Dealers tactics

[Robert Clark]

Whilst I really appreciate your advice it’s funny as the solicitor I spoke with said it’s a very British and middle class belief that the law will resolve problems or even be fair .
As he said the legal route will take a very predictable and probably well known route for the dealers and the longer it goes on and the more they drag their heels the more exhausted and ground down the customer becomes so normally just settles to avoid further grief .
What he did say was that companies don’t like unpredictable and unknown and that whilst direct action may be extremely stressful the dealers aren’t in control and are far more likely to want the situation resolved quickly.

But was that paid for advice from a consumer law specialist?
Maybe you lost out on a 100% refund?

 

[Speve]

Good luck with your endeavour Basildog dont get any more stressed over this hope it all works out for you.??

 

[Chris]

Whilst I really appreciate your advice it’s funny as the solicitor I spoke with said it’s a very British and middle class belief that the law will resolve problems or even be fair .
As he said the legal route will take a very predictable and probably well known route for the dealers and the longer it goes on and the more they drag their heels the more exhausted and ground down the customer becomes so normally just settles to avoid further grief .
What he did say was that companies don’t like unpredictable and unknown and that whilst direct action may be extremely stressful the dealers aren’t in control and are far more likely to want the situation resolved quickly.

Just be careful what you do. If it goes too far the dealer may well go for an injunction and damages which could prove very costly for you. And whatever you do make sure you don’t open yourself up to a blackmail allegation.

Good luck.

 

[Southdowners]

Personally I wouldn’t send the letter you’ve drafted.

You’ve engaged a solicitor now so let him/her deal with things.

If you’re going to write anything just write a very short letter stating that the matter is now in the hands of your solicitor and leave it at that.

I hope you get a quick result and you can move on.

 

[Basildog]

Personally I wouldn’t send the letter you’ve drafted.

You’ve engaged a solicitor now so let him/her deal with things.

If you’re going to write anything just write a very short letter stating that the matter is now in the hands of your solicitor and leave it at that.
I hope you get a quick result and you can move on.

The dealers have contacted me and have unbelievably intimated through their sales manager that they want me to start legal action against them !
Yes you read it correctly !
He stated that it will help their case in getting help from HYMER ( presumably financially)
I have already written back stating that they have surpassed themselves in sinking to new lows .

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[Southdowners]

I’d still leave it in the hands of your solicitor.

Tell the dealership that any further correspondence relating to the issue should be addressed direct to your solicitor.

 

[Basildog]

I’d still leave it in the hands of your solicitor.

Tell the dealership that any further correspondence relating to the issue should be addressed direct to your solicitor.

Very British but certainly not my style and I am definitely not being pushed into legal action for their benefit.

 

[Chris]

Very British but certainly not my style and I am definitely not being pushed into legal action for their benefit.

Have you approached Hymer direct?

Might be worth a go if you haven’t.

 

[Beltie]

Basil,

Given that you've now told the dealer what form of direct action you intend to take, how are they going to find it 'unpredictable and unknown' ?

Best of luck with whatever you do, but your last paragraph is a huge mistake, and one that no competent lawyer would ever advise.

 

[Bart]

Best of luck with whatever you do, but your last paragraph is a huge mistake, and one that no competent lawyer would ever advise.

So true indeed

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[Southdowners]

Very British but certainly not my style and I am definitely not being pushed into legal action for their benefit.

It’s nothing to do with being British or style it’s about getting a solution to the problem you’re experiencing with your motorhome.

Have you instructed a solicitor to act on your behalf?

 

[MR. FUSION]

Do you think they will realise that I am not a happy customer or should I be clearer ?
Dear Sirs
I cannot actually express how disappointed and let down as long standing customers we both feel by the repeated lies and false promises that we have received during the last 18 months.
As usual It took huge upsets to get to Director level yet again ! You made contact then just ignored the situation for weeks and despite receiving emails from ***** with false promises nothing was done and certainly no constructive offers to either rectify the vehicle or purchase it and yet again you have passed it down and certainly haven’t bothered monitoring your promises when you have had involvement.
Management at ********* is at best Lackadaisical and apathetic with little or no idea of customer service or following up on situations.


