Big Stellantis news. Entire van range restyled and updated

[beachwomble]

A lot to digest. Ducato/Scudo/Doblo/Boxer/Expert/Partner/Jumper/Dispatch/Berlingo/Movano/Vivaro/Combo, all get facelifted for 2024. Stellantis wants to overtake Ford by 2027 to be world leader in the commercial sector. Biggest visual difference is the exterior but the big news for some of us is that the Citroën Jumper and Peugeot Boxer are finally getting the same interior as the Ducato. Interior doesn't seem to change much from the current Ducato though (pictures are from the e-Ducato). How many facelifts is it now for the current chassis?!

All change at Stellantis: Vauxhall, Citroen, Peugeot and Fiat vans get a fresh new look | Auto Express

A total of 12 new models spearhead Stellantis' bid for greater commercial vehicle success

www.autoexpress.co.uk

Video of the official launch for all the details.

 

[beachwomble]

Here are some pictures

 

[Guigsy]

Adaptive cruise is nice. No mention of whether the delete of the auto box is true though, hope not.

And the battery version stops just having a cobbled in car battery and gets it's own design. Closer to being useful for motorhomes.

 

[Mzracer]

While a fuel-cell version of the Stellantis large van with a range of up to 310 miles will be revealed later in 2024. As well as a standalone model, the group will also offer retrofit hydrogen systems for existing vans, helping to reduce the cost of switching to renewable energy for customers.

For me the big news in that press release was the above, we have said that it is coming but a lot of folk on this forum don't want to believe it !!

 

[Pilote87]

The car to the left of the red vans appears to be an electric Citroen which, here in France, can be driven by 14-year-olds after basic training. If so, it can be charged overnight from a normal socket outlet and has a range of about 40 miles. Top speed is 30mph. Not much good for us wanting to visit family in the UK

John

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[mitzimad]

ICE and EV versions will appear once again – with 50kWh and 75kWh battery options available - while a hydrogen fuel cell variant will also be offered. Battery models will have around 210 miles of range, while the FCV versions will offer nearly 250 miles of range, as well as refuelling in five minutes. hydrogen rears its ugly head again but where do you refuel?

 

[Mzracer]

hydrogen rears its ugly head again but where do you refuel?

To the fuelling stations that will gradually be built, this is what the motor manufacturers actually want.

 

[mikebeaches]

Adaptive cruise is nice. No mention of whether the delete of the auto box is true though, hope not.

And the battery version stops just having a cobbled in car battery and gets it's own design. Closer to being useful for motorhomes.

I heard mention in the video commentary that there is to be a new 8-speed automatic gearbox. No further description. The cynic in me wonders if the new auto box is better than the existing 9-speed, or just cheaper?

I thought the 'facelifted' bodywork was surprisingly minimal, with just a tweak to the nose.

 

[LostInSpace]

They need to be better than the exiisting Fiat.

 

[beachwomble]

I heard mention in the video commentary that there is to be a new 8-speed automatic gearbox. No further description. The cynic in me wonders if the new auto box is better than the existing 9-speed, or just cheaper?

I thought the 'facelifted' bodywork was surprisingly minimal, with just a tweak to the nose.

The interior (of Ducato) has new cockpit screen graphics. New rear lights too.

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[mikebeaches]

The interior (of Ducato) has new cockpit screen graphics. New rear lights too.

Ah, OK I missed the new rear lights.

Edited to add, just tried to have a quick look at the back and again, not exactly radical as far as I could see.

I think the current general exterior van design dates from about 2007, with a major front face lift circa 2014/15.

 

[Mzracer]

Don't worry about the dash or the lights, look at what they are saying about range and hydrogen.

Henry had lights on the Model T for god sake !!

 

[Guigsy]

I heard mention in the video commentary that there is to be a new 8-speed automatic gearbox. No further description. The cynic in me wonders if the new auto box is better than the existing 9-speed, or just cheaper?

I'm guessing it's a new in-house design rather than paying for the tried and tested ZF 9 speed box.

Edit: it could be the EAT8 box that Citroen and Peugeot have been using for a few years?

 

[dash300]

I'm guessing it's a new in-house design rather than paying for the tried and tested ZF 9 speed box.

Edit: it could be the EAT8 box that Citroen and Peugeot have been using for a few years?

Or perhaps the Japanese Aisin 8 speed as in my Volvo.

 

[Mzracer]

Thanks to beachwomble for a post regarding Stellantis's upcoming plans and new models we get this nugget.

"While a fuel-cell version of the Stellantis large van with a range of up to 310 miles will be revealed later in 2024. As well as a standalone model, the group will also offer retrofit hydrogen systems for existing vans, helping to reduce the cost of switching to renewable energy for customers."

The quote comes from near the bottom of the link below.

