300amh Lithium Battery recharge

[Redders69]

Hi We are worried about running out of power if we go all electric in the habitation area of our campervan. We would use the van as a daily vehicle as well as a campervan and would stay off grid as long as we could. The set up would be a 300ah Li-He TO-4 battery with inverter and a 325w solar panel. The van would have an induction hob and we would use a 50 litre compressor fridge. Lights are LED and then just using a 650w kettle to boil water and recharging phones, iPad and laptop. I have worked out we would be ok we would have enough for about 3 to 4 days and would then need to run the engine. My question is how quickly do these batteries take to recharge from the alternator if we were down to say 20%? We very rarely stay out for that long but does anyone else have any experience of this sort of set up and usage? Thanks in advance.

 

[Jim]

The set up would be a 300ah Li-He TO-4 battery with inverter and a 325w solar panel.

Unless you are holidaying in Wales, I wouldn't worry about summer touring. I have a similar set up but only 200AH of batteries, I've not been hooked up for two years, even when I'm paying for it. Last trip to Italy we didn't even take a hookup lead. I can't really answer your specific question about the time it takes to charge, suffice to say it's quick. Caveat, we use a gas kettle, whenever we are not in full sun.

 

[Redders69]

Unless you are holidaying in Wales, I wouldn't worry about summer touring. I have a similar set up but only 200AH of batteries, I've not been hooked up for two years, even when I'm paying for it. Last trip to Italy we didn't even take a hookup lead. I can't really answer your specific question about the time it takes to charge, suffice to say it's quick. Caveat, we use a gas kettle, whenever we are not in full sun.

Thanks Jim we were hoping to stay away from using gas but going just to electric has created some worry. We have always had refillable LPG but this is getting harder to find in the UK. When you say quick an hour or less? Thanks for the reply.

 

[Otter Spotter]

The time for Alternator charging will depend on your Alternator. I think I have a 90ah Alternator in my Citroen relay and from 50% to 100% charge it takes around about 1 to 1.5 hours. If you are travelling daily then I don’t think you need to worry. I use mine daily and the lowest my 110ah lithium battery has got to is 25%. I also have a 160ah solar panel though when at home it doesn’t provide anything as it is obscured. I do have a 300w panel to replace the old one when I can get it fitted.
nearly forgot to say, we cook on a diesel hob and water heated via 1000w kettle through a 3000w invertor which is a bit of overkill

 

[Lenny HB]

To recharge from 20% DOD with a 30 amp B2B it will take about 8 to 9 hours depending I the efficency of the B2B.
A 60 amp B2B will halve that time so 4 to 5 hours.

At 80% discharged you will need to put approx 240ah back into the battery.
Just divide 240 by the size od your B2B and add a few percent for efficency.

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[Jim]

we were hoping to stay away from using gas

When it comes to kettles, gas as a fuel is too good to ignore. Using it for brews then one tank would last you quite a number of weeks, and the equivelent of well over a hundred full battery charges.

Motorhome Gas Options. Is LPG Dead?

Refillable tanks or Regular bottles? Or maybe you should you do away with Motorhome Gas altogether. The best way power your motorhome.

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

 

[Redders69]

The time for Alternator charging will depend on your Alternator. I think I have a 90ah Alternator in my Citroen relay and from 50% to 100% charge it takes around about 1 to 1.5 hours. If you are travelling daily then I don’t think you need to worry. I use mine daily and the lowest my 110ah lithium battery has got to is 25%. I also have a 160ah solar panel though when at home it doesn’t provide anything as it is obscured. I do have a 300w panel to replace the old one when I can get it fitted.
nearly forgot to say, we cook on a diesel hob and water heated via 1000w kettle through a 3000w invertor which is a bit of overkill

Thanks Other Spotter very helpful. The inverter would be 3000w in ours.

 

[Redders69]

When it comes to kettles, gas as a fuel is too good to ignore. Using it for brews then one tank would last you quite a number of weeks, and the equivelent of well over a hundred full battery charges.

Motorhome Gas Options. Is LPG Dead?

Refillable tanks or Regular bottles? Or maybe you should you do away with Motorhome Gas altogether. The best way power your motorhome.

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

Thanks and an interesting article on LPG availability. We would like to keep the van for 10 years or so, so LPG availability in 10 years, with a crystal ball, is a consideration.

 

[Jim]

Thanks and an interesting article on LPG availability. We would like to keep the van for 10 years or so, so LPG availability in 10 years, with a crystal ball, is a consideration.

Who knows, but I think it will still be around.

If you don't fancy a gas install then plenty use a diesel heater/water-heater/cooker, so that might be the way forward. For me, Electric only is OK in the height of summer, for the rest of the year, if I was without gas, I'd need a hook up and I'd rather not.

