Any experienced Funsters passing by Saarbrucken?

[Kilroy]

Hi
I recently visited a dealer in Saarbrucken called Wohnwagon Vogt, where I found a couple of interesting liners, both Morelo and Concorde. Since my knowledge of motorhomes could fit neatly on the back of an envelope, I wondered if any experienced members on here are passing by (unlikely I know) and if you would be willing to cast a second eye.. I know this is a long shot/tall order etc....but worth a try anyway!

 

[Riverbankannie]

funflair is heading to the Morelo factory at the moment. Is that near Saarbrucken?

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

funflair is heading to the Morelo factory at the moment. Is that near Saarbrucken?

Would take him 5 years to make up his mind if it’s any good

 

[funflair]

Would take him 5 years to make up his mind if it’s any good

Cheeky

funflair is heading to the Morelo factory at the moment. Is that near Saarbrucken?

No not very close although to be fair we don’t know where we are going next, Kilroy starting with the basics a liner will be over 7500kg so do you have a C licence? What chassis are these respective vehicles on? And assuming they are big things do you really want something that big?

 

[Kilroy]

Cheeky

No not very close although to be fair we don’t know where we are going next, Kilroy starting with the basics a liner will be over 7500kg so do you have a C licence? What chassis are these respective vehicles on? And assuming they are big things do you really want something that big?

Hi , yes I have a full truck license, and Certificate of Professional Competence/tacho as well. I did a short tour in a 9 metre in Saarland which I reported briefly on another thread. Comfortable with the size & my preference if possible.
Most of what I looked at/ drove are on the Daily. However there’s one Concorde liner on the 6 cylinder Eurocargo that’s interesting..
..though I haven’t driven it

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[CazPaul]

Just had a look on the website which van are you interested in?
I think I’m out of touch a little with prices they have a Concorde Centurion 5 years old and it’s 600,000.00 euros wow
I think we’re keeping ours a tad longer

 

[funflair]

Hi , yes I have a full truck license, and Certificate of Professional Competence/tacho as well. I did a short tour in a 9 metre in Saarland which I reported briefly on another thread. Comfortable with the size & my preference if possible.
Most of what I looked at/ drove are on the Daily. However there’s one Concorde liner on the 6 cylinder Eurocargo that’s interesting..
..though I haven’t driven it

I guess you know what to expect from the Eurocargo chassis better than I did when I recently tested a 4cylinder Eurocargo (wouldn’t swap for our Daily) 9 metres is still a useable size I think and of course no problem for you driving, it will be wider at 2.5 metres but you will appreciate the extra space inside I am sure.

 

[jongood]

I guess you know what to expect from the Eurocargo chassis better than I did when I recently tested a 4cylinder Eurocargo (wouldn’t swap for our Daily) 9 metres is still a useable size I think and of course no problem for you driving, it will be wider at 2.5 metres but you will appreciate the extra space inside I am sure.

Im pretty sure Mike and Bernies Clou Liner was a 6 cylinder Eurocargo. He absolutely loved it, I remember him telling me how torquey he found it, would only change down once to go around a roundabout.

Ive not driven a Eurocargo for years iirc before they made a 4 cylinder, although read plenty of moans about how rough the 4 cylinder ones are, and then add in an autobox to make it even stodgier.......

 

[funflair]

Im pretty sure Mike and Bernies Clou Liner was a 6 cylinder Eurocargo. He absolutely loved it, I remember him telling me how torquey he found it, would only change down once to go around a roundabout.

Ive not driven a Eurocargo for years iirc before they made a 4 cylinder, although read plenty of moans about how rough the 4 cylinder ones are, and then add in an autobox to make it even stodgier.......

Think you are right about the Clou Jon, I seem to recall a similar conversation.

 

[jongood]

Just had a look on the website which van are you interested in?
I think I’m out of touch a little with prices they have a Concorde Centurion 5 years old and it’s 600,000.00 euros wow
I think we’re keeping ours a tad longer

Im guessing this one Paul

Concorde Liner plus 890L *360 Grad, Geschirrsp., Stützen - Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

Lot of Mh for the money, bit of a bargain when you think of the difference in initial purchase price on top ofvthe Daily version compared to now.

Looks nice Kilroy decent spec as well.

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[jongood]

Same site, if you're after a biggervmotor with a car garage - look at this for a bargain - €1M new ?? 5 years ago now €299.

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

 

[Kilroy]

Im guessing this one Paul

Concorde Liner plus 890L *360 Grad, Geschirrsp., Stützen - Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

Lot of Mh for the money, bit of a bargain when you think of the difference in initial purchase price on top ofvthe Daily version compared to now.

