12 volt issues

[Jules65]

Hi, we have a bailey autograph 2018 motorhome. When plugged into EHU the 12 volt system should work through the mains but it is draining the starter battery.
Message comes up on tv saying powering down due to low voltage, by this stage the starter battery is flat and we have to jump start it.
If left the lights go out and nothing 12 volt will work yet the leisure batteries are fully charged.
We have new leisure batteries and a new starter battery. If not plugged into EHU 12 volt system seems to run from leisure batteries ok.
I have checked the leisure batteries are charging on the seattle panel and it seems to be working as voltage shows an increase.
Rang bailey and there advice is to fit an inverter! Please has anyone else had this problem and what is the cure, took it to the dealers and was told they had no idea.

 

[BikerGraham]

Try checking the main control panel settings.

It can also be set to charge the engine battery when on EHU.

This may overcome the problem. Although it doesn’t solve why the van is taking from the engine battery instead of the liesure

 

[U.Toadifact]

I have a similar issue on occasion when the habitation load is automatically changed to the starter battery despite the hab battery being fully charged. I have a Sargent EC600 control unit.

 

[autorouter]

It certainly sounds like you have a problem. Is this a new problem, suddenly developing after running OK for a long time? Or is the MH new to you, and it's always been like this?

In this situation you really have to take voltage readings at the actual battery terminals, with a multimeter. If there's a fault, the display could well be misleading. Do you have a meter, and do you know how to take a voltage reading?

 

[Jules65]

It certainly sounds like you have a problem. Is this a new problem, suddenly developing after running OK for a long time? Or is the MH new to you, and it's always been like this?

In this situation you really have to take voltage readings at the actual battery terminals, with a multimeter. If there's a fault, the display could well be misleading. Do you have a meter, and do you know how to take a voltage reading?

Yes a new problem. Yes I have a multi meter & I will check the batteries. Thanks

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[GeoffnDee]

When you rang Bailey are you sure they recommended fitting an inverter and not a new power distribution unit (PDU) ?
Also it could be worth getting in touch with www.bcagroup.co.uk (01422 376977 ) who supply BCA Electrical power systems fitted in Baileys and may have seen this type of problem before , if you talk to the technical help department they have .

 

[Jules65]

When you rang Bailey are you sure they recommended fitting an inverter and not a new power distribution unit (PDU) ?
Also it could be worth getting in touch with www.bcagroup.co.uk (01422 376977 ) who supply BCA Electrical power systems fitted in Baileys and may have seen this type of problem before , if you talk to the technical help department they have .

Thanks for the advice. I rang the number you supplied, but they wouldn't speak to me, they will only talk to a dealer. I have since heard from someone else who had the same problem, and his was the charger unit. That's my next step.

 

[GeoffnDee]

Sorry that BCA would not help, I was not aware that they will not help with questions from the public. Hopefully if the problem is the charger it can be sorted out ok and it would be useful if you could please report back here for future reference.

 

[Jules65]

Hi, update on our fault is that the charger checked out ok, charging at 13.8 volts on EHU.
We now think it could be a fault in the Printed Circuit Board which is not switching on the leisure 12 volt supply (could be a faulty relay) . Spoke to a firm called Apuljack Engineering and they are going to ring me back when they have spoken to the technical man, to tell me if this would cause the problem. I cannot see it being anything else? Bailey were not helpfull at all, only informing me that we had not swapped the warranty from the previous owner within three months and structural warranty is now void! Also they told me to ring WB Nord who make the loom etc for bailey, they will not speak to the public only to say take it to a dealer. So the saga continues, watch this space for the resolution.

 

[VXman]

I may be confused by your explanation/terminology but...

The 12 Volt system (interior lights, Water pump, control system for fridge, USB sockets and maybe some stuff I've missed) will always run off the leisure battery - the 240V EHU when plugged in charges the battery and also supplies 240V to the 240V sockets.

If the Leisure battery is not running down and a the 12 V stuff is not working it sounds as though its not coming off the leisure. If the starter battery is going flat despite no use then it sounds as though it is not being charged and something is draining it.

Certainly sound a odd problem and possibly due to some malfunction of the electrical control unit.

Interesting that you say you have new leisure and new starter batteries - did the fault start immediately after they were fitted or was it ok for a while first? i.e. could there be a connection here?

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[autorouter]

The 12 Volt system (interior lights, Water pump, control system for fridge, USB sockets and maybe some stuff I've missed) will always run off the leisure battery -

On British MHs the 12V system cuts off when the engine starts. The relay that does the cutting off could be faulty, intermittent or stuck open. Or it could be another fault that keeps the relay in the cut-off state and causes other problems. Some British MHs have a switch to run the 12 Volt system from the starter battery if the user chooses to, perhaps in an emergency. That switch could be faulty. There are all kinds of possibilities. If the distribution/fusebox checks out OK, it could be the wiring.

 

[bigtwin]

You won’t go wrong if you’re in contact with Apuljack.