There have been issues with the vehicle from handover which I have documented .
I genuinely thought this nightmare was at an end when at your suggestion, not mine , you offered to purchase the vehicle back from us and stated that we should not lose out as these issues were totally unacceptable and you weren’t aware of just how many problems we have actually had, you even said that we should be compensated !
My suspicion was that your promises would amount to nothing but I was willing to give it one last attempt !
I won’t bother detailing all the problems and issues here as they will probably only be ignored or bodged up by the resident 5 year olds in your workshop anyway , I have pictures of the tape on the door catches we were sent away at Xmas with !
I have accurate records of all communication and visits to your premises for failed repairs and incorrect parts collection etc , I doubt your company has this absolute record of facts .
Now you have yet again passed the buck (which now puts the total number of different staff we have been bouncing around with to 10 ) to another staff member who has absolutely no knowledge of the situation and is actually being put in an impossible situation by yourself.
I have absolutely no faith in *********** or your ability to rectify our vehicle as I already know of another owner that is coming back for attempt number 3 on the rear panel leak !
Your offer of £72,000.00 from your sales manager was an insult and certainly didn’t contain any compensation and he also started spouting about how you didn’t want to purchase a secondhand vehicle st this time of year due to market situation and stocking levels etc .
Let me be very clear you are not purchasing this vehicle for your convenience or comfort this is about your company doing the right thing for a customer and following through on your promises for once , it is supposed to hurt your business not make you a profit .
I will only accept the full purchase price as a refund .
As previously stated the vehicle is still available for your company or representatives to come and inspect for yourselves.
I didn’t want to have to go down both the legal route and direct action but If I have to I will do both as I have been advised to reject the vehicle by 2 different independent engineers.
Despite repeated requests I never had a comprehensive list of all outstanding issues from you and you haven’t even bothered with the damage caused by your company to our vehicle at the last visit .
********* is in my opinion rotten from the top down .

Just so you are under no illusions if you force me to pull the trigger on direct action it won’t then be about just getting our problems resolved with *********** and Hymer but will be about inflicting as much damage to both your businesses and reputation as is possible.
I will be having the vehicle professionally sign written up and it will be taken on a 3 month tour ( cancelled our European trip thanks to ************ ) of every Hymer dealership and the NEC show .
I will post and contact as many organisations as possible including but not limited to :
Facebook
Motorhome forums
Local news
National news
NCC
BBC watchdog
Leisure industry publications
Hymer factory visit with sign written vehicle

Regards

The NEC & Hymer dealerships can refuse you entry if they deem your sign to be unreasonable. If you do the social media thing, every word must be accurate and truthful.

 

[JaneyBMotorhomer In Hants]

It’s not worth ruining your health for. The idiots you are dealing with are just that. We had a Pilote with an electric bed. The service manager with his sumersilious grin and “ was it completely flat sir “ really got up my nose. When it jammed in a car park he suggested that I might ask the Campsite Warden to have a look at it. Gave up with it not worth the hassle just took the hit and traded it in with the bed jammed.

We had problems with an Adria electric bed. Motorhome bought from new. It was In and out of the dealers and then elsewhere several timesand it was never really right so we took the hit and traded it in for an Auto Trail. I have nothing good to say about Adria Customere (dis)Services either. I know there are those on this site who constantly gripe about Auto Trails but ours is fabulous and the quality is much, much better than Autotrail. The dealer is very good too.

 

[icantremember]

JaneyBMotorhomer In Hants ... I think you may want to edit the last couple of lines of your post.

 

[JJ]

At the risk of seeming like a happy clappy groupie, if I were in a situation like yours, I would hire Chris.

I bet on seeing Chris's firm's headed note paper appear on his desk, the dealer would simply fold and accede to all your requests.

JJ

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[gwyntaxi]

You bugger, my money was on Low**am's.

Mine is on Trave*****d, due to to the treatment I received from them.

