B2B Problems advice please!

[IanF]

Just fitted a Victron B2B non isolated charger complete with two re-settable switches. However when the engine is not running I noted that a power supply was still going to my diesel heater in spite of the fact my lithium leisure battery was disconnected. The positive power cables were of course still connected via the battery terminal connectors. I thought the B2B would recognise the engine was not running and stop power being drawn from the starter battery.
I have been made aware someone else on MHF experienced this problem too but don't know who this was or how this problem was resolved
We have a 2013 Autotrail with a Sargent 500 control unit. Any help will be much appreciated.
Thank you Ian

 

[Kannon Fodda]

Is the original Sargent based charging relay now isolated so that you have the B2B only, else you may have created a looped circuit somewhere. Also some Sargent units allow you to switch charging on EHU between leisure and engine batteries (and even solar can be switchable), worse with my EC176 I could actually switch to the engine battery for leisure use (so you'd have a dead starter battery in the morning).

 

[Lenny HB]

How have you set up the B2B is it working on voltage sensing or have you wired it using a D+ signal to switch it.
To make sure it only operates when the engine is running you to use the D+ method.

 

[Wh05apk]

How have you set up the B2B is it working on voltage sensing or have you wired it using a D+ signal to switch it.
To make sure it only operates when the engine is running you to use the D+ method.

Lenny, I had mine fitted so not sure of how it is connected, in the settings i have the option of charger or power supply as function, is power supply the same as d+?

 

[IanF]

Is the original Sargent based charging relay now isolated so that you have the B2B only, else you may have created a looped circuit somewhere. Also some Sargent units allow you to switch charging on EHU between leisure and engine batteries (and even solar can be switchable), worse with my EC176 I could actually switch to the engine battery for leisure use (so you'd have a dead starter battery in the morning).

Hi thank you for your advice. I did contact Sargent and they advised me I didn't need to have anything done to the EC500 unit. Should this be correct then it just seems the Victron B2B is not sensing the engine is not running and allowing current to flow from the engine battery to the leisure battery. I'll contact the Victron supplier this morning to seek their advice too.
As an electrical ignoramus seems like a good idea but probably won't understand their advice.
Ian

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[Lenny HB]

Lenny, I had mine fitted so not sure of how it is connected, in the settings i have the option of charger or power supply as function, is power supply the same as d+?

No it's not.

 

[Wh05apk]

No it's not.

I'll leave it alone then.

 

[Ditcha]

Lenny, I had mine fitted so not sure of how it is connected, in the settings i have the option of charger or power supply as function, is power supply the same as d+?

Don't know if you can see your B2B but there is a plug like the one in the pic which should have the d+ wire connected, you can use this plug for various things like switching with a d+ (engine running) or a manual switch or as it comes linked out.
Victron have a engine shutdown feature which is supposed to work instead of using a d+ if this isn't set right it's been know to start charging even when the engine is off by using a d+ this doesn't happen it simply turns on when engine is on and off when engine is off.
I would turn engine shutdown detect off in victron connect and use a d+ and make sure it's set to charger not power supply.

 

[Wh05apk]

Don't know if you can see your B2B but there is a plug like the one in the pic which should have the d+ wire connected, you can use this plug for various things like switching with a d+ (engine running) or a manual switch or as it comes linked out.
Victron have a engine shutdown feature which is supposed to work instead of using a d+ if this isn't set right it's been know to start charging even when the engine is off by using a d+ this doesn't happen it simply turns on when engine is on and off when engine is off.
I would turn engine shutdown detect off in victron connect and use a d+ and make sure it's set to charger not power supply.

View attachment 738148

I will have a look, but I think how they have installed it is pretty inaccessible.

 

[Ditcha]

I will have a look, but I think how they have installed it is pretty inaccessible.

They normally are

Have a play about with your settings you might get it working to your needs with the engine shutdown feature, you can also turn it off in the victron connect app if you remember to do so when stopped, but using a d+ signal to switch it automates it so you can forget about it.

Pain in the arse these gadgets aren't they

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[Bessy765]

If you have a diesel heater fitted there should always be power to it. When you turn a diesel heater off it goes through a shut down procedure as in the supply of fuel is stopped but the fan keeps running to allow the combustion chamber to cool down so preventing anything overheating. To cut off the power would possibly leave unburnt fuel in the chamber and shorten the life of the unit. The heater should be on its own circuit and not affected if you turn off the hab electrics.

 

[Ditcha]

A quick way to find out if you have a d+ switching the B2B is to turn off engine shutdown detect off and watch the B2B in victron connect and see if it fires up when you start the van.

 

[Ditcha]

If you have a diesel heater fitted there should always be power to it. When you turn a diesel heater off it goes through a shut down procedure as in the supply of fuel is stopped but the fan keeps running to allow the combustion chamber to cool down so preventing anything overheating. To cut off the power would possibly leave unburnt fuel in the chamber and shorten the life of the unit. The heater should be on its own circuit and not affected if you turn off the hab electrics.

The leisure battery was disconnected, the power was coming from the B2B via the starter battery, through the battery clamp which is disconnected well that's the way I am reading it.

 

[IanF]

The leisure battery was disconnected, the power was coming from the B2B via the starter battery, through the battery clamp which is disconnected well that's the way I am reading it.

That is absolutely correct it appears the b2b is not detecting engine is shut down.
Ian

 

[IanF]

I now have the supplier accept that the b2b is not factory set up properly i.e. it should be the default situation where it automatically detects the engine is not running and blocks the passage of electrical power from the starter battery through to the leisure battery. They are going to guide me through the blue tooth adjustments which require to be made to the unit.
thanks all for your kind assistance much appreciated
Ian