Autotrail V=Line 2016 610se Leisure Battery upgrade

bluesurf989

bluesurf989

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We have just purchased a V-line 610se and we are a bit concerned about the small 72ah leisure battery. What would be the best way to give us alot more power,ie add another battery or would the sargent system support lithium??
Many thanks
 
How do you use the van? Mainly sites or mainly off grid? Summer or all year round?
 
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The EC175/6 psu fitted in the line outputs a flat 13.8V from either engine or mains. It's a old fashioned dumb charger as it doesn't even vary voltage for absorption and float phases and is simply always on which long term even the lead acid battery won't like. Essentially design of the electrics on the line is for a night in a lay by or using campsite with hook up.

Given the poor Sargent I can't recommend simply adding another lead acid battery, even if they do make a wiring adaptor for that. Read the Sargent manual and a second battery takes it over their recommended capacity (as the charge rate max Amperage is also limited).

So if you do want more battery bite the bullet and upgrade systems to lithium, accepting you will need to bypass the Sargent for at least one charger method (solar, engine, mains), so from time to time the lithium would fully replenish. In my case, having limited hook up time I went for better solar controller (mppt type), and a B2B charger (replaced the engine relay).

If you don't want to attempt work yourself, offgridpower.solutions and Vanbitz are good installers to speak to.
 
Cheers Kannon Fodda. That was great information. I dont really like messing with electrics so i think ill speak to vanbitz and see what they recommend (y) Never straight forward is it

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Kannon Fodda said:
The EC175/6 psu fitted in the line outputs a flat 13.8V from either engine or mains. It's a old fashioned dumb charger as it doesn't even vary voltage for absorption and float phases and is simply always on which long term even the lead acid battery won't like. Essentially design of the electrics on the line is for a night in a lay by or using campsite with hook up.

Given the poor Sargent I can't recommend simply adding another lead acid battery, even if they do make a wiring adaptor for that. Read the Sargent manual and a second battery takes it over their recommended capacity (as the charge rate max Amperage is also limited).

So if you do want more battery bite the bullet and upgrade systems to lithium, accepting you will need to bypass the Sargent for at least one charger method (solar, engine, mains), so from time to time the lithium would fully replenish. In my case, having limited hook up time I went for better solar controller (mppt type), and a B2B charger (replaced the engine relay).

If you don't want to attempt work yourself, offgridpower.solutions and Vanbitz are good installers to speak to.
Click to expand...
Does it make a difference if i was to change the solar controller to a victron mppt. I gather thats just a straight forward swap?
 
bluesurf989 said:
Does it make a difference if i was to change the solar controller to a victron mppt. I gather thats just a straight forward swap?
Click to expand...
Assuming your solar is that basic black box hidden in one of the upper cupboards then the Victron would be a good improvement, as the Victron MPPT has a lithium profile. That at least means on good sunny summery days a lithium would get a nice full charge. It is an easy swap over. Get the bluetooth version for a few pounds more so you can impress yourself with your solar gain, and change settings as needed. Just size it for your panel, which if the standard 100W size a 75/15 is good.

But, if the standard Autotrail install you had that 2 way switch that allows charging of leisure or engine battery, you wouldn't be able to use the setting for engine without changing back the Victron to the lead-acid profile. Ultimately on my vline that switch was removed so the solar charged the leisure only. But I also fitted a Vanbitz battery master so my lithium leisure could trickle charge the engine. There was also a slight wiring trick that the wires behind that switch needed to be part cross connected else the door step didn't operate properly - not quite sure now but I think it's powered by the engine battery but weirdly via the Sargent.

If you have the Autotrail handbook there may be a wiring diagram for your van at the back. I think wiring diagrams were published until around 2020.

I've made a lot of changes to the wiring in my vline. This thread details the present setup:
www.motorhomefun.co.uk

Squeezing a Quart into a Pint Pot - 280Ah Lithium into a V-Line 540 PVC

Lithium prices have been dropping and it was time for more power! But what might fit into my 2019 Autotrail 540 V-line (a 5.4m long PVC)? 4 years ago, I had Vanbitz replace the pathetic rear under benchseat mounted 75ah lead acid with a 120Ah Sterling Lithium fed by a Sterling 60A B2B through...
www.motorhomefun.co.uk www.motorhomefun.co.uk
 
Lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) will bring deeper battery discharge ability and faster charging profiles than lead acid variants so it is well suited to off grinding. Your charging sources will probably need an upgrade to get the most out of the system. A well respected installer, such as some that are members here, will see you right. It can be pricey but if you know what you are doing you can cut out the middle man.

A single 72ah lead acid will only give about 36ah of useable power. If you just run a water pump and some Led lights you will get an about 6 hours. My lighting pulls about 5 amps if they are all on. A bigger lead acid battery or a bank of them will increase your number of evenings. I feel a 72 ah battery is there to be used in conjunction with ehu.
 
LifePo4 = Lithium or thereabouts in the motorhome sense since there are different lithium chemistry but only lifepo4 is used for leisure battery systems.

But before taking a plunge decide your real needs based on likely use, even "off grid".

When I first bought my van, new. I had the standard v-line setup 75Ah (actually 72Ah when you read the labels), with 100W roof panel. But actually this sort of worked and I even did a three night end November rally without going dark. But I was frugal in how many led lights were in, didn't have radio on in the day, and tv was probably less than a couple of hours.

But I wanted to increase my use of "toys" and not worry. Lithium batteries are now a lot larger capacity for cost than even a couple of years ago. Back then 120Ah lithium was almost big yet costly. A great upgrade in similar space and less weight than the lead acid. Suddenly I could turn on lights, play radio, watch tv, for 3-4 , nights without having to move on. If I did move a couple of hours max (if not less) the B2B engine charger would have refilled the lithium.

I've got used to the extra power available, and found more uses for it. Now I recharge the ebike. I use a gaming laptop. All through a small inverter. I've added a mifi system. I added extra solar on a deployable solar panel (but you need sun). Wohoo. Early May 2024 I was punishing it all on a Devon site for a week without moving but 2 days later in New Forest that 120Ah fully charged became only 5% when the sun didn't shine.

As link post above I've upgraded again now with effectively 300Ah lithium power. Last week I had 2 nights off grid. No effective solar as January and wooded site in New Forest. Weather not that nice so spent most of time in van with radio, tv, mifi and computer. Battery about 55% when I left site. 50A B2B in a hour and half drive got it to around 85%. So I may have decent battery but now the issue is to put it back. You can chase your tail.

So battery needs and capacity comes to what you need and also how to put it back. A frugal use not needing toys, moving regularly, may be happy with basic lead acid. If you are static, off grid a lot, big battery capacity and good recharging is a must.
 
bluesurf989 said:
We have just purchased a V-line 610se and we are a bit concerned about the small 72ah leisure battery. What would be the best way to give us alot more power,ie add another battery or would the sargent system support lithium??
Many thanks
Click to expand...
We have a V600 and ditched our Sargent and went with Victron and have. 100ah lithium and it works great.
 

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