Ian

 

[Jules65]

This at the moment is speculation, until i have a diagnosis from Apuljack we do not know why it is running from the starter battery.
The reason we fitted new batteries was because we thought the problem lay there but it does not.

 

[Insider]

Just to revisit some of the posts. In my van I have a Sargent unit(don't know what your Bailey uses) and can select either the leisure battery or the van battery as the source of power. If you have a 2018 van then the van battery could be 5 years and counting, not in great shape. You may even have been doing this for quite a while and thus reducing the normal capacity of the van battery. Thus if you were using van battery and the charging profile on the control block was to prioritise the leisure battery you could similar symtons perhaps. You may have 2 issues inplay here but I would absolutely check that your 12V power source is correctly selected if possible. What's your system in the Bailey - Sargent, Electroblock?

 

[Jules65]

Update, i have tested the charger which is a PS306-6A-BC. out of the charger comes two plugs, one with a yellow and white wire and one with a black and red wire. The yellow and white wire have power when connected to 240 volt and charge the leisure batteries.
The other plug with a red and black wire have no power coming out, this is i believe what runs the 12 volt system. I have taken the charger to a firm who say they can repair it and when i get it back i will fit it and keep my fingers crossed that this is the problem.

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[Jules65]

You won’t go wrong if you’re in contact with Apuljack.

Ian

I disagree, three phone calls and still no answer from them.

 

[Jules65]

Just to revisit some of the posts. In my van I have a Sargent unit(don't know what your Bailey uses) and can select either the leisure battery or the van battery as the source of power. If you have a 2018 van then the van battery could be 5 years and counting, not in great shape. You may even have been doing this for quite a while and thus reducing the normal capacity of the van battery. Thus if you were using van battery and the charging profile on the control block was to prioritise the leisure battery you could similar symtons perhaps. You may have 2 issues inplay here but I would absolutely check that your 12V power source is correctly selected if possible. What's your system in the Bailey - Sargent, Electroblock?

I have as stated in the first post changed all the batteries. The source is selected correctly. See update below.

 

[bigtwin]

.

 

[bigtwin]

See update below.

Have you still to post the update that you said was posted below, or have you started a new post?

Ian

Edit: Ahh, you posted it above the post where you said it was below, in post #15!

 

[Jules65]

Update on our problem. I have fitted a new PCB and the only difference it has made is that when on EHU a message reads engine running!
which it is not. So back to square one i am afraid, unless someone has an answer to our problem ?. It now looks like the problem stems from the vehicle side rather than the hab side.

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[Ingwe]

Hi, update on our fault is that the charger checked out ok, charging at 13.8 volts on EHU.
We now think it could be a fault in the Printed Circuit Board which is not switching on the leisure 12 volt supply (could be a faulty relay) . Spoke to a firm called Apuljack Engineering and they are going to ring me back when they have spoken to the technical man, to tell me if this would cause the problem. I cannot see it being anything else? Bailey were not helpfull at all, only informing me that we had not swapped the warranty from the previous owner within three months and structural warranty is now void! Also they told me to ring WB Nord who make the loom etc for bailey, they will not speak to the public only to say take it to a dealer. So the saga continues, watch this space for the resolution.

What an appalling approach to customer care adopted by Bailey. We are happy with our second hand Bailey and luckily never had to contact Bailey.
SWMBO corrects me. I contacted Bailey when our hab door wouldn’t lock on central locking. The dealer said new lock activator required. Said he’d ordered it from Bailey. After 6 weeks of not coming I contacted Bailey. They said that the part could take 3-6 months to arrive. Told dealer and Bailey to stuff it. Missing, unavailable part costing over £100, was available on ebay for £13 inc postage.
Transpired it wasn’t the actuator but a broken wire. Fixed now with cost of parts 20p (insulated connector).

 

[GeoffnDee]

Not sure if it is any help but There is a diagram for the BCA fuse/relays which although for a Elddis Motorhome seems very similar to the BCA/ Bailey ones. It is on page one of Resources , Manuals for Motorhome Stuff section and the wiring shown for the relay grounds could be worth looking at.

 

[Jules65]

FINAL REPAIR. So after hours of head scratching and parts changing it turns out it was the BCA 3 Stage charger unit that was not supplying 13 volts to the habitation side. Job fixed and we are so relieved we have it sorted. We fell out of love with motorhoming and we have learned that the business is not backed up by any decent engineers or repair shops within an acceptable time frame. My thanks to Caraquip, https://caraquip.co.uk/ for a great service for parts and technical help.

 

[Marty Gilly and Pup]

Just read this thread. I could have supplied an almost new BCA charger unit, as I removed one to install a lithium profile charger from Apuljack. It’s sitting under the french bed, waiting for a good home. Shame.

 

[Jules65]

'c'est la vie' Such is life. I am sure that someone will have the same fault somewhere along the line. I will inform them of your spare charger unit. Thanks everyone.