Looks nice Kilroy decent spec as well.

Thanks for that feedback Jongood. Yes, that's the heavy one I was looking at.
I wondered if the 'repaired damage' was an issue, but I got some photos of the damage pre-repair and it looks superficial enough.
The last owner was Swedish and did some electrical diy it seems...I wouldn't know how to assess that. Though the dealer is offering a good guarantee..

 

[Kilroy]

Same site, if you're after a biggervmotor with a car garage - look at this for a bargain - €1M new ?? 5 years ago now €299.

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

very nice I agree, but I think too big for me....

 

[Kilroy]

Just had a look on the website which van are you interested in?
I think I’m out of touch a little with prices they have a Concorde Centurion 5 years old and it’s 600,000.00 euros wow
I think we’re keeping ours a tad longer

Hi Paul,
the eurocargo is the one identified below by Johngood.

Here's a Charisma

Concorde Charisma 900 L *Active Air, Retarder, Gastank.. - Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

Here the Morelos

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

MIRO 7080kgs so no payload to speak of. It has been plated at 8150 kgs to compensate?

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

another Morelo.

The prices of course are all serious amounts, and many of these have been on the market for a lot of months so I wonder if there is a deal to be made...

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

Im pretty sure Mike and Bernies Clou Liner was a 6 cylinder Eurocargo. He absolutely loved it, I remember him telling me how torquey he found it, would only change down once to go around a roundabout.

Ive not driven a Eurocargo for years iirc before they made a 4 cylinder, although read plenty of moans about how rough the 4 cylinder ones are, and then add in an autobox to make it even stodgier.......

Have had a few different makes of 7.5t tippers with my company and by far the best was a MAN straight 6, so much better than Ford or Merc
It’s a shame they no longer make motorhomes on a MAN chassis although I did see an older Carthargo in Fussen on a MAN.

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[jongood]

Thanks for that feedback Jongood. Yes, that's the heavy one I was looking at.
I wondered if the 'repaired damage' was an issue, but I got some photos of the damage pre-repair and it looks superficial enough.
The last owner was Swedish and did some electrical diy it seems...I wouldn't know how to assess that. Though the dealer is offering a good guarantee..

My Clouliner has had a repair in its past but done properly by N&B and covered by a Gutachten which is a very thorough appraisal by an engineer.

 

[jongood]

Hi Paul,
the eurocargo is the one identified below by Johngood.

Here's a Charisma

Concorde Charisma 900 L *Active Air, Retarder, Gastank.. - Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

Here the Morelos

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

MIRO 7080kgs so no payload to speak of. It has been plated at 8150 kgs to compensate?

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

another Morelo.

The prices of course are all serious amounts, and many of these have been on the market for a lot of months so I wonder if there is a deal to be made...

I think all these are on Daily chassis, not the same thing and you can run up against the limitations of 7500kgs

 

[funflair]

Same site, if you're after a biggervmotor with a car garage - look at this for a bargain - €1M new ?? 5 years ago now €299.

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

I’m sure it wouldn’t have been that much Jon.

I think all these are on Daily chassis, not the same thing and you can run up against the limitations of 7500kgs

The Morelo Empire 90L on the Daily is just mad in my opinion, and I like my Daily but wouldn’t want that sat on top of it

 

[funflair]

Hi Paul,
the eurocargo is the one identified below by Johngood.

Here's a Charisma

Concorde Charisma 900 L *Active Air, Retarder, Gastank.. - Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

Here the Morelos

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

MIRO 7080kgs so no payload to speak of. It has been plated at 8150 kgs to compensate?

Fahrzeugbestand Übersicht – Wohnwagen Vogt

www.wohnwagen-vogt.de

another Morelo.

The prices of course are all serious amounts, and many of these have been on the market for a lot of months so I wonder if there is a deal to be made...

You would get the Smart car in but then next to no payload.

 

[Kilroy]

You would get the Smart car in but then next to no payload.

yup. No question of using the garage for a smart as payload would be zilch. Just using it for bikes etc might work.

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[Kilroy]

I think all these are on Daily chassis, not the same thing and you can run up against the limitations of 7500kgs

yes, all on the Daily. I took a Morelo Palace out for a week. With gas, diesel and water tank full and just the myself and light contents, I thought it worked hard on some of the long pulls...I'm not sure how it would be with a full 7500kgs

 

[Kilroy]

I’m sure it wouldn’t have been that much Jon.