 

[autorouter]

I think you will get between 100Ah and 150Ah per day from your solar in reasonable summer weather, and the fridge will probably consume about 40Ah per day. So depending on your other consumption you should be OK. I don't know what you would get from the alternator if it has a split charge relay, you'd have to measure it, I think. A 30A B2B would put in 45Ah in 1.5 hours, enough to run the fridge. And a 60A B2B would take half of that time.

I have a 70A B2B with 600Ah of lithium, and usually don't drive more than an hour or so each day between stops for the night. That's not really enough, so we either look for an aire with hookup or charge from an EV charger. The EV charger can put in 140Ah per hour, so the battery goes up by about 25% per hour. We either just charge for an hour while stopping for a break, or if it's an interesting place leave it charging for longer while looking around.

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[donkey]

I think you will get between 100Ah and 150Ah per day from your solar in reasonable summer weather, and the fridge will probably consume about 40Ah per day. So depending on your other consumption you should be OK. I don't know what you would get from the alternator if it has a split charge relay, you'd have to measure it, I think. A 30A B2B would put in 45Ah in 1.5 hours, enough to run the fridge. And a 60A B2B would take half of that time.

I have a 70A B2B with 600Ah of lithium, and usually don't drive more than an hour or so each day between stops for the night. That's not really enough, so we either look for an aire with hookup or charge from an EV charger. The EV charger can put in 140Ah per hour, so the battery goes up by about 25% per hour. We either just charge for an hour while stopping for a break, or if it's an interesting place leave it charging for longer while looking around.

Just out of interest Did you have to make up your own EV charging lead?

Geoff

 

[pappajohn]

A lot of farm stores have LPG.
I don't mean the likes of jeremy Clarksons diddly squat farm shops, I mean agricultural farm suppliers. Local to me BATA have a pump and exchange calor bottles.
Usually a few pence more but at least you can get it.

 

[autorouter]

Just out of interest Did you have to make up your own EV charging lead?

Not exactly. The lead is a standard off-the-shelf 10m Type 2 lead. I added a Type 2 socket next to the EHU inlet, with a changeover switch inside. Also I had to add a couple of resistors and a switch to manually give the EV charging point the info to decide how much charge was required. It's quite easy but not a straight wiring job like an EHU inlet.

A Type 2 'EV Charger' isn't actually a charger at all, it's just a mains supply. You have a choice of 16A, 32A or 32A 3-phase. If you choose the 16A single phase that's just the same as an EHU hookup post. The charger in my inverter/charger can only take 1750W, so it's lower than the lowest expected demand from the EV post. Because of that it's easy to work out the resistors and switch to tell it which power level to send out.

I have to plug in the cable to the EV charger and the MH inlet, then throw a switch to tell the EV post to start sending power. It locks the plugs so they can't be removed. Then if I turn the switch off, the charging stops and the plugs unlock.

 

[Raul]

You can buy a type two with digital control, that can set 6,8,10,13A with normal 13A 3pin plug, or 10,16,20,24,32A with blue commando plug. I have the later as I wanted the 32A charge option.

 

[autorouter]

You can buy a type two with digital control, that can set 6,8,10,13A with normal 13A 3pin plug, or 10,16,20,24,32A with blue commando plug. I have the later as I wanted the 32A charge option.

Do you have a link to these? I'd have considered one, but never found anything like that. Also does the second one have a 32A round blue plug? That is slightly bigger than the standard 16A version that goes in a MH hookup inlet, and wouldn't fit. However an adapter would fix it, if you kept the amps to 16A or lower.

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[Raul]

Here is one nice example of the 13A 3 pin with ability to go down to 6A.

Portable EV Charging Cable Type 2UK Plug 3 Pin Electric Vehicle Car Charger 26ft | eBay

Length 8m(26ft). Don't drop the EV charging box or place a heavy object on it. Don't step on, fold or knot the cable. Electric car charging cable Type 2 to UK 3PIN. 5m is not too long. Perfect for reaching for the charging port when the charging port is removed from the charging station.

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[Raul]

This is the one I have, with the larger 32A plug. I got a switched socket from Toolstation mounted on the wall, and it’s working very nice. Tested to about 6.6kw single phase, fed of two 5kva victron inverters in parallel. I’m off grid.

Chargile Portable EV Charger 32 A Fast Type 2 Commando Plug 7.4 kW 240V | eBay

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You can make up a adapter from 32A plug to 16A plug/socket. They are considerably different in size.

 

[autorouter]

Here is one nice example of the 13A 3 pin with ability to go down to 6A.

Portable EV Charging Cable Type 2UK Plug 3 Pin Electric Vehicle Car Charger 26ft | eBay

Length 8m(26ft). Don't drop the EV charging box or place a heavy object on it. Don't step on, fold or knot the cable. Electric car charging cable Type 2 to UK 3PIN. 5m is not too long. Perfect for reaching for the charging port when the charging port is removed from the charging station.

www.ebay.co.uk

That's the wrong way round for me. I wanted something that can plug into an EV charging point with a Type 2 connection, and plug into the motorhome with a suitable connector, preferably a 16A round blue plug for example, to go into the MH hookup inlet. This one plugs into a standard wall outlet (13A socket) and can plug into the connector on an EV to charge it.

