12v system down

[Tim and Sue]

Was changing leisure battery and mistakenly reconnected negative before positive blew both 15amp fuse between solar controller and battery together with 20amp fuse internal module fuse on ebl 99 electoblok. Changed fuses but when reconnected battery correctly fuse in ebl still blowing. No 12v power showing on control and nil if engine running. Help plse -ferry booked for Monday

 

[Lenny HB]

Are you sure you didn't cross neg & positive as just connecting the neg first won't cause any damage.
If you did cross them you have probably goosed your EBL & solar controller.

 

[Tim and Sue]

Was changing leisure battery and mistakenly reconnected negative before positive blew both 15amp fuse between solar controller and battery together with 20amp fuse internal module fuse on ebl 99 electoblok. Changed fuses but when reconnected battery correctly fuse in ebl still blowing. No 12v power showing on control and nil if engine running. Help plse -ferry booked for Monday

Thanks

I was surprised so i guess i may have done.

Output from solar seems ok. Only did basic check and was sending 13v to battery, 21.9v coming in from panel. Does that sound ok?
How to check for goosed EBL?

 

[Lenny HB]

21.9v from panel is OK, voltage on the battery depends on state of charge, if the battery is low it will probably start around 12v and as the battery charges rise to around 14.4v then drop to 13.6 - 13.8v float.

By the battery normally a 50 amp fuse and a 2 amp fuse, 50 amp is the main battery fuse, the 2amp is the voltage sense EBL won't fire up if the 2 amp is blown.

 

[Tim and Sue]

Are you sure you didn't cross neg & positive as just connecting the neg first won't cause any damage.
If you did cross them you have probably goosed your EBL & solar controller.

Thanks

I was surprised so i guess i may have done.

Output from solar seems ok. Only did basic check and was sending 13v to battery, 21.9v coming in from panel. Does that sound ok?
How to check for goosed EBL?

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[autorouter]

The 'Internes Lademodul' fuse is for the output of the mains charger that is built into the EBL. If you have accidentally reversed the polarity of the battery then that might have damaged it. If you remove the Internes Lademodul fuse, everything should still function on 12V, but the leisure battery will no longer be charged when hookup is connected. Also the starter battery won't be trickle-charged when hookup is connected.

So the first thing to check is does everything else function OK when the Internes Lademodul fuse has been removed?

 

[Tim and Sue]

In rush think did reverse polarity -plonker award to me!! Everything works with engine running but nothing on leisure battery. Control panel showing 12.75 for engine and same for leisure but 12v control only works on engine battery. Thinking new elb!!

 

[autorouter]

Have you checked the two fuses right next to the leisure battery - a big 50A fuse and a small 2A fuse? Both of those need to be OK for the EBL to function. The 50A fuse is a Maxi size blade fuse, the 2A fuse is a standard size blade fuse.

 

[autorouter]

Everything works with engine running but nothing on leisure battery. Control panel showing 12.75 for engine and same for leisure but 12v control only works on engine battery. Thinking new elb!!

I don't think it's as bad as a new EBL. You say everything works with the engine running. I think that's because the split charge relay becomes active, and connects the EBL leisure battery functions to the alternator/starter battery. The power should then be applied to the leisure battery to charge it up. However if the leisure battery main fuse (the 50A one I mentioned) has blown, the power from the alternator/starter battery won't be reaching the leisure battery to charge it up. The control panel will see the power from the starter battery, and will show it as the leisure battery voltage too, because the leisure battery is not connected (because of the blown fuse).

I think you may need to get a new charger. However a new charger should work fine if it is directly connected to the leisure battery. That should get you back on the road for your imminent trip.

It is possible to feed the new charger power into the front of the EBL. There is a 2-pin connector labelled Zusatz Ladegerat (= auxilliary charger). You could feed the new charger power into that connector. You will need to insert a fuse into the Zusatz Ladegerat slot on the front panel to allow the power to proceed to the leisure battery. A 20A fuse is the usual value.

However just connecting direct to the leisure battery will do the job, until you have more time to fix things.

 

[Tim and Sue]

I don't think it's as bad as a new EBL. You say everything works with the engine running. I think that's because the split charge relay becomes active, and connects the EBL leisure battery functions to the alternator/starter battery. The power should then be applied to the leisure battery to charge it up. However if the leisure battery main fuse (the 50A one I mentioned) has blown, the power from the alternator/starter battery won't be reaching the leisure battery to charge it up. The control panel will see the power from the starter battery, and will show it as the leisure battery voltage too, because the leisure battery is not connected (because of the blown fuse).

I think you may need to get a new charger. However a new charger should work fine if it is directly connected to the leisure battery. That should get you back on the road for your imminent trip.

It is possible to feed the new charger power into the front of the EBL. There is a 2-pin connector labelled Zusatz Ladegerat (= auxilliary charger). You could feed the new charger power into that connector. You will need to insert a fuse into the Zusatz Ladegerat slot on the front panel to allow the power to proceed to the leisure battery. A 20A fuse is the usual value.

However just connecting direct to the leisure battery will do the job, until you have more time to fix things.

Thanks.

I did check 50amp and 2amp fuse originally and were ok. Will check again as various permutations may have blown it.

When 12v switch on control panel is pressed can hear clicking (relay?) behind lademodule fuse. 12v does not come on but clicks again when press off switch.