The Morelo Empire 90L on the Daily is just mad in my opinion, and I like my Daily but wouldn’t want that sat on top of it

Thanks for that feedback. It is a useful clarification. To be fair, I thought the Palace I drove for a week felt like it was pushing the limit of the daily, on long pulls but particularly notable was the amount of 'lean' when using ramps onto/off the autobahn. In my business we had Ford transits/landcruisers and one Daily...nobody wanted to drive the Daily as they complained that it was 'like driving a boat' in comparison...a quote that came back to me with a smile as I was entering a ramp!

 

[Kilroy]

My Clouliner has had a repair in its past but done properly by N&B and covered by a Gutachten which is a very thorough appraisal by an engineer.

Thanks for that. Sounds a sensible option

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

Thanks for that feedback. It is a useful clarification. To be fair, I thought the Palace I drove for a week felt like it was pushing the limit of the daily, on long pulls but particularly notable was the amount of 'lean' when using ramps onto/off the autobahn. In my business we had Ford transits/landcruisers and one Daily...nobody wanted to drive the Daily as they complained that it was 'like driving a boat' in comparison...a quote that came back to me with a smile as I was entering a ramp!

Have had mine remapped and it makes a lot of difference on the torque, Palace definitely needs the adaptive air suspension also, 18’000 miles on mine all over Europe including some very steep hills in the Alps without it missing a beat

 

[Gaston aires]

Have had mine remapped and it makes a lot of difference on the torque, Palace definitely needs the adaptive air suspension also, 18’000 miles on mine all over Europe including some very steep hills in the Alps without it missing a beat

I just change gear a bit more and it burns the crud out the DPF
Phil upmetank

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[funflair]

Thanks for that feedback. It is a useful clarification. To be fair, I thought the Palace I drove for a week felt like it was pushing the limit of the daily, on long pulls but particularly notable was the amount of 'lean' when using ramps onto/off the autobahn. In my business we had Ford transits/landcruisers and one Daily...nobody wanted to drive the Daily as they complained that it was 'like driving a boat' in comparison...a quote that came back to me with a smile as I was entering a ramp!

Yes I think the 3l Daily does have to work a bit on the hills but the ZF8 speed makes light work of the shifting, suspension and body roll wise I have just been out in a 4cylinder Eurocargo Loft Liner and our Daily Palace with the full/active air is a more composed ride and certainly handles carriageway changes in roadworks much better.

 

[jongood]

Thanks for that feedback. It is a useful clarification. To be fair, I thought the Palace I drove for a week felt like it was pushing the limit of the daily, on long pulls but particularly notable was the amount of 'lean' when using ramps onto/off the autobahn. In my business we had Ford transits/landcruisers and one Daily...nobody wanted to drive the Daily as they complained that it was 'like driving a boat' in comparison...a quote that came back to me with a smile as I was entering a ramp!

A large body mounted on a chassis is always going to be a bit boaty, I think it probably helps when the body size is more similar to the size of bodies that the original chassis was designed for, or you can choose to overcome the limitations with sophisticated suspension controls. I would imagine if you put martins palace body on the Eurocargo chassis it would be different again

 

[Kilroy]

Have had mine remapped and it makes a lot of difference on the torque, Palace definitely needs the adaptive air suspension also, 18’000 miles on mine all over Europe including some very steep hills in the Alps without it missing a beat

Thanks for that information. good to know

 

[Kilroy]

Yes I think the 3l Daily does have to work a bit on the hills but the ZF8 speed makes light work of the shifting, suspension and body roll wise I have just been out in a 4cylinder Eurocargo Loft Liner and our Daily Palace with the full/active air is a more composed ride and certainly handles carriageway changes in roadworks much better.

Thanks Martin.
To be fair, our old Daily definitely didn't have air suspension and the springs and shicks might have been overdue some attention! so my experience with that isn't relevant here. I hear what you are saying about the Daily/Eurocargo comparison, and the effect of active air.
I have learned a lot from the conversation here.
My main problem is the fear of making a terrible mistake and buying something with an obvious "fault' due to my own lack of knowledge & experience.

 

[Kilroy]

Thanks folks for all the replies here and for giving me the benefit of your experience.
The Charisma linked above seems to be the only one with 'active air' on the Daily chassis...though I need to see what the payload is with retarder etc on board. I like the eurocargo for the comfortable payload thoughI haven't driven it and there are other compromises there, and it seems that the market for over 7.5 tons is slower with a limited pool of c license holders if I think about resale in a few years....I'm probably over thinking things here!