The 32A one is the wrong way round for me as well.

 

[Silver-Fox]

nearly forgot to say, we cook on a diesel hob

What make is that?

Didn’t even know they made them.

 

[Raul]

That's the wrong way round for me. I wanted something that can plug into an EV charging point with a Type 2 connection, and plug into the motorhome with a suitable connector, preferably a 16A round blue plug for example, to go into the MH hookup inlet. This one plugs into a standard wall outlet (13A socket) and can plug into the connector on an EV to charge it.

The 32A one is the wrong way round for me as well.

Sure, I understood now, you can get type two plugs, cut the existing and swap it.

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[MisterB]

What make is that?

Didn’t even know they made them.

They are used on boats quite a lot ..

 

[Silver-Fox]

They are used on boats quite a lot ..

Wow the things you learn.

At some point my Daughter wants me to do a van conversion to go cycling, probably a VW Crafter.

Worth remembering about a diesel hob.

Thanks

 

[enark]

I understand LPG is planned to be replaced by a biofuel, which will be an exact like for like replacement. This is to ensure that all present LPG users have a viable replacement.

regarding batteries, and battery replacements, presently insurance companies are getting a little twitchy over fires started by battery charging, mainly on scooters or e-bikes, but it’s possibly a wise suggestion to just run any battery modifications past your insurers first?

 

[autorouter]

you can get type two plugs, cut the existing and swap it.

Unfortunately that doesn't work. A control box is needed. The box in the middle of that cable is pretending to be an EV wall charger. I need a box that is pretending to be a charger inside an electric vehicle.

 

[Reevsie]

One thing I have noticed since installing my Lithium batteries is that the batteries can take a charge quicker and more of it from the same solar. It's like having more solar than you used to have.

Last year I had the same set up of solar set up of 720 watts on my Motorhome with 540 amps of wet batteries. The most solar I ever got in a day was 1.8 kWh on a sunny day.

This year with the same solar set up but I now have 640 amps of Lithium I have had over 3kwh of power, and I regularly get over 2.5 kWh per day.

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[Otter Spotter]

What make is that?

Didn’t even know they made them.

Wallas XC Duo - Combined Hob & Heater - 1 Amazing Kit - Kuranda UK Ltd

The WALLAS XC Duo is a simple cooking and heating solution, designed for campervan use. This single appliance provides a ceramic cooking hob & efficient heater

www.kuranda.co.uk

used in many narrow boats and VW campers and heats our 6m PVC. It uses very little electric to start up and very low amounts of diesel.
We love ours especially in winter when you can warm the van and cook at the same time

 

[Silver-Fox]

Wallas XC Duo - Combined Hob & Heater - 1 Amazing Kit - Kuranda UK Ltd

The WALLAS XC Duo is a simple cooking and heating solution, designed for campervan use. This single appliance provides a ceramic cooking hob & efficient heater

www.kuranda.co.uk

used in many narrow boats and VW campers and heats our 6m PVC. It uses very little electric to start up and very low amounts of diesel.
We love ours especially in winter when you can warm the van and cook at the same time

Thanks

Il note that for when the time comes

 

[wfdTamar]

I'd be trying to put on more solar (if possible), or a fold out solar panel as well and I reckon you could cut back on the battery capacity (though this depends on your time of year, location and frequency of driving). At least a 60 Amp B2B charger (they're great combined with solar).

I have a setup that includes a 110 litre mains fridge, 100Ah lithium, 30 Amp B2B, 300 watts solar. Works great in summer and a few months either side of it. I don't use it in winter, but that'd require regular driving. I could probably go 3 days between drives. That's a bit of a guess though as I don't know how little the fridge would use in colder weather. I do have high TV power use as I have a 32" mains tv and watch a lot. As the others suggest I'd be going for even a simple portable gas stove for stuff like a kettle. Or diesel. What are you going to do about van and water heating? If starting from scratch (i.e. van conversion) I'd probably go with diesel.

 

[Silver-Fox]

I do have high TV power use as I have a 32" mains tv and watch a lot.

Out of interest is there any reason you don’t run a 12v tv.

It would save on inverting up the power and the sap on the battery that causes.

 

[wfdTamar]

Ah the old myth of the power gobbling inverter/tv combo. First off the inverters I use are 88% efficient so it's not a big loss. Secondly the TV's could be more efficient being from big manufacturers. Even if they're not, the picture and sound is top class (if you get a good one). That's the primary reason and to get that standard they're not ridiculously expensive like the big brand 12 volt ones (of unknown quality). Around £500 vs £250. That's the top spec Avtex vs Panasonic 32MS490B (I got a refurb one off ebay for less than £200 and it was like new).