab area extends further forward eliminating the bonnet that slopes out of sight to the front bumper and the cab area is wider eliminating the need for the vehicle to widen behind the drivers seat. This makes driving the A class far more intuitive, you are sitting looking at the true corners of the vehicle not false ones. It also makes the driving position far more pleasant. The relationship between the drivers seat, the steering wheel, pedals, engine and wheels is exactly the same as a coach built.

It also eliminates the often mentioned Fiat scuttle problems where windscreen water runs onto the engine. The screen and wipers are safely in front of the engine.

 

[VXman]

You are not further back from the front end and you are not further in from the widest part of the vehicle in an A class. The cab area extends further forward eliminating the bonnet that slopes out of sight to the front bumper and the cab area is wider eliminating the need for the vehicle to widen behind the drivers seat. This makes driving the A class far more intuitive, you are sitting looking at the true corners of the vehicle not false ones. It also makes the driving position far more pleasant. The relationship between the drivers seat, the steering wheel, pedals, engine and wheels is exactly the same as a coach built.

It also eliminates the often mentioned Fiat scuttle problems where windscreen water runs onto the engine. The screen and wipers are safely in front of the engine.

As the 'cab' area of the vehicle is wider than a fiat cab then unless the drivers seat is relocated to the right the you will naturally be further in from the side of the vehicle (at the cab point). Maybe different A class models/manufacturers are different. Some I have seen definition look like the driver/passenger are sitting in the middle of a space with lots of room between them and the side windows. Can you drive with your arm out the window on A class? (Not that I do that but just as a test)

As regards distance from the front then I need access to an A class and a measuring stick to clarify that point, but it always appears to me that there is a lot of 'nothing' between the driver and the bottom front of the windscreen.

By the way, I'm not anti A class. I think some look awful but I also like some. Sadly the ones I like are beyond what I consider reasonable to pay for a motorhome.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[VXman]

No its not seating position relative to front and sides is exactly the same.

I need access to an A class and a measuring stick to be convinced by that. Probably not all A classes are the same anyway.

 

[Lenny HB]

I need access to an A class and a measuring stick to be convinced by that. Probably not all A classes are the same anyway.

Been there done that with my measuring stick.
On normal A Class vans the seat bases are in the same position on the chassis as a standard Ducato or Sprinter.
On large vans like Morelo & Concorde the chassis is re-engineered and the seats are moved further forward & higher so you are actually nearer the front of the vehicle.

 

[Guigsy]

The only bit of metal a standard Ducato cab has that an a-class doesn't in a frontal crash is the bonnet. Everything else up front is plastic or the same but hidden under the fibreglass. So I'm not convinced there's much difference in frontal collisions.

Side impacts might be different, the doors are anchored to a metal frame with a van cab. But then side impacts in vans tend to rarer and cars hit low where the identical floor structure probably counts more than anything. And an a-class side has much more room to give before it squishes you.

Rear-ends are less risky anyway. I wonder if an a-class shell is less likely to be shunted off the frame than a semi-integrated model?

Regardless, I'd much prefer to be in a PVC in a crash than a coachbuild.

 

[Simon Select]

Currently sat in an aire looking at all the different coachbuilt motorhomes and I would say that 90% of them have a Sevel made base vehicle.
All of them have a cab which is substantially narrower than the body.
Can anyone explain why no vehicle manufacturer appears to makes a base vehicle the same width as the most popular coachbuilt bodies.
Surely motorhome converters would jump at the chance to produce a more aesthetically pleasing motorhome based on such a vehicle.
Of course there are A class motorhomes but I know absolutely bot all about them and even less about what lurks under their brick shaped exterior. Apologies to all A class owners, no offence meant.

From a manufacturers point of view, whats the point? The UK is the second biggest motorhome market in the world and even in the best ever year ever, only 12000 motorhomes were sold.
Stellantis (Peugeot, Citroen, Fiat) Who make up the lions share of the market sold 13,000,000 vehicles.
Manufactures actually view motorhome production as a pain the ass. The motorhome manufacturers want different spec's on their vehicles which means they have to stop and change the production run instead of churning out a continuous run of white standard vans.
If you designed, moulded, made a new purpose built chassis, you would go bust before it even finished, it will cost millions to develop, there wont be enough sales to develop it and sustain it.


Simon

 

[Ditcha]

The only bit of metal a standard Ducato cab has that an a-class doesn't in a frontal crash is the bonnet. Everything else up front is plastic or the same but hidden under the fibreglass. So I'm not convinced there's much difference in frontal collisions.

Side impacts might be different, the doors are anchored to a metal frame with a van cab. But then side impacts in vans tend to rarer and cars hit low where the identical floor structure probably counts more than anything. And an a-class side has much more room to give before it squishes you.

Rear-ends are less risky anyway. I wonder if an a-class shell is less likely to be shunted off the frame than a semi-integrated model?

Regardless, I'd much prefer to be in a PVC in a crash than a coachbuild.

This A class has had a bit of a frontal and side