Is there anything inside that could have tripped and be reset? Is that what reversing polarity may have damaged?

With regard to new charger connected direct to leisure battery i would be grateful of some advice as to what may be suitable. Also dont really understand how this gets 12 v system working. Not thinking too straight - already managed to connect battery up wrong.

On a positive note maybe there are prizes for weekly/monthly idiot. - New brain!!!

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[Tim and Sue]

I don't think it's as bad as a new EBL. You say everything works with the engine running. I think that's because the split charge relay becomes active, and connects the EBL leisure battery functions to the alternator/starter battery. The power should then be applied to the leisure battery to charge it up. However if the leisure battery main fuse (the 50A one I mentioned) has blown, the power from the alternator/starter battery won't be reaching the leisure battery to charge it up. The control panel will see the power from the starter battery, and will show it as the leisure battery voltage too, because the leisure battery is not connected (because of the blown fuse).

I think you may need to get a new charger. However a new charger should work fine if it is directly connected to the leisure battery. That should get you back on the road for your imminent trip.

It is possible to feed the new charger power into the front of the EBL. There is a 2-pin connector labelled Zusatz Ladegerat (= auxilliary charger). You could feed the new charger power into that connector. You will need to insert a fuse into the Zusatz Ladegerat slot on the front panel to allow the power to proceed to the leisure battery. A 20A fuse is the usual value.

However just connecting direct to the leisure battery will do the job, until you have more time to fix things.

Just to add we have a vanbitz battery master fitted. There are no leds on at present. Kinda thought there should be but guessing there is only feed from starter battery atm. Wired into solar regulator block. Not sure how to check whether working or not?

 

[autorouter]

You are right in that the new charger won't get the system working again, it will just charge the leisure battery as before. There seems to be no power going from the leisure battery to the EBL. However when the engine is running, the alternator/starter battery provides the power to the EBL internals. So the EBL internal wiring must be more or less intact.

The path from the leisure battery to the EBL goes through that 50A fuse near the leisure battery, and comes in at the back of the EBL on one of three big terminals in a terminal block. So, is it possible to access those terminals to check? And have you got a multimeter to check with? Are you OK using a multimeter to measure voltage?

 

[Tim and Sue]

You are right in that the new charger won't get the system working again, it will just charge the leisure battery as before. There seems to be no power going from the leisure battery to the EBL. However when the engine is running, the alternator/starter battery provides the power to the EBL internals. So the EBL internal wiring must be more or less intact.

The path from the leisure battery to the EBL goes through that 50A fuse near the leisure battery, and comes in at the back of the EBL on one of three big terminals in a terminal block. So, is it possible to access those terminals to check? And have you got a multimeter to check with? Are you OK using a multimeter to measure voltage?

Ok we have a victron mppt controller charging the leisure battery. This seems to be working ok. I checked earlier and the voltage coming from panel was 21.9. I also checked output terminals albeit with them still connected to battery and was reading 13v so not sure whether that was output voltage or battery voltage. Think will disconnect and check.

Thre terminals are ok to check so will do tomorrow.

Thanks for the assist

 

[autorouter]

I also checked output terminals albeit with them still connected to battery and was reading 13v so not sure whether that was output voltage or battery voltage. Think will disconnect and check.

Can you check the voltage on the actual battery terminals, positive and negative. That is the only place you can say for sure is the battery voltage. Then check other places like the solar controller output terminal, and the terminals at the back of the EBL. You want to know if the voltages are exactly the same - or if not, how different.

At the back of the EBL, SB = Starter Battery positive, probably red. WB = Leisure Battery positive, probably black. The common negative is probably brown.

You could also insert a fuse into the Zusatz Ladegerat slot on the EBL, and measure the voltage at the 2-pin connector labelled Zusatz Ladegerat. It should be the same as the leisure battery voltage. That will tell you if the leisure battery power is reaching the internal EBL wiring.

 

[Tim and Sue]

Can you check the voltage on the actual battery terminals, positive and negative. That is the only place you can say for sure is the battery voltage. Then check other places like the solar controller output terminal, and the terminals at the back of the EBL. You want to know if the voltages are exactly the same - or if not, how different.

At the back of the EBL, SB = Starter Battery positive, probably red. WB = Leisure Battery positive, probably black. The common negative is probably brown.

You could also insert a fuse into the Zusatz Ladegerat slot on the EBL, and measure the voltage at the 2-pin connector labelled Zusatz Ladegerat. It should be the same as the leisure battery voltage. That will tell you if the leisure battery power is reaching the internal EBL wiring.

Quick update. Checked 50amp fuse again and your diagnosis was spot on-Blown.
Bit of a game finding a spare as didnt have a 50amp with us. Thank you Halfords.

Fitted and now power to EBL from leisure battery and 12v switches on from panel.
Pretty much everythimg seems to be working with the exception of radio/sat nav. Will have a look at that later as we are now hitting the road to Dover.

Thank you so much for your knowledge and advice which has been so helpful and saved me a great deal of time and grief.

Marching on, fingers crossed.

Thanks again

Tim

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[LithiumConvert]

Pretty much everything [now] seems to be working.

Thank you for letting us all know.

 

[Burge]

Glad your sorted ....Top Marks to autorouter, Brilliant advice Happy Holibobs