 

[PeteH]

Some years ago, I had a gearbox failure on a S-H Smart Car. (totalled). As it was still within the Dealers 30day warranty on major parts, I claimed, they rejected my claim, on the grounds it had been flat towed. Long story short. I eventually after much e-mail toing and froing, I took out a small claim against them, The first thing they did was send an assessor, to evaluate the damage and cause, eventually we got it to court, where I lost on a technicality. However, they asked for, and were refused, costs, it being a small claim. So they finished up with a bill for 4 times the value of that car in lawyers fee`s. doing the repair would have cost just over a Grand, and they, probably less. I know because that is what it cost me!. However I would Never ever buy another car from E***** H******. And everyone I know knows it!.

 

[Basildog]

At the risk of seeming like a happy clappy groupie, if I were in a situation like yours, I would hire Chris.

I bet on seeing Chris's firm's headed note paper appear on his desk, the dealer would simply fold and accede to all your requests.

JJ

Unfortunately they actually want me to take legal action !
I won’t be pushed into anything especially by the dealer who wants to use my legal action to put pressure on the manufacturers.

 

[Basildog]

Some years ago, I had a gearbox failure on a S-H Smart Car. (totalled). As it was still within the Dealers 30day warranty on major parts, I claimed, they rejected my claim, on the grounds it had been flat towed. Long story short. I eventually after much e-mail toing and froing, I took out a small claim against them, The first this they did was send an assessor, to evaluate the damage and cause, eventually we got it to court, where I lost on a technicality. However, they asked for, and were refused, costs, it being a small claim. So they finished up with a bill for 4 times the value of that car in lawyers fee`s. doing the repair would have cost just over a Grand. I know because that is what it cost me!.

And that’s absolutely another reason why many people prefer not to use the legal profession until forced to .
I have been told by the independent Motorhome bod ( I hate the misuse of engineer ! ) to reject the vehicle so am keeping this in reserve for when required.
We have progress as the dealers are now wanting to come and inspect the vehicle at a place of my choice , just hoping they aren’t playing more games !

 

[Chris]

At the risk of seeming like a happy clappy groupie, if I were in a situation like yours, I would hire Chris.

I bet on seeing Chris's firm's headed note paper appear on his desk, the dealer would simply fold and accede to all your requests.

JJ

I doubt it JJ.

And I don’t come on here for work to be honest.

I have enough hassle in the real world.

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[JJ]

I doubt it JJ.

And I don’t come on here for work to be honest.

I have enough hassle in the real world.

Bang goes my commission...

Bugger!


JJ

 

[Gizmouk]

As someone who's been there, seen it, done it etc etc ...
My best advice is: Do nothing yourself.
Hand the whole thing over to a solicitor. It'll cost you money, but it'll save your health and sanity.

If you have anything in writing from the dealer encouraging you to take legal action - hand that to your solicitor, and ask them to include a copy to Hymer.

As tempting as it is to start an online shit-storm, I'd advise against it. Get it wrong, and it could be you on the sharp end of legal action.

I wish you all the best

 

[Basildog]

As someone who's been there, seen it, done it etc etc ...
My best advice is: Do nothing yourself.
Hand the whole thing over to a solicitor. It'll cost you money, but it'll save your health and sanity.

If you have anything in writing from the dealer encouraging you to take legal action - hand that to your solicitor, and ask them to include a copy to Hymer.

As tempting as it is to start an online shit-storm, I'd advise against it. Get it wrong, and it could be you on the sharp end of legal action.

I wish you all the best

Probably why I was expelled from 5 schools !
I never did quite understand the rules
I never understood why the school always told you exactly what you needed to do again to get the desired ( by me ) result ?

 

[StephB]

Sadly we paid for it ?⚠☹
Spoken with a solicitor today and have a plan .
Having bought over 50 new vehicles in my time I thought I had been lucky when you read other people’s stories, when it happens to you it eats you up and consumes you as there doesn’t seem a way out of the nightmare.

Did you pay any part of the cost with a credit card? If so, talk to them.

 

[StephB]

Very British but certainly not my style and I am definitely not being pushed into legal action for their benefit.

I'd look on the Trading Standards website and quote their legislative responsibility. They will have the legislation you need to quote and probably a letter template, if you need it. I think the phrase you need to look at is goods not fit for purpose.

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[Basildog]

Did you pay any part of the cost with a credit card? If so, talk to them.

Sadly not ?

 

[ShaKen]

My considered advice on this is NOT to be emotional but to simply state facts as much as possible (you cant argue with facts).

I am involved in negotiations as well as conflict in my daily job and without doubt the best way to respond to things is to state facts, problems, the consequences of the problems, a proposed solution and the desired outcome.

Ideally you do not want to make enemies of the dealer; you simply want them to support you in the resolution of the problem, and of course if the resolution means they get out of it with the least cost & hassle (to them), then all the better.

My approach is:

Start from a place of safety (shared desire for a successful resolution)
State the issue
State the consequences of the issue
State the proposed resolution / steps
State the the benefits to all parties

Ie. (Of course I don’t know your issues or problems)

Example communication........

—-—-

Dear xxxxx, let me first say that I am a huge fan of Hymer products as well as being impressed by the well regarded service of their dealer networks, thus I’m sure you, like me, will be more than extremely disappointed by the issues I’ve encountered by my recent purchase.

To summarise the problems experienced they include:.......(issues here)

Without doubt this is completely unacceptable and does not in any way meet the promises (or guarantees / warranties) provided by both you and the manufacturer. It clearly breaches Consumers Rights Act 2015 which clearly states that products should be fit for purpose and of sufficient quality for sale. Clearly the vehicle I purchased meets neither of these simple requirements (as agreed and logged with Citizens Advice - Case Ref: XXXXX).

Without an immediate proposed resolution to this issue (issues noted above) I will be instigating legal proceedings inline with recommendation from Citizens Advice for a full refund along with additional costs to cover legal fees and loss of use, as well as assisting Trading Standards in any subsequent case raised for mis-selling / breaching of Trading Standards regulations.

To summarise, I simply want to enjoy my purchase of what should have been an excellent product.

I therefore need you to support me, and the Hymer brand in delivering that experience; otherwise I will use the full weight of Consumer Protection Law which without doubt will have a significant impact on your revenue generation (as I will obviously share my experiences with numerous UK publications and social media - I will also contact Hymer directly to discuss the failures of your company to date), as well as operational costs involved in fighting what will be for you a futile court case.

Simply, I would rather be your valued customer rather than your adversary in the conclusion of this issue, and thus be an advocate of the value you can bring to your future potential customers.

I therefore look forward to receiving your resolution plan within the next 5 days, otherwise I will have no alternative to proceed with legal proceeding and other actions as discussed above

Yours in anticipation.....

——————————

Note: I’m of course not a lawyer but it might be worth a try!

.

 

[JaneyBMotorhomer In Hants]

JaneyBMotorhomer In Hants ... I think you may want to edit the last couple of lines of your post.

I meant to say that "I know there are those on this site who constantly gripe about Auto Trails but ours is fabulous and the quality is much, much better than Adria (not Autotrail as I first put). The dealer is very good too." Is this what you mean or do you think I am having an unfair pop at those who criticise Auto Trails? If I post a question about mine there is always one person who uses it as an excuse to diss the brand, just saying. I thought I would redress the balance on the grounds that you only seem to hear the bad things about the makers, I think they should get praise where praise is due too.

 

[icantremember]

I meant to say that "I know there are those on this site who constantly gripe about Auto Trails but ours is fabulous and the quality is much, much better than Adria (not Autotrail as I first put). The dealer is very good too." Is this what you mean or do you think I am having an unfair pop at those who criticise Auto Trails? If I post a question about mine there is always one person who uses it as an excuse to diss the brand, just saying. I thought I would redress the balance on the grounds that you only seem to hear the bad things about the makers, I think they should get praise where praise is due too.

I'm certainly not being critical of AT, or any other make for that matter.

However, the wording of your post looks like you are ...... "ours is fabulous and the quality is much, much better than Autotrail"

 

[JaneyBMotorhomer In Hants]

Yep, as I said, I put Autotrail when I meant Adria. As in I find the quality and service around my Autotrail much better than Adria. I did think that I could edit it to read correctly by changing the original post but I could not work out any way of doing that. Must have had a senior moment!

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