All change at Stellantis: Vauxhall, Citroen, Peugeot and Fiat vans get a fresh new look | Auto Express

A total of 12 new models spearhead Stellantis' bid for greater commercial vehicle success

www.autoexpress.co.uk

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[Guigsy]

Skeptic:
"Revealed" doesn't mean you'll be able to buy it. And you may not want to when there's less than 20 filling points in the whole country. Will you be happy with paying twice as much per mile as a battery vehicle?

Optimist:
Hydrogen fuel cell is currently a better fit for motorhomes than battery technology.

 

[pagey]

So all they need now is dealers that know how to repair them

 

[Mzracer]

Yes your points are good and the reason I reposted this is that this is likely to be more effective than batteries for heavyish vehicles.

The question of paying twice as much per mile as BEV has two prongs IMO, firstly BEV will not remain at the current pence per mile figure for long (demand for electricity, battery minerals, government taxes and insurance costs) secondly it does not work for heavy vehicles so there can be no comparison.

 

[jongood]

Optimist:
Hydrogen fuel cell is currently a better fit for motorhomes than battery technology.

I would say that with the current technology the above is the realist position.

I also think the requirements for lighter vehicles are completely different.

 

[Mzracer]

I would say that with the current technology the above is the realist position.

I also think the requirements for lighter vehicles are completely different.

Agree 100%

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[TheMachMan]

From what I’ve seen Ford, Merc, & VW panel vans are all narrower which makes the interiors smaller and requires bulges in the rear from transverse beds. So it’s good news if Fiat can get a grip and continue to supply for PVC’s.

 

[Neil S]

when are they stopping making conventional diesel engines

 

[Mzracer]

when are they stopping making conventional diesel engines

My guess is not stopping in our lifetime, it will take decades to roll out either high power charging networks or hydrogen filling in many parts of the Globe.

Remember there are a lot of the Worlds population that don't even have running water and basic sanitation never mind EV infrastructure. So they will need diesel engines for decades.

 

[Guigsy]

I'm assuming they've tried to fit the fuel cell, motors and the hydrogen tank within the existing confines. So from the cab backwards, it'll be compatible with anything a Ducato can currently be used for (tipper, car transporter, motorhome) as there's no intrusion into the chassis. Hence the range of only 310 miles. Which will be quite a lot less with the weight and aero drag of a full coachbuild. If there were enough filling stations, that would be usable, but not convenient.

 

[Mzracer]

I'm assuming they've tried to fit the fuel cell, motors and the hydrogen tank within the existing confines. So from the cab backwards, it'll be compatible with anything a Ducato can currently be used for (tipper, car transporter, motorhome) as there's no intrusion into the chassis. Hence the range of only 310 miles. Which will be quite a lot less with the weight and aero drag of a full coachbuild. If there were enough filling stations, that would be usable, but not convenient.

The fuel cell will be nowhere near as intrusive space wise as a big battery pack, there will be packaging compromises though.

The filling network will happen as there are some serious players needing it to be in place (Toyota, BMW, Stellansis etc) . I will wager that it is easier to do a hydrogen filling station in the middle of nowhere than it is to do a decent EV charging station as the hydrogen station in theory could be self supporting energy wise (use a fuel cell to generate the local power required) so no need to run cables to the site just truck in Hydrogen.

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[Guigsy]

The fuel cell will be nowhere near as intrusive space wise as a big battery pack, there will be packaging compromises though.

The fact that it's going to have considerably less range than a diesel confirms that. It will be good if they don't need to use space under the floor though.

Note that a Toyota Mirai and a Tesla S are pretty much the same size and weight with the same range. But the Tesla has far more interior space. Hydrogen isn't easy to package.

 

[Mzracer]

All this makes us realise why fossil fuel has been supreme for so long, easy to package, loads of energy density and works !!

 

[Guigsy]

All this makes us realise why fossil fuel has been supreme for so long, easy to package, loads of energy density and works !!

Dino squeezings sure are convenient... except for the limited supply and environmental destruction thing.

 

[Mzracer]

Dino squeezings sure are convenient... except for the limited supply and environmental destruction thing.

Yes we over looked those problems for 120 years because it was so good in other respects.

Multi fuel will be the way that it goes. Nothing has got the overall answer that is provided by fossil fuel.

Toyota Mirai sets official World Record

Land's End to John O'Groats (almost)

mag.toyota.co.uk

 

[SpeedyDux]

My guess is not stopping in our lifetime, it will take decades to roll out either high power charging networks or hydrogen filling in many parts of the Globe.

Remember there are a lot of the Worlds population that don't even have running water and basic sanitation never mind EV infrastructure. So they will need diesel engines for decades.

The impossibility of mining enough copper to provide the infrastructure for global switching from ICE to EV by 2050 or 2060 is where the decarbonising goal falls down. There will be a demand for diesel engines for at least another century. Either that